. There is a heuristic (hack?) to use the first occurance as the title for the results page. A better solution than expecting customers to know XPath, then trying to teach them over the phone. Our house style is to err on the side of simplicity and ease of use, because it almost impossible to remove features, even if they confuse almost everyone and benefit almost no one. I actually spent more time making sure that sentences were extracted properly from things like this (with multiple mappings possible): <title>The <hi type="italic">Ghastly</hi> Happenings at <event><trademark>Infoseek</trademark>'s Halloween Party</event>

From david-b at pacbell.net Fri Oct 1 06:32:06 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:49 2004 Subject: DOM Level 2 implementation/Java Message-ID: <37F43916.C9141142@pacbell.net> The DOM Level 2 discussions are getting closer to becoming a REC from W3C ... the current spec is a "last call" before it goes to "Proposed RECcomendation" status. So, now's a particularly good time to start playing with it. If you're interested, jump to: http://home.pacbell.net/david-b/xml/ There, you'll find a new DOM implementation that's got the updates to the core APIs, notably namespace support and some new factory methods hanging off the implementation class. Probably a lot more fun for developers will be the fact that it's got basic support for the "Event" APIs. This includes having the DOM generate "MutationEvent" messages that your listeners can work with, and a simple user event extension. On top of that, there's a new stateful iterator. And if you grab that whole package, you get (free!! limited time bonus!!) complete javadoc for all the W3C interfaces; no, that's not really a conspiracy to sell bandwidth (it makes this an 820K download, most of which is javadoc). Also, simple examples!! For the bandwidth-starved, I also stuck the whole thing up on this website; no promises it'll be there a long time: ftp://www.brownell.org/pub/xml/dom2/index.html The javadoc is browsable from there. - Dave p.s. there's lots of DOM L2 that's not implemented here... the HTML and CSS support, ranges and views, and gooey events. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tsuzu at flab.fujitsu.co.jp Fri Oct 1 10:32:25 1999 From: tsuzu at flab.fujitsu.co.jp (Toshimitsu Suzuki) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:49 2004 Subject: A question of SAX specification Message-ID: <4.1-J.19991001170214.013e8590@pop.akashi.flab.fujitsu.co.jp> Hi, I have a question the behavier of getColumnNumber in Locator. I want to get the end position of some xml fragment(ie.content) in startElement(). But, one SAX parser replies the end tag's ">", another SAX parser replies "c". Which is correct? Regreds, --- Toshimitsu Suzuki, tsuzu@flab.fujitsu.co.jp Information Service Architecture Lab. Personal System Labs. Fujitsu Laboratories Tel:+81-78-934-8249 Fax:+81-78-934-3312 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david.lindholm at appeal.se Fri Oct 1 11:19:09 1999 From: david.lindholm at appeal.se (David Lindholm) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:49 2004 Subject: XML and databases Message-ID: <37F47E8E.A9EF1DA7@appeal.se> Hi! Suppose I want to read a field in a SQL-database from my XML document, for example: [some code to get a name from my database] How should I do? Could someone give an example? Thanks in advance! -- /David Lindholm Appeal Software Solutions, Stockholm, Sweden xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Fri Oct 1 15:24:57 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:49 2004 Subject: A question of SAX specification In-Reply-To: Toshimitsu Suzuki's message of "Fri, 01 Oct 1999 17:32:49 +0900" References: <4.1-J.19991001170214.013e8590@pop.akashi.flab.fujitsu.co.jp> Message-ID: Toshimitsu Suzuki writes: > I have a question the behavier of getColumnNumber in Locator. I > want to get the end position of some xml > fragment(ie.content) in startElement(). But, one > SAX parser replies the end tag's ">", another SAX parser replies > "c". Which is correct? The idea of Locator was simply to help get a user close to an error in a document: exactly how it works is deliberately unspecified, mainly to keep life easy for parser writers (since different parsers use different tokenization and look-ahead schemes). Locator is not designed to let you extract text strings from the original document. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From krebs at uni-koblenz.de Fri Oct 1 16:50:58 1999 From: krebs at uni-koblenz.de (Friedhelm Krebs) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:49 2004 Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <37F4CA4C.71CF2632@uni-koblenz.de> unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Fri Oct 1 17:17:18 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: A question of SAX specification In-Reply-To: from "David Megginson" at Oct 1, 99 09:23:23 am Message-ID: <199910011556.LAA05551@locke.ccil.org> David Megginson scripsit: > > Toshimitsu Suzuki writes: > > > I have a question the behavier of getColumnNumber in Locator. I > > want to get the end position of some xml > > fragment(ie.content) in startElement(). But, one > > SAX parser replies the end tag's ">", another SAX parser replies > > "c". Which is correct? > > The idea of Locator was simply to help get a user close to an error in > a document: exactly how it works is deliberately unspecified, mainly > to keep life easy for parser writers (since different parsers use > different tokenization and look-ahead schemes). Locator is not > designed to let you extract text strings from the original document. Yes, but it would have been nice to define whether the first column in each line is column 1 or column 0, which is obviously the problem above. Ditto with line 1 or line 0. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 1 17:53:58 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: XML and databases References: <37F47E8E.A9EF1DA7@appeal.se> Message-ID: <008501bf0c25$ba4aa2c0$4aed1990@us.oracle.com> Check out the Oracle XSQL Servlet at http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml for some examples, demos, and software on how this can be made simple. SQL + XML + XSLT = Cool :-) ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: David Lindholm To: xml-dev Sent: Friday, October 01, 1999 2:27 AM Subject: XML and databases | Hi! | | Suppose I want to read a field in a SQL-database from my XML document, | for example: | | | [some code to get a name from my database] | | | How should I do? Could someone give an example? | | | Thanks in advance! | -- | /David Lindholm | Appeal Software Solutions, Stockholm, Sweden | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Patrice.Bonhomme at loria.fr Fri Oct 1 19:11:46 1999 From: Patrice.Bonhomme at loria.fr (Patrice Bonhomme) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: PSGML/XML + XEmacs + Windows = PB Message-ID: <199910011711.TAA03641@chimay.loria.fr> Hi, Not sure that this is the right list to expose my problem, but anyway... I am trying to setup an environment on a Windows NT machine for editing SGML/XML document using the psgml/xml mode and i am getting into trouble with XEmacs. I am using: Windows/NT 4.0 XEmacs 21.1 psgml-1.1.6 The problem seems to come from a transient-mark-mode variable. XEmacs/psgml compile the DTD but i can not insert any element using either the contextual menu or the Modify menu entry. Any help ? Thanks Pat. -- ============================================================== bonhomme@loria.fr Tel : 03 83 59 30 52 / 06 11 34 03 85 http://www.loria.fr/~bonhomme Office : B.228 -------------------------------------------------------------- * Serveur Silfide : http://www.loria.fr/projets/Silfide ============================================================== xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Fri Oct 1 19:23:25 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: A question of SAX specification In-Reply-To: John Cowan's message of "Fri, 1 Oct 1999 11:56:26 -0400 (EDT)" References: <199910011556.LAA05551@locke.ccil.org> Message-ID: John Cowan writes: > > The idea of Locator was simply to help get a user close to an error in > > a document: exactly how it works is deliberately unspecified, mainly > > to keep life easy for parser writers (since different parsers use > > different tokenization and look-ahead schemes). Locator is not > > designed to let you extract text strings from the original document. > > Yes, but it would have been nice to define whether the first column > in each line is column 1 or column 0, which is obviously the problem > above. Ditto with line 1 or line 0. See the JavaDoc documentation for the Locator interface: "The first column in a line is position 1": http://www.megginson.com/SAX/javadoc/org.xml.sax.Locator.html#getColumnNumber() (Granted, it doesn't say the same about the first line, but I've never heard of zero-based line numbering). That might not be the problem here in any case. One parser is returning the position of the last character in the start tag, while the other is returning the position of the first character past the end of the start tag -- both are OK (as would be the first character of the start tag), because they're close enough to bring a human reader to the right general vicinity in the source document. Remember that a major goal of SAX 1.0 was to impose as little as possible on the programmer: we didn't want to force programmers to track a lot of extra information if they didn't want to. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Fri Oct 1 19:46:44 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: Announcement of an I-D In-Reply-To: <199910011640.MAA30224@hesketh.net> from "Simon St.Laurent" at Oct 1, 99 12:43:40 pm Message-ID: <199910011825.OAA11847@locke.ccil.org> Simon St.Laurent scripsit: > I think we've got a fundamental disconnect here. Generic XML software (say > a directory system or something making a reference) isn't going to care > whether a given XML document is SVG or CGM or whatever. All it necessarily > knows is that the target document is XML. Why should it know anything > about SVG or CGM's fragment identifiers? Why should it even know that the target is XML? After all, CGM is *not* XML, nor even textual! Processing links requires understanding what the format of the link target is, and only when you know that do you know what a fragment identifier means. If OTOH you don't undertsand the format, you need to pass off to someone who does. This is commonplace nowadays with graphics formats, which are handled by external applications. All that's needed is a platform-standard way of passing the fragment id to the external application (or plug-in, same thing from 20,000 feet). -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Lilly_Obina at hc-sc.gc.ca Fri Oct 1 22:47:06 1999 From: Lilly_Obina at hc-sc.gc.ca (Lilly_Obina@hc-sc.gc.ca) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:50 2004 Subject: No subject Message-ID: <852567FD.0071C090.00@smta00.hc-sc.gc.ca> unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dwshin at nlm.nih.gov Fri Oct 1 22:44:02 1999 From: dwshin at nlm.nih.gov (Dongwook Shin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: XRS: A new XML search engine Message-ID: <37F519A3.21923FE4@nlm.nih.gov> Hello, folks: I am pleased to announce my XML indexing and retrieval engine named XRS to you. XRS is the most recent result among those which I have been developing in SGML/XML framework for a couple of years. Highlights of XRS are: (1) A very flexible retrieval capability: - any elements in DTD can be retrieved - You can give the weights to elements according to the importance you consider in retrieval - With easy query building tool, you can create a structured query quickly. (2) Efficient indexing and retrieval - With BUS technique I devised, indexing overhead is minimized with preserving quick retrieval time. (3) With a servlet and multi-thread safe native C library, the overhead in server side is reduced. - It is not CGI! (4) XML source is transformed to HTML and sent to your browser. - With a browser without XML capability, you can still see the XML results. If you have an interest, you can see more in the following Web page: http://dlb2.nlm.nih.gov/~dwshin/xrs.html Thanks, Dongwook -- Dongwook Shin Visiting Scholar Lister Hill National Center for Biomedical Communications National Library of Medicine, 8600 Rockville Pike Bethesda 20894, MD E-mail: dwshin@nlm.nih.gov Tel: (301) 435-3257 FAX: (301) 480-3035 URL: http://dlb2.nlm.nih.gov/~dwshin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Sat Oct 2 04:31:04 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: Packaging and related-resource discovery References: <3.0.32.19990927133504.00c5e3b0@pop.intergate.bc.ca> Message-ID: <37F56D79.3182@hiwaay.net> Tim Bray wrote: > > I (and I think some other people) are becoming increasingly convinced > that the need for some sort of an "XML Packaging" facility is becoming > increasingly urgent. I was asked to write up a motivating statement for > the XML Plenary meeting that is happening this Wednesday. I thought that > the xml-deviants might also find it of interest. > > It's at http://www.textuality.com/xml/why-pkg.html -Tim I agree. For all the reasons you gave which are... reasonable. Historical aside: That would get us almost back to the level of SGML when the CALS fellows worked out the 9600 tape formats for packaging documents and Charles was working on the *strange name that was the box japanese meals came in* standard. But: "Graphics In raster (PNG, GIF, JPG) and vector (SVG, VML, PGML) formats. " Include X3D. Coming along nicely now. Sure do want to see real time 3D animations of the deep namespaces. len xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jess_nemis at inod.com Sat Oct 2 05:24:39 1999 From: jess_nemis at inod.com (jess_nemis@inod.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <9910019388.AA938834497@atrain.inod.com> unsubscribe _____________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: unsubscribe Author: Friedhelm Krebs at INTERNET Date: 10/1/99 4:50 PM unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981 2-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From shriradh at hotmail.com Sun Oct 3 09:06:38 1999 From: shriradh at hotmail.com (xml guru) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: XML and SAP Message-ID: <19991003070603.19473.qmail@hotmail.com> I heard that SAP is going very big on XML for B-2-B E-commerce. Can someone suggest any good site (other than SAP's own which I have already looked at) where I can find more info on their Business Connector technology. Thanks ! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jlapp at webmethods.com Sun Oct 3 15:41:10 1999 From: jlapp at webmethods.com (Joe Lapp) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: XML and SAP In-Reply-To: <19991003070603.19473.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: <199910031340.GAA11781@hawk.prod.itd.earthlink.net> mySAP.com and the SAP Business Connector are both solutions that build on the webMethods B2B platform. SAP has taken the B2B technology and applied it to satisfy their particular requirements and vision. Information about Business Connector and mySAP.com: http://www.sap.com/products/techno/index.htm Relevant webMethods press releases: http://www.webmethods.com/news/pr/1999/050399_sap.html http://www.webmethods.com/news/pr/1999/091499_sap.html http://www.webmethods.com/news/pr/1999/092099_portals-partners.html At 03:06 PM 10/3/1999 +0000, xml guru wrote: >I heard that SAP is going very big on XML for B-2-B E-commerce. > >Can someone suggest any good site (other than SAP's own which I have already >looked at) where I can find more info on their Business Connector >technology. > >Thanks ! -- Joe Lapp (Looking for some good people to help design Senior Engineer and build the Internet's business-to-business webMethods, Inc. XML infrastructure. We are 100% Java.) jlapp@webMethods.com http://www.webMethods.com/company/employment xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abrahams at valinet.com Mon Oct 4 04:18:51 1999 From: abrahams at valinet.com (Paul W. Abrahams) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: Making the digest digestible Message-ID: <37F80F94.4D38899D@valinet.com> There are a couple of things that could be done to make the digests of XMLDEV more digestible that require little or no human intervention, just (I assume) different software choices: 1. Each digest could be preceded by a list of topics. Since this is done in the XSL digest, there ought to be people around here who know the correct incantations. 2. Each message could be in the form of an attachment, which would make it easier to see where the message boundaries are. Although the XSL digest doesn't do this, some other digests such as those associated with the forums for the KDE user interface for Linux do it. Again, I'm pretty sure it's all automated. Paul Abrahams xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Patrice.Bonhomme at loria.fr Mon Oct 4 11:18:08 1999 From: Patrice.Bonhomme at loria.fr (Patrice Bonhomme) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: XML/XSL Demo ? Message-ID: <199910040918.LAA07693@chimay.loria.fr> Hi, I have been asked to do a presentation of XML. I have the materials for the presentation but i would like to do an impressive demonstration. So, i am looking for a demonstration that shows the advantages for using XML/XSL: - at client side and/or server side - XLink/XPointer within XML - Stylesheet in XSL Any pointers ? Thanks, Pat. -- ============================================================== bonhomme@loria.fr Tel : 03 83 59 30 52 / 06 11 34 03 85 http://www.loria.fr/~bonhomme Office : B.228 -------------------------------------------------------------- * Serveur Silfide : http://www.loria.fr/projets/Silfide ============================================================== xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From h.rzepa at ic.ac.uk Mon Oct 4 14:21:43 1999 From: h.rzepa at ic.ac.uk (Rzepa, Henry) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: LISTADMIN: Apolgies for lost APPROVE requests Message-ID: Last week my primary drive went AWOL, taking with it about 1 weeks worth of list subscribe/unsubscribe moderation requests for which I had no backup. Could I ask anyone who has such an outstanding request to please send it again. Apologies for the inconvenience. I hasten to add this is only for people who wish to use a different email address for the approve request than the one they wish to use for the list itself. Dr Henry Rzepa. +44 171 594 5774. Fax 594 5804. http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/rzepa/ Dept. Chemistry, Imperial college, London, SW7 2AY, UK. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From louise.lahiff at oceanfree.net Mon Oct 4 16:42:55 1999 From: louise.lahiff at oceanfree.net (louise.lahiff@oceanfree.net) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: Writing an XML online help Message-ID: <19991004144225.18093.cpmta@c006.sfo.cp.net> Hi, I am writing an XML online help as part of my final year project. Up to now I haven't written any XML. Will I be capable of doing this or is it very very difficult? Anyone know of any webpages that will give practical applications of how to write this kind of XML? Thanks, Louise xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From andrewl at microsoft.com Mon Oct 4 20:14:35 1999 From: andrewl at microsoft.com (Andrew Layman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: Writing an XML online help Message-ID: <5BF896CAFE8DD111812400805F1991F712E173E1@RED-MSG-08> What is "an XML online help"? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From bruce.angelis at itron.com Mon Oct 4 21:46:11 1999 From: bruce.angelis at itron.com (Bruce Angelis) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: Windows CE XML parser Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991004124256.00a77de0@mailserver.itron.com> Does anyone know of an XML parser for Windows CE PPC platform? Preferably one that can be used by VBCE programs. - **************************************************** * Bruce Angelis http://www.nwsoft.com/angelis * Software Development Manager: AIB Products * Itron Inc. http://www.itron.com * Spokane, WA USA mailto:bruce.angelis@itron.com **************************************************** - xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From solrac at us.ibm.com Tue Oct 5 01:15:45 1999 From: solrac at us.ibm.com (solrac@us.ibm.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: New IBM XML resources from developerWorks Message-ID: <87256800.007FB77F.00@d53mta04h.boulder.ibm.com> Here are some of the new IBM XML resources you can find at the developerWorks XML Zone. DeveloperWorks XML Zone http://www.ibm.com/developer/xml?loc=136,t=g,p=xml001 XML and Java: A potent partnership - Final installment of his four-part series on XML and Java. http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/library/jw-09-howto/index.html?loc=136,t=g,p=xml002 Conquering XML with Xeena - A powerful XML editor that you can download and try. http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/library/xeenatech.html?loc=136,t=g,p=xml003 Tutorial: Practical transformation using XSLT and XPath - An introductory version of an extensive tutorial by G. Ken Holman. http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/education/xslt-xpath-tutorial.html?loc=136,t=g,p=xml004 Bean Markup Language: Part 1 - The ABCs of IBM's powerful JavaBeans connection language http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/library/bean-markup1?loc=136,t=g,p=xml005 developerWorks http://www.ibm.com/developer?loc=136,t=g,xml000 Frank Carlos solrac@us.ibm.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lgeorge at gmx.net Tue Oct 5 05:41:21 1999 From: lgeorge at gmx.net (Lars George) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception Message-ID: <000501bf0ee3$b34853d0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Hi, I tried to use the Sun's XML-Parser to create XML structures on the fly. I copied the code of the DOM example and tried to execute it inside a servlet. I get the following message: The servlet named invoker at the requested URL http://larsgeorge_01:8080/servlet/ParamXml reported this exception: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode. Please report this to the administrator of the web server. java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at ParamXml.doGet(ParamXml.java:23) at javax.servlet.http.HttpServlet.service(HttpServlet.java:715) at javax.servlet.http.HttpServlet.service(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ServletState.callService(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ServletManager.callServletService(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.http.servlet.InvokerServlet.service(Compiled Code) at javax.servlet.http.HttpServlet.service(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ServletState.callService(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ServletManager.callServletService(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ProcessingState.invokeTargetServlet(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.http.HttpProcessingState.execute(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.http.stages.Runner.process(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.ProcessingSupport.process(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.Service.process(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.http.HttpServiceHandler.handleRequest(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.http.HttpServiceHandler.handleRequest(Compiled Code) at com.sun.server.HandlerThread.run(Compiled Code) I get the same error message when I try this servlet with Apache and JServ. The code fails at the following code: public class ParamXml extends HttpServlet { public void doGet(HttpServletRequest req, HttpServletResponse res) throws ServletException, IOException, DOMException { res.setContentType("text/xml"); PrintWriter out = res.getWriter(); XmlDocument doc = new XmlDocument(); ElementNode root = (ElementNode) doc.createElement("root"); doc.appendChild(root); // THE NEXT LINE CAUSES THE EXCEPTION TO BE RAISED root.appendChild(doc.createElement("header")); root.appendChild(doc.createTextNode("\n some data is text\n ")); root.appendChild(doc.createElement("footer")); Please see the marked line above which causes the error. Since this does not happen in the demo application I think it is the securitymanager of the servlet engine who does not allow me to do that. My question: What do I have to do here to make it work? TIA, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Tue Oct 5 09:28:27 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: AttributeList in C++ SAX Message-ID: [I'm aware that I should have used wstring, but I'm putting off that debate for now] As someone pointed out to me on Friday: using const string& as return values is dangerous: class sax_AttributeList { public: enum AttrType { undefined, CDATA, ... }; virtual ~sax_AttributeList(); virtual int getLength() const = 0; virtual const string& getName(int i) const = 0; virtual AttrType getType(int i) const = 0; virtual const string& getValue(int i) const = 0; virtual AttrType getType(const string& name) const = 0; virtual const string& getValue(const string& name) const = 0; }; Before you know it you'll be tempted to assign the return values to local string& variables to get shorter syntax, ie. like this: ... string& aname = empty(); for (int i=0; igetLength(); ++i) { aname = atts->getName(i); ... which will result in copying the contents of the return value of getName into empty(), which is probably not the effect you're looking for. This leaves us with the alternatives of returning string*: class sax_AttributeList { public: enum AttrType { undefined, CDATA, ... }; virtual ~sax_AttributeList(); virtual int getLength() const = 0; virtual const string* getName(int i) const = 0; virtual AttrType getType(int i) const = 0; virtual const string* getValue(int i) const = 0; virtual AttrType getType(const string& name) const = 0; virtual const string* getValue(const string& name) const = 0; }; (returning a NULL pointer if not successful) or alterativelt, we can return an error code, and give a reference to the return value as a function argument, ie.: class sax_AttributeList { public: enum AttrType { undefined, CDATA, ... }; virtual ~sax_AttributeList(); virtual int getLength() const = 0; virtual bool getName(int i, string& name) const = 0; virtual bool getType(int i, AttrType& t) const = 0; virtual bool getValue(int i, string& val) const = 0; virtual bool getType(const string& name, AttrType& typ) const = 0; virtual bool getValue(const string& name, string& val) const = 0; }; In both cases we'll end up assigning to a local variable and do some testing: ... const string* s; s = atts.getName(1); if (s) { ... and ... string name; if (atts.getName(1,name)) { ... Even though it is a departure from the Java and (probably) Python implementations, I much prefer the latter alternative, because: 1. it supports very late UTF-8 decoding and copying from char* into the string class (if I use expat there has to be at least one such copy) 2. I can avoid building some of the data structures in the expat attribute list wrapper, minimizing the need for the mutable hack (casting this to a non const* "that" in const functions that do lazy evaluation and caching of variables) 3. I let the caller handle string object creation and destruction, again this minimizes copying (both gcc and MSVC++ string does shallow copying and deep-copy-on-write, but others (eg. SGI string) always do a deep copy) and eases memory management 4. The bool return value can be changed to an enum and can return more exact errors, eg. NoTypeSupport, OutOfBounds xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Tue Oct 5 10:20:08 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:51 2004 Subject: AttributeList in C++ SAX References: Message-ID: <002601bf0f0a$26b94970$c5010180@p197> Hi, > Before you know it you'll be tempted to assign the return values to > local string& variables to get shorter syntax, ie. like this: > ... > string& aname = empty(); > for (int i=0; igetLength(); ++i) { > aname = atts->getName(i); > ... We've never had a single customer say they've ever done this, but I agree it could be a problem. We also provide lots of samples with our product so people use that code as a template. I've put our sax include file here if you want to see our implementation : http://www.vivid-creations.com/free/sax.h http://www.vivid-creations.com/free/cinputstream.h This is cross platform / multiple encoding so we do use wstring. We've got some simply conversion shim for help people go between wide and narrow I'll post if they would be useful. > (returning a NULL pointer if not successful) or alterativelt, Nobody likes NULL pointers ;) > In both cases we'll end up assigning to a local variable and do some > testing: And both cases end up with longer code. I prefer the approach we've taken although you cant tell the difference between not present and empty string. The same feedback has come from our customers who were involved last year when putting together the original include files together. I guess at the end of the day you have to find a comprimise between usability and pureness. Regards, Richard. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From marko.zerdin at ixtlan-team.si Tue Oct 5 10:58:32 1999 From: marko.zerdin at ixtlan-team.si (Marko Zerdin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML/XSL Demo ? Message-ID: You can take a look at XSL tutorial written by Miroslav Nic (the address was published in this mailing list some month ago). I liked it very much. [http://zvon.vscht.cz/HTMLonly/XSLTutorial/Books/Book1/index.html] Enjoy, Marko. -----Original Message----- From: Patrice Bonhomme [mailto:Patrice.Bonhomme@loria.fr] Sent: Monday, October 04, 1999 11:18 AM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk; xsl-list@mulberrytech.com Subject: XML/XSL Demo ? Hi, I have been asked to do a presentation of XML. I have the materials for the presentation but i would like to do an impressive demonstration. So, i am looking for a demonstration that shows the advantages for using XML/XSL: - at client side and/or server side - XLink/XPointer within XML - Stylesheet in XSL Any pointers ? Thanks, Pat. -- ============================================================== bonhomme@loria.fr Tel : 03 83 59 30 52 / 06 11 34 03 85 http://www.loria.fr/~bonhomme Office : B.228 -------------------------------------------------------------- * Serveur Silfide : http://www.loria.fr/projets/Silfide ============================================================== xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken at bitsko.slc.ut.us Tue Oct 5 16:30:24 1999 From: ken at bitsko.slc.ut.us (Ken MacLeod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML/XSL Demo ? In-Reply-To: Marko Zerdin's message of "Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:58:48 +0200" References: Message-ID: Marko Zerdin writes: > You can take a look at XSL tutorial written by Miroslav Nic (the > address was published in this mailing list some month ago). I liked > it very much. > > [http://zvon.vscht.cz/HTMLonly/XSLTutorial/Books/Book1/index.html] I looked around and couldn't find a non-JavaScript version, is there one? -- Ken MacLeod ken@bitsko.slc.ut.us xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From marko.zerdin at ixtlan-team.si Tue Oct 5 17:29:56 1999 From: marko.zerdin at ixtlan-team.si (Marko Zerdin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML/XSL Demo ? Message-ID: Not that I know. Maybe you should ask Miroslav... -----Original Message----- From: Ken MacLeod [mailto:ken@bitsko.slc.ut.us] Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 1999 4:25 PM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk; xsl-list@mulberrytech.com Subject: Re: XML/XSL Demo ? Marko Zerdin writes: > You can take a look at XSL tutorial written by Miroslav Nic (the > address was published in this mailing list some month ago). I liked > it very much. > > [http://zvon.vscht.cz/HTMLonly/XSLTutorial/Books/Book1/index.html] I looked around and couldn't find a non-JavaScript version, is there one? -- Ken MacLeod ken@bitsko.slc.ut.us xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sguthery at rcn.com Tue Oct 5 18:26:30 1999 From: sguthery at rcn.com (Scott Guthery) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: WAP Binary XML Message-ID: <002c01bf0f4e$04d5a800$6e7d06d1@aa.net> Are there any WAP Binary XML encoders or parsers floating about? Cheers, Scott ******************* Smart Card Developer's Kit ******************* Scott Guthery sguthery@rcn.com Voice: 617 964 1798 Mobile: 617 290 3963 FAX: 617 795 1630 *********************** http://www.scdk.com ********************** xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 5 21:03:20 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception References: <000501bf0ee3$b34853d0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Message-ID: <37FA4B02.EE2B6E56@pacbell.net> Lars George wrote: > > java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at There's some information in the release notes about this diagnostic, which so far as I know _only_ shows up if the source code was recompiled with a JDK 1.1 version of "javac". The issue is that the JDK 1.1 compiler (and many derived compilers) generate incorrect bytecodes, which cause that exception to be reported. I've not heard of any JVM which reports that error when given _correct_ bytecodes. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lgeorge at gmx.net Tue Oct 5 23:18:25 1999 From: lgeorge at gmx.net (Lars George) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception In-Reply-To: <37FA4B02.EE2B6E56@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <000b01bf0f77$6fdf4010$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Dave, Thanks for pointing that out, but unfortunately this does not apply here. The release notes talk about recompiling the XML java classes, which I have not done. Another indication is that it runs as the standalone demo but not inside the servlet. Both VM point to the same classpath and both use the same jdk on my disk - so both should have the same problem. As I have not recompiled the XML classes but use the precompiled one, this error should not occur. BUT as I get this exception in a nearly similar fashion I have the suspicion that this must be something related to it. But how can I find out? Question, questions... Thanks, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > David Brownell > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 5:01 > To: Lars George > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at > > There's some information in the release notes about this > diagnostic, which so far as I know _only_ shows up if the > source code was recompiled with a JDK 1.1 version of "javac". > > The issue is that the JDK 1.1 compiler (and many derived > compilers) generate incorrect bytecodes, which cause that > exception to be reported. I've not heard of any JVM which > reports that error when given _correct_ bytecodes. > > - Dave > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Wed Oct 6 03:36:13 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: seeking a validator Message-ID: <199910060135.VAA00956@hesketh.net> A reader asked me if I knew of any software that would let you take an arbitrary SAX stream or DOM tree and validate it against a DTD (heck, multiple DTDs) of the application's choosing, without relying on the DOCTYPE declaration. Please note that this is not simply a validating parser - it requires letting the application choose the DTD, probably after the document has gone through a non-validating parser. Anything out there? I haven't seen it for DTDs. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 6 04:08:52 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception References: <000b01bf0f77$6fdf4010$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Message-ID: <37FAAEE0.D7F6DFDA@pacbell.net> Lars George wrote: > > Dave, > > Thanks for pointing that out, but unfortunately this does not apply here. > The release notes talk about recompiling the XML java classes, which I have > not done. Another indication is that it runs as the standalone demo but not > inside the servlet. Both VM point to the same classpath and both use the > same jdk on my disk - so both should have the same problem. Hmm. Seems like some kind of JVM bug then. File it with Sun, both through the JDK channels and through the Project X channels. Maybe try a more recent JDK; you didn't mention which one you're using. - Dave > As I have not > recompiled the XML classes but use the precompiled one, this error should > not occur. BUT as I get this exception in a nearly similar fashion I have > the suspicion that this must be something related to it. But how can I find > out? Question, questions... > > Thanks, > > Lars George > Woodgate Research Pty Ltd > Brisbane, Australia > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > > David Brownell > > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 5:01 > > To: Lars George > > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > > > java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at > > > > There's some information in the release notes about this > > diagnostic, which so far as I know _only_ shows up if the > > source code was recompiled with a JDK 1.1 version of "javac". > > > > The issue is that the JDK 1.1 compiler (and many derived > > compilers) generate incorrect bytecodes, which cause that > > exception to be reported. I've not heard of any JVM which > > reports that error when given _correct_ bytecodes. > > > > - Dave > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lgeorge at gmx.net Wed Oct 6 04:27:26 1999 From: lgeorge at gmx.net (Lars George) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception In-Reply-To: <37FAAEE0.D7F6DFDA@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <001601bf0fa2$9a060e70$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Dave, What channels do you talk about? One is the feedback address for the xml parser, which is located on the webpage where one can download the classes. What is the other one? Sorry for not giving the full details of my problem (I thought I covered all, but .. :]): I use JDK 1.1.8 Win32 as I want to run my servlet later under Linux using 1.1.7v3 Blackdown port. Thanks, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > David Brownell > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 12:07 > To: Lars George > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > Dave, > > > > Thanks for pointing that out, but unfortunately this does not > apply here. > > The release notes talk about recompiling the XML java classes, > which I have > > not done. Another indication is that it runs as the standalone > demo but not > > inside the servlet. Both VM point to the same classpath and both use the > > same jdk on my disk - so both should have the same problem. > > Hmm. Seems like some kind of JVM bug then. File it with Sun, > both through the JDK channels and through the Project X channels. > > Maybe try a more recent JDK; you didn't mention which one you're > using. > > - Dave > > > > > As I have not > > recompiled the XML classes but use the precompiled one, this > error should > > not occur. BUT as I get this exception in a nearly similar > fashion I have > > the suspicion that this must be something related to it. But > how can I find > > out? Question, questions... > > > > Thanks, > > > > Lars George > > Woodgate Research Pty Ltd > > Brisbane, Australia > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > > David Brownell > > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 5:01 > > To: Lars George > > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > > > java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at > > > > There's some information in the release notes about this > > diagnostic, which so far as I know _only_ shows up if the > > source code was recompiled with a JDK 1.1 version of "javac". > > > > The issue is that the JDK 1.1 compiler (and many derived > > compilers) generate incorrect bytecodes, which cause that > > exception to be reported. I've not heard of any JVM which > > reports that error when given _correct_ bytecodes. > > > > - Dave > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 6 04:44:21 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception References: <001601bf0fa2$9a060e70$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Message-ID: <37FAB736.B3486BE4@pacbell.net> Lars George wrote: > > Dave, > > What channels do you talk about? One is the feedback address for the xml > parser, which is located on the webpage where one can download the classes. > What is the other one? Through JDC there's a "report a bug" option that's pretty easy to find. Since you downloaded that package, you have access to JDC. > Sorry for not giving the full details of my problem (I thought I covered > all, but .. :]): > > I use JDK 1.1.8 Win32 as I want to run my servlet later under Linux using > 1.1.7v3 Blackdown port. So try JDK 1.2 then. I use the Blackdown Linux JDK 1.2pre-v2 with quite a lot of succes, as well as the a Win32 version of JDK 1.2 which also works fine. If it checks out as not reproducible in JDK 1.2 then make clear that's in your bug report against JDK 1.1.8 and highlight the fact that a fix in the 1.1.x series is needed (if it is; and why.) - Dave > Thanks, > > Lars George > Woodgate Research Pty Ltd > Brisbane, Australia > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > > David Brownell > > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 12:07 > > To: Lars George > > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > > > Dave, > > > > > > Thanks for pointing that out, but unfortunately this does not > > apply here. > > > The release notes talk about recompiling the XML java classes, > > which I have > > > not done. Another indication is that it runs as the standalone > > demo but not > > > inside the servlet. Both VM point to the same classpath and both use the > > > same jdk on my disk - so both should have the same problem. > > > > Hmm. Seems like some kind of JVM bug then. File it with Sun, > > both through the JDK channels and through the Project X channels. > > > > Maybe try a more recent JDK; you didn't mention which one you're > > using. > > > > - Dave > > > > > > > > > As I have not > > > recompiled the XML classes but use the precompiled one, this > > error should > > > not occur. BUT as I get this exception in a nearly similar > > fashion I have > > > the suspicion that this must be something related to it. But > > how can I find > > > out? Question, questions... > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Lars George > > > Woodgate Research Pty Ltd > > > Brisbane, Australia > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > > > David Brownell > > > Sent: Wednesday, 6 October 1999 5:01 > > > To: Lars George > > > Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > > Subject: Re: XML Parser in Servlet causes exception > > > > > > > > > Lars George wrote: > > > > > > > > java.lang.IllegalAccessError: com/sun/xml/tree/ParentNode at > > > > > > There's some information in the release notes about this > > > diagnostic, which so far as I know _only_ shows up if the > > > source code was recompiled with a JDK 1.1 version of "javac". > > > > > > The issue is that the JDK 1.1 compiler (and many derived > > > compilers) generate incorrect bytecodes, which cause that > > > exception to be reported. I've not heard of any JVM which > > > reports that error when given _correct_ bytecodes. > > > > > > - Dave > > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN > 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following > message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From distobj at acm.org Wed Oct 6 04:48:43 1999 From: distobj at acm.org (Mark Baker) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: WAP Binary XML In-Reply-To: <002c01bf0f4e$04d5a800$6e7d06d1@aa.net> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19991005234426.00f0a7dc@pop1.sympatico.ca> Check out Wapsody. It's a Java/WAP SDK, and should have the WBXML stuff in it someplace. http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/ At 12:23 PM 10/5/99 -0400, Scott Guthery wrote: >Are there any WAP Binary XML encoders or parsers floating about? > >Cheers, Scott > >******************* Smart Card Developer's Kit ******************* >Scott Guthery sguthery@rcn.com >Voice: 617 964 1798 Mobile: 617 290 3963 FAX: 617 795 1630 >*********************** http://www.scdk.com ********************** > > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Wed Oct 6 14:57:17 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:52 2004 Subject: AttributeList in C++ SAX In-Reply-To: "Richard Anderson"'s message of "Tue, 5 Oct 1999 09:17:53 +0100" References: <002601bf0f0a$26b94970$c5010180@p197> Message-ID: >>>>> "Richard Anderson" : > This is cross platform / multiple encoding so we do use wstring. > We've got some simply conversion shim for help people go between > wide and narrow I'll post if they would be useful. I'm not sure what this is, so sure go ahead...! :-) I'm currently operating with string, and decoding UTF-8 into ISO8859-1, and throwing away everything that doesn't fit. This works for now, because Latin 1 in UTF-8 is all we ever dump. We'll move to wstring throughout our system later on. [snip!] >> In both cases we'll end up assigning to a local variable and do some >> testing: > And both cases end up with longer code. YMMV here I think. When I replaced my const string&-returning AttributeList, with one where the caller has to supply the string to copy into, I came out the same (except this one works...:-) ) But then I iterate through all attributes of an element and fill the result into variables, that have a default and are sent to a callback. I don't ask for attributes by name. > I prefer the approach we've taken although you cant tell the > difference between not present and empty string. > The same feedback has come from our customers who were involved last year > when putting together the original include files together. > I guess at the end of the day you have to find a comprimise between > usability and pureness. The good thing about my string as argument alternative is the possibility for minimizing string copies. I can UTF-8 decode directly into the string I use all the way into callback class arguments (ie. one copy may be enough). xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jtauber at jtauber.com Wed Oct 6 16:42:05 1999 From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: ANN: Mailing list for FOP Developers References: <19991004144225.18093.cpmta@c006.sfo.cp.net> Message-ID: <040801bf1008$af91e460$e795868b@bowstreet.com> I've just started a mailing list at ONELIST for anyone interested in helping develop FOP, the open-source XSL formatter/renderer. Lurkers as well as active developers are most welcome. http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/fop-dev James xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com Wed Oct 6 17:26:57 1999 From: Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com (Arnold, Curt) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: seeking a validator Message-ID: <61DAD58E8F4ED211AC8400A0C9B468731AAFBB@THOR> SST asked: >> A reader asked me if I knew of any software that would let you take an >> arbitrary SAX stream or DOM tree and validate it against a DTD (heck, >> multiple DTDs) of the application's choosing, without relying on the >> DOCTYPE declaration. I don't have a solution for this problem. You might be able to intercept or insert a DOCTYPE event between the SAX and validation layer in one of the more layered parsers like IBM's. But I think I do understand the need the provoked it. I discussed this a bit in a comment to the W3C Schema work group (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-xml-schema-comments/1999JulSep/0052 .html) which started as a rant on the recently introduced minAbsoluteValue and maxAbsoluteValue attributes and then tried to explain the distinction between schema constraints (hopefully implied by the physical nature of a system) and application (as in EXE, maybe more appropriately processor) constraints (based on the limitations of the implementation of an application). For example, a well defined address schema would allow you to express non-US addresses. However, it would be useful for an application to say that beyond the requirements of the schema, it had additional requirements (such as a US address) and that if the document didn't meet these additional requirements then it wasn't interested in processing it. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jtauber at jtauber.com Wed Oct 6 17:31:37 1999 From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: fop-dev mailing list not working Message-ID: <055401bf100f$92c2b150$e795868b@bowstreet.com> I've had a number of reports that the fop-dev mailing list I just announced isn't working. It was working earlier today, so I suspect the problem is temporary. Please try again later. If people are still reporting problems after 24 hours, I'll go looking for another free mailing list service. Sorry for the inconvenience. James xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com Wed Oct 6 18:08:17 1999 From: Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com (Goyal, Sanjeev) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: Getting the SystemID from DocType Message-ID: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239D8D@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Hi, When I parse a XML document (having a DOCTYPE declaration in it), by using sun's XML parser, I got the XmlDocument Object initialized with all the nodes etc. If I invoke the api getSystemId() on this XmlDocument, it returns NULL but when I write XML back from this XmlDocument Object, it generate the whole XML tree with DOCTYPE(including system id for the DTD) declaration in it. My question is, why the getSystemId() API returns NULL ? But the systemId along with DOCTYPE declaration is generated during writing XML back from XmlDocument object. Also if I invoke getDoctype(), it return DocumentType object which doesn't have enough public method to get the system id for the DocType of this XmlDocument. Any pointers will be highly appreciated. Thanks, Sanjeev xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ceo at citix.com Thu Oct 7 02:18:24 1999 From: ceo at citix.com (Steven Livingstone) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: CBL Message-ID: <024701bf1059$f378feb0$0a0a0a0a@deltabiz> I am at a loss, so hopefully someone can help ! Has anyone done any work with CBL 2?? Have any examples. They have some examples, but they use DTD's and are OK. When I try to view an instance using the downloadable modules in IE5, i get errors. Pointers to good resources would be good as I have looked in everywhere the search engines would give me ! Thanks Steven -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991007/caf2b0d8/attachment.htm From david-b at pacbell.net Thu Oct 7 05:35:48 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: Getting the SystemID from DocType References: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239D8D@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Message-ID: <37FC14BE.7C16312F@pacbell.net> "Goyal, Sanjeev" wrote: > > My question is, why the getSystemId() API returns NULL ? But the systemId > along with DOCTYPE declaration is generated during writing XML back from > XmlDocument object. You seem to be confused about what the getSystemId() call does. It returns the system ID for the document itself ... not one for the external subset or any other parameter entity in the DTD. That's clearly documented. > Also if I invoke getDoctype(), it return DocumentType object which doesn't > have enough public method to get the system id for the DocType of this > XmlDocument. I suggest you look at the source code and you'll see what's going on. That's a big part of why it's provided. - Dave > Any pointers will be highly appreciated. > > Thanks, > Sanjeev xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sunker at telkom.net Thu Oct 7 11:59:45 1999 From: sunker at telkom.net (sunker@telkom.net) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: problem with input form Message-ID: <61D3A6AB14FED211856500001C055D9633E001@FS01> Hi All, to the point.., i got problem when i structuring xml for form input, and transform to xsl... why are the xsl couldn't specify the input type ?..such as radio button, check box, button (submit/reset), he translate into Text type ?. i include some attach from my xml & xsl file. please help me??!!. see u http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/campus/7211 [[ FORMS-~1.XSL : 2589 in winmail.dat ]][[ FORM-T~1.XML : 2590 in winmail.dat ]] -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 15615 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991007/317a2169/winmail.bin From skshirsa at nortelnetworks.com Thu Oct 7 15:31:12 1999 From: skshirsa at nortelnetworks.com (Shekhar Kshirsagar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: C++ DOM Implementation Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991007083402.00ace680@zbl6c002.corpeast.baynetworks.com> Can any one please suggest me some shareware C++ DOM Implementation for Windows platform that will work as is with MFC library? I have tried the one at http://www.ceng.metu.edu.tr/~e106708/Dir/dom/DOM/README But had lot of problems getting it work on Windows platform using MSVC compiler. Now that I'm trying to use with MFC there are just lot of problems while compiling itself. Thanks, Shekhar xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com Thu Oct 7 16:10:51 1999 From: Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com (Goyal, Sanjeev) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: Getting the SystemID from DocType Message-ID: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239D90@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Dave, > > Also if I invoke getDoctype(), it return DocumentType > object which doesn't > > have enough public method to get the system id for the > DocType of this > > XmlDocument. > > I suggest you look at the source code and you'll see what's going on. > That's a big part of why it's provided. I have seen the source code for it. The implementation class Doctype.java for (DocumentType interface) has private variables defined for systemId and public Ids for external dtd subsets, that's why the systemId for DTD is printed out (in DOCTYPE declaration) when I tried to write XML back from a XmlDocument object. But there is no public method to access this systemId (for external dtd subset) from DocumentType object, returned from getDoctype() API on XmlDocument class. In my application I need to know this systemId. If DocumentType is not the right object to get this systemId than how do access this systemId ? Is it possible ? Thanks in advance, Sanjeev xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Thu Oct 7 17:59:22 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: Getting the SystemID from DocType References: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239D90@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Message-ID: <37FCC326.42FC5860@pacbell.net> "Goyal, Sanjeev" wrote: > > Dave, > > > > Also if I invoke getDoctype(), it return DocumentType > > object which doesn't > > > have enough public method to get the system id for the > > DocType of this > > > XmlDocument. > > > > I suggest you look at the source code and you'll see what's going on. > > That's a big part of why it's provided. > > I have seen the source code for it. The implementation class Doctype.java > for (DocumentType interface) has private variables defined for systemId and > public Ids for external dtd subsets, that's why the systemId for DTD is > printed out (in DOCTYPE declaration) when I tried to write XML back from a > XmlDocument object. But there is no public method to access this systemId > (for external dtd subset) from DocumentType object, returned from > getDoctype() API on XmlDocument class. In my application I need to know this > systemId. If DocumentType is not the right object to get this systemId than > how do access this systemId ? Is it possible ? You just said it's a private variable, and you looked at the source code ... so you must know the answer to this question already. I suggest you talk to Sun about this feature request. Perhaps they will offer DOM Level 2 support, which does expose this information. - Dave > Thanks in advance, > Sanjeev xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From l-arcini at uniandes.edu.co Thu Oct 7 19:22:43 1999 From: l-arcini at uniandes.edu.co (Fabio Arciniegas A.) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: C++ DOM Implementation In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19991007083402.00ace680@zbl6c002.corpeast.baynetworks.com> Message-ID: <000701bf10e8$60366d60$0100000a@phoebe> I suppose you already looked at ibm's xml4c2 and find problems with the license, right? I have used it with MFC under MSVC6.0 without problems but i haven't looked at the license carefully... it says it is an "evaluation license" and it provides a pointer so you can register to distribute it free of charge, but i haven't read it. That aside, maybe you should consider xml4c. Fabio - - Can any one please suggest me some shareware C++ DOM Implementation for - Windows platform that will work as is with MFC library? - - I have tried the one at - http://www.ceng.metu.edu.tr/~e106708/Dir/dom/DOM/README - - But had lot of problems getting it work on Windows platform using MSVC - compiler. Now that I'm trying to use with MFC there are just lot of - problems while compiling itself. - - Thanks, - Shekhar - - - - - - - - xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk - Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on - CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 - To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; - unsubscribe xml-dev - To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the - following message; - subscribe xml-dev-digest - List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) - - - xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jrgardn at emory.edu Thu Oct 7 19:38:47 1999 From: jrgardn at emory.edu (John Robert Gardner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:53 2004 Subject: Industrial Strength XML Serving In-Reply-To: <61D3A6AB14FED211856500001C055D9633E001@FS01> Message-ID: I'm venturing this question as a general call for input--and pitches--with regard to the following project we're undertaking: 750,000 pages of journals, in both text form and gif images for "canonical preservation" and cross-check Typed text version, in XML (using TEI largely) yielding ~400,000,000 words (our initial estimates suggest something in the range of 30-50 gigs of total content including gifs), avg.'d to ~60,000,000 tag nodes, searchable based on content of tags (word strings), element heirarchy, and attribute values, with final form changing infrequently (archival/institutional memory) Primary access point being MARC records we're rendering into highly granular XML, for crosswalking to DC/RDF/GILS (we're starting with some 200 megs of MARC records alone) I've been asking offlist for possible consultants as our systems staff has a strong inclination to Oracle 8i and I'm hardly fluent enough on such software to argue based upon what I know. Based on Oracle's white paper, it sounds viable . . . however: In some of my offlist correspondence, I've detected a dichotomy between the view that "it doesn't matter if it's XML, pizza's, or washing machines you're storing, it's the size that counts (no pun intended)" -- so Oracle's great. ON the other side, is a sense that 8i's newness is a potential unknown for such size in XML (we'll also likely be subcontracting the serving of the gifs, likely out-of-state). The implication was that there were more SGML/XML-native packages out there if we have the budget (we do, within the limits that, say, commissioning a whole new softwre package is out of the question). :) Our project is perhaps one of the best funded efforts in the humanities in markup for some time, and surely in a class by itself viz. XML. As it's likely to be a model in various senses/case study, I really want to be sure we commit down the "right" road on this, and be sure of our options along that road. The vision I'm implementing from teh XML side is meant to go beyond another research resource to a full-scale research environment which exploits XSLT for having our stuff accessible--e.g., the MARC--in multiple tag vocabularies (DC, RDF, GILS, etc.), as well as very sophisticate construction of the resources found through the search (e.g., with DOM, etc.). At any rate, this question is in no way an obviation either of my offlist inquiries for a consultant, nor of their input thus far. Instead, since the vichy soisse is not yet ready to be stirred, nor even on the stove, all chef's are needed-- if there is a better mousetrap to be made without a reinvention of the wheel, now's the time to know. TYIA, jr =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-= John Robert Gardner, Ph.D. XML Engineer ATLA-CERTR ------------------------------------------------------------ http://vedavid.org/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jevdemon at acm.org Thu Oct 7 21:13:38 1999 From: jevdemon at acm.org (John Evdemon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <37F28C1F000BA9F2@isocor6.visto.com> (added by postmaster@isocor6.visto.com) Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? Thanks! _______________________________________________________ Get Visto! Groups, event calendars, email, and more... Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From michael_champion at ameritech.net Thu Oct 7 21:36:57 1999 From: michael_champion at ameritech.net (Michael Champion) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Industrial Strength XML Serving References: Message-ID: <017301bf10fb$24b0b760$2f1b12d1@mccdell> ----- Original Message ----- From: John Robert Gardner To: 'xml-mailinglist' Cc: John Robert Gardner -Ph.D. Sent: Thursday, October 07, 1999 9:23 AM Subject: Industrial Strength XML Serving > > I'm venturing this question as a general call for input--and pitches--with > regard to the following project we're undertaking: > > 750,000 pages of journals, in both text form and gif images for > "canonical preservation" and cross-check > > Typed text version, in XML (using TEI largely) yielding > ~400,000,000 words (our initial estimates suggest > something in the range of 30-50 gigs of total content > including gifs), avg.'d to ~60,000,000 tag nodes, > searchable based on content of tags (word strings), > element heirarchy, and attribute values, with final form > changing infrequently (archival/institutional memory) OK, you asked for pitches, I'll give you Software AG's pitch for our just-released native XML database called Tamino. see http://www.softwareag.com/tamino While relational databases create the context to the data through tables, columns, joins etc., they work best with data that fits to this structure. As soon as the data has left the database, its meaning relies totally on the further processing applications. In complex environments this often leads to problems which are hard to fix like unexpected application behavior, lack of scalability and maintainability. XML objects are stored "natively" in Tamino. Direct storage of XML objects without further conversion to other data structures is the basis for Tamino's excellent performance. In other words, there is NO MAPPING LAYER between the XML you see and the underlying database structures. This eliminates having to do an analysis of which XML elements are to be stored in an efficiently searchable manner and which are to be stored as something like BLOBs. Finally, Software AG has been developing industrial strength database systems for something like 30 years now. Our Adabas product is widely used in environments where absolute reliability, near-infinite scalability, TRUE 24:7 availability (i.e, you can lose millions of dollars if the database is EVER offline for maintenance), etc. are requirements. Tamino is initially available on NT, and (I'm not sure of the details, commitments, etc.) will become available on a wide variety of server and mainframe platforms. > I've been asking offlist for possible consultants as our systems staff has > a strong inclination to Oracle 8i and I'm hardly fluent enough on such > software to argue based upon what I know. Based on Oracle's white paper, > it sounds viable . . . however I can say without fear of contradiction that Oracle 8i has a *great* whitepaper. I'd suggest you look closer at the actual product, its customers, and the alternatives before assuming that it's the obvious choice for XML storage. Thanks, Mike Champion Software AG xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Thu Oct 7 21:49:46 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Industrial Strength XML Serving In-Reply-To: Message-ID: | In some of my offlist correspondence, I've detected a dichotomy between | the view that "it doesn't matter if it's XML, pizza's, or washing machines | you're storing, it's the size that counts (no pun intended)" -- so | Oracle's great. ON the other side, is a sense that 8i's newness is a | potential unknown for such size in XML (we'll also likely be | subcontracting the serving of the gifs, likely out-of-state). The | implication was that there were more SGML/XML-native packages out there if | we have the budget (we do, within the limits that, say, commissioning a | whole new softwre package is out of the question). :) "Oracle 8i" is "Oracle8i Release 8.1.5", the first production release of the major enhancement of the previous "Oracle8 Release 8.0.6". In addition to the new features that catch lots of headlines (perhaps giving impression of "newness") like the XML and Java, it's sometimes easy to forget that Oracle8i improves on the features of its predecessor in *every functional area* of the database, including scalability, maintainability, reliability as well. The underlying technology is an evolution of the proven Oracle product, not a "whole new" database. | Our project is perhaps one of the best funded efforts in the humanities in | markup for some time, and surely in a class by itself viz. XML. As it's | likely to be a model in various senses/case study, I really want to be | sure we commit down the "right" road on this, and be sure of our options | along that road. The vision I'm implementing from teh XML side is meant | to go beyond another research resource to a full-scale research | environment which exploits XSLT for having our stuff accessible--e.g., the | MARC--in multiple tag vocabularies (DC, RDF, GILS, etc.), as well as very | sophisticate construction of the resources found through the search (e.g., | with DOM, etc.). The next major release of 8i (release 8.1.6) comes with our key XML components natively compiled using our "way ahead of time" compiler for scalable server-side Java. This means that XML processing and XSLT transformations running inside the Oracle8i database have a double-performance boost: (1) Data access is done through an "in-memory" JDBC driver, rather than over a network. (Same familiar JDBC api, superior performance) (2) The XML components will be natively compiled. The 8.1.6 release also adds significant improvements to searching of XML Docs and Doc Fragments in our Intermedia Text engine. Hope this helps. ______________________________________________ Steve Muench Consulting Product Manager & XML Evangelist Business Components for Java Development Team xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From b_edge_r at my-dejanews.com Thu Oct 7 23:42:09 1999 From: b_edge_r at my-dejanews.com (Paul) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Accessing XML via Javascript? Message-ID: <37FD15A0.490859CD@my-dejanews.com> I have searched several popular sites and the XML-DEV archive for any developments on Javascript and XML, but have found very little activity in the last many months. I suspect I am looking in the wrong place, so I'd appreciate any links! What I am looking for is a means via javascript to access XML via a high-level tagged notation (e.g. foo.bar[i].etc) rather than the low-level generic navigational style access imposed by DOM. TIA. Paul. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ksievers at novell.com Fri Oct 8 00:08:40 1999 From: ksievers at novell.com (Kent Sievers) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. Message-ID: I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying to make sense out of data from multiple outside sources. Years ago when we started out we had our own proprietary way of representing "documents", and had to convert the different formats into ours in order to consume them. When we first heard about XML we got very excited and have been using it now for quite some time. But looking back, I have trouble seeing what it bought us. I will try to use a simple contrived example: In the beginning we were shown XMLs that looked like this: John Doe But then we hit the great debate on "attributes vs. elements" and some of the groups that we had to interoperate with said "we prefer elements" and we were forced to handle things like: Reasons varied on why they wanted to do this. My favorite was "we want to syntactically guarantee that an author has only one last name. " And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. Next we ran into the "meta-data" and schema arguments and we then had groups that wanted to give us things like:

Reasons varied here as well. My favorite was "we already have tags in our schema that have spaces and colons in them and we think escaping them would be too much trouble" And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. Finally, the "display and rendering" issues came up (e.g. what is easy vs. what is hard using style sheets and IE5) and groups started wanting to give us things like:

Reasons varied again. My favorite was "it is just too hard to provide generic enough style sheets". And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. While these examples are totally contrived, they represent the problem we are facing: Even after we have conversions that take care of disagreements over tag names, data types and allowed values (i.e. the point at which we would expect to reap a huge benefit from XML) we are still doing as much conversion as when we had our own proprietary (non-XML) format. In essence, because XML has been "flexible to the point of a free-for-all" when it comes to representing "simple name/value pairs", we have almost no interoperability. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 8 00:14:37 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Industrial Strength XML Serving References: Message-ID: <006a01bf1111$f2ff3130$54561990@us.oracle.com> | Okay, I'm largely convinced/reassured. : | Are we storing native XML in Oracle, or intermediately putting it into | tables, then indexing,then running searches on that? We offer two approaches for storage of XML in 8i: (1) If you're XML is being used as an Internet exchange format for E-Business information, then it makes the most sense to store the business information in the way that existing applications, data warehousing tools, and reporting tools can still leverage it, as well as in a way which enables querying the data efficiently from any point of view instead of through a fixed hierarchy imposed by a single XML document structure. In practice, your business data represents many virtual XML documents, depending on the business task at hand. (2) If you're storing XML marked-up legal proceedings or contracts, or dissertations, then you can mix and match our full-text searching and xml section searching over documents and document fragments stored in character In future releases when we're living in an XML Schema aware environment with much more datatype-rich schema information available, this seamless XML-in and XML-out gets even smarter. ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Daniel.Brickley at bristol.ac.uk Fri Oct 8 00:25:37 1999 From: Daniel.Brickley at bristol.ac.uk (Dan Brickley) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sounds like you could've done with some common abstract data model, and treated all these different syntaxes as alternate ways of shipping the same facts around. Is that too crass a thing to say? My personal bias is towards RDF for the common model, but RDF or no, sounds like there's a need to be up front about there being multiple ways of expressing the same underlying information... Dan On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Kent Sievers wrote: > I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying to make sense out of data from multiple outside sources. Years ago when we started out we had our own proprietary way of representing "documents", and had to convert the different formats into ours in order to consume them. When we first heard about XML we got very excited and have been using it now for quite some time. But looking back, I have trouble seeing what it bought us. I will try to use a simple contrived example: > > In the beginning we were shown XMLs that looked like this: > > John > Doe > > > But then we hit the great debate on "attributes vs. elements" and some of the groups that we had to interoperate with said "we prefer elements" and we were forced to handle things like: > > > Reasons varied on why they wanted to do this. My favorite was "we want to syntactically guarantee that an author has only one last name. " And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. > > Next we ran into the "meta-data" and schema arguments and we then had groups that wanted to give us things like: >

> > Reasons varied here as well. My favorite was "we already have tags in our schema that have spaces and colons in them and we think escaping them would be too much trouble" And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. > > Finally, the "display and rendering" issues came up (e.g. what is easy vs. what is hard using style sheets and IE5) and groups started wanting to give us things like: >

> > or > >

> > Reasons varied again. My favorite was "it is just too hard to provide generic enough style sheets". And we couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. > > While these examples are totally contrived, they represent the problem we are facing: > Even after we have conversions that take care of disagreements over tag names, data types and allowed values (i.e. the point at which we would expect to reap a huge benefit from XML) we are still doing as much conversion as when we had our own proprietary (non-XML) format. > > In essence, because XML has been "flexible to the point of a free-for-all" when it comes to representing "simple name/value pairs", we have almost no interoperability. > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 8 00:41:40 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <199910072241.SAA08979@hesketh.net> >On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Kent Sievers wrote: >> Even after we have conversions that take care of disagreements over tag names, >data types and allowed values (i.e. the point at which we would expect to reap a >huge benefit from XML) we are still doing as much conversion as when we had our own >proprietary (non-XML) format. >> >> In essence, because XML has been "flexible to the point of a free-for-all" when it comes to representing "simple name/value pairs", we have almost no interoperability. At 11:25 PM 10/7/99 +0100, Dan Brickley wrote: >Sounds like you could've done with some common abstract data model, and >treated all these different syntaxes as alternate ways of shipping the >same facts around. Is that too crass a thing to say? My personal bias is >towards RDF for the common model, but RDF or no, sounds like there's a >need to be up front about there being multiple ways of expressing the >same underlying information... To me, it sounds like you could do with some tools for mapping different data structures that represent similar underlying data structures to a common model. The problem isn't that XML is too flexible; rather, it's that no one has yet built something handy for making "everyone else's representation" into "my representation". It doesn't seem like a light project, but it doesn't seem impossible, either. It'd get you out of: a) having to define all your models in advance b) forcing everyone to use identical representations I wish I had more time, I really do. Anybody else done something like this? Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mhatalski at ipnet-solutions.com Fri Oct 8 01:08:26 1999 From: mhatalski at ipnet-solutions.com (Mike Hatalski) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. Message-ID: How about IBM's Translator Generator? http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/aw.nsf/techmain/5F60964153C4274788256776006817 AA --Mike -----Original Message----- From: Simon St.Laurent [mailto:simonstl@simonstl.com] To me, it sounds like you could do with some tools for mapping different data structures that represent similar underlying data structures to a common model. The problem isn't that XML is too flexible; rather, it's that no one has yet built something handy for making "everyone else's representation" into "my representation". It doesn't seem like a light project, but it doesn't seem impossible, either. It'd get you out of: a) having to define all your models in advance b) forcing everyone to use identical representations I wish I had more time, I really do. Anybody else done something like this? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ksievers at novell.com Fri Oct 8 01:18:00 1999 From: ksievers at novell.com (Kent Sievers) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. Message-ID: A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. >>> "Simon St.Laurent" 10/07/99 04:44PM >>> >On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Kent Sievers wrote: >> Even after we have conversions that take care of disagreements over tag names, >data types and allowed values (i.e. the point at which we would expect to reap a >huge benefit from XML) we are still doing as much conversion as when we had our own >proprietary (non-XML) format. >> >> In essence, because XML has been "flexible to the point of a free-for-all" when it comes to representing "simple name/value pairs", we have almost no interoperability. At 11:25 PM 10/7/99 +0100, Dan Brickley wrote: >Sounds like you could've done with some common abstract data model, and >treated all these different syntaxes as alternate ways of shipping the >same facts around. Is that too crass a thing to say? My personal bias is >towards RDF for the common model, but RDF or no, sounds like there's a >need to be up front about there being multiple ways of expressing the >same underlying information... To me, it sounds like you could do with some tools for mapping different data structures that represent similar underlying data structures to a common model. The problem isn't that XML is too flexible; rather, it's that no one has yet built something handy for making "everyone else's representation" into "my representation". It doesn't seem like a light project, but it doesn't seem impossible, either. It'd get you out of: a) having to define all your models in advance b) forcing everyone to use identical representations I wish I had more time, I really do. Anybody else done something like this? Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dvint at slip.net Fri Oct 8 01:38:51 1999 From: dvint at slip.net (Dan Vint) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4.1.19991007193033.009575b0@pop.slip.net> But do remember back to when you had: \b;John Doe&b- and had to find the author name amongst all the other \b; .... &b- markup and hope that you also didn't catch other values that weren't author names that happened to be marked up the with the same proprietary markup? If you XML is a clean as all the varities that you have shown then you are way ahead in the conversion efforts than someone who is dealing wiht Frame MIF, Interleaf, Word and WordPerfect codes! Please give me your problems! Yeah, in your case XML hasn't become a magic bullet, but it certainly is much easier and more accurate to deal with than pure proprietary desktop publishing formats that are only concerned with making pretty pages. ..dan At 04:05 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: >I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying to make sense >out of data from multiple outside sources. Years ago when we started out we >had our own proprietary way of representing "documents", and had to convert >the different formats into ours in order to consume them. When we first >heard about XML we got very excited and have been using it now for quite >some time. But looking back, I have trouble seeing what it bought us. I >will try to use a simple contrived example: > >In the beginning we were shown XMLs that looked like this: > > John > Doe > > >But then we hit the great debate on "attributes vs. elements" and some of >the groups that we had to interoperate with said "we prefer elements" and we >were forced to handle things like: > > >Reasons varied on why they wanted to do this. My favorite was "we want to >syntactically guarantee that an author has only one last name. " And we >couldn't do anything because they were within their "XML-specified" rights. > >Next we ran into the "meta-data" and schema arguments and we then had groups >that wanted to give us things like: >

> >Reasons varied here as well. My favorite was "we already have tags in our >schema that have spaces and colons in them and we think escaping them would >be too much trouble" And we couldn't do anything because they were within >their "XML-specified" rights. > >Finally, the "display and rendering" issues came up (e.g. what is easy vs. >what is hard using style sheets and IE5) and groups started wanting to give >us things like: >

> >or > >

> >Reasons varied again. My favorite was "it is just too hard to provide >generic enough style sheets". And we couldn't do anything because they were >within their "XML-specified" rights. > >While these examples are totally contrived, they represent the problem we >are facing: >Even after we have conversions that take care of disagreements over tag >names, data types and allowed values (i.e. the point at which we would >expect to reap a huge benefit from XML) we are still doing as much >conversion as when we had our own proprietary (non-XML) format. > >In essence, because XML has been "flexible to the point of a free-for-all" >when it comes to representing "simple name/value pairs", we have almost no >interoperability. > > > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN >981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Danny Vint http://www.dvint.com Author: SGML at Work http://www.slip.net/~dvint/pubs/sgmlatwork.shtml mailto:dvint@slip.net Calian Voice:804-975-3482 mailto:d.vint@calian.com Charlottesville, VA Office http://www.calian.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jtauber at jtauber.com Fri Oct 8 01:38:18 1999 From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:54 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. References: <199910072241.SAA08979@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <022c01bf111c$d70a82d0$af95868b@bowstreet.com> > To me, it sounds like you could do with some tools for mapping different > data structures that represent similar underlying data structures to a > common model. The problem isn't that XML is too flexible; rather, it's > that no one has yet built something handy for making "everyone else's > representation" into "my representation". It doesn't seem like a light > project, but it doesn't seem impossible, either. I'm involved in the development of a markup language that is what could be described as weakly-typed, ie of the form:

I have often thought that it would be useful to have a standard transform between this and a strongly-typed form: bar baz Fairly simple XSLT for each direction of transform. Actually, I can think of a handful of simple little XSLT transforms that might be useful for this sort of thing: One could turn all elements into ... Another could turn all attributes into child elements and so on... James Tauber xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Fri Oct 8 01:41:23 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991007154332.00cd14d0@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 12:13 PM 10/7/99 -0700, John Evdemon wrote: >Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? I'm sure Java runs these days on the mainframe, so any one of the excellent Java parsers should do the trick. Or did you need PL/I? :) -Tim xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 8 02:20:20 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <199910080019.UAA12531@hesketh.net> At 05:13 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: >A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one >way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. We haven't left anything behind yet, not by a long run. What I'm talking about is a tool that would let you map: everybody else's damn structures -> my structures where you'd set things up so that you could create mappings one time, and then your processor could identify incoming structures and map them to what _you_ want. If you only want name/value pairs structured one way, that's fine. You can do this kind of work with transformations like XSLT and architectural forms. What I haven't seen so far is something that lets people take 'random' XML documents and say 'make it look like this' in a general way without requiring major pain and suffering, which I suspect is the root of your disillusionment. Even if such a tool only handled simple cases, it could do a lot of good if it had a reasonable interface and easy automation. Mike Hatalski pointed out IBM's XML Translator Generator - it's one option, though I'd like to see it given a prettier face. http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/aw.nsf/techmain/5F60964153C4274788256776006817AA I'm not ready to force the world into a single model for name-value pairs, sorry. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Daniel.Brickley at bristol.ac.uk Fri Oct 8 02:48:31 1999 From: Daniel.Brickley at bristol.ac.uk (Dan Brickley) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: <199910080019.UAA12531@hesketh.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Simon St.Laurent wrote: > At 05:13 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: > >A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one > >way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. > > We haven't left anything behind yet, not by a long run. What I'm talking > about is a tool that would let you map: > > everybody else's damn structures -> my structures > > where you'd set things up so that you could create mappings one time, and > then your processor could identify incoming structures and map them to what > _you_ want. I've been playing today with using XSL stylesheets to map arbitrary XML dialects into the RDF resource/property/value world. Seems quite feasible; took me (XSL newbie) at most a couple of hours from downloading XT (an XSL processor) and re-reading the XSL spec to having something that could take Netscape Netcentre's RSS data format (http://my.netscape.com/publish/) and output XML/RDF using the Dublin Core RDF property set. Doesn't feel like rocket science, though I've no real feel for the expressiveness of XSL. For other ways of writing similar data (eg. Microsoft CDF channels would be a good example) I'd just need to write a different XSL file. I could transform into either the same data model (directed labelled graphs) or into same data model _and_ same vocabulary (ie. use Dublin Core's notion of title/description/subject/date etc instead of Netscape or Microsoft's...). This feels like a nice spectrum of interoperability scenarios to be exploring... Dan xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sunker at telkom.net Fri Oct 8 03:05:14 1999 From: sunker at telkom.net (sunker@telkom.net) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Xsl - xml form pattern Message-ID: <61D3A6AB14FED211856500001C055D9633E002@FS01> Hi pale.., i got some problem with using xml & xsl (it was work done). the problem are from the input element tags, with the attribute type (text, checkbox, radio, button etc), when i defined the type attribute, the type button, radio, checkbox couldn't be transfrorm into type button from xsl, but transform into text type, why ? Help me ..., i attach this file for u all :)) Sunk http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/campus/7211 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: REG-XSL.XSL Type: text/xml Size: 4100 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991008/fb016e40/REG-XSL.xml -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: REG-XML.xml Type: text/xml Size: 3052 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991008/fb016e40/REG-XML.xml From ejfreed at infocanvas.com Fri Oct 8 06:17:23 1999 From: ejfreed at infocanvas.com (Erik James Freed) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: As for part of your problem: When you create an interface that has multiple syntactic constructs with redundant (non-orthoganal) semantics you pretty much guarantee frustrating extra work in designing, implementing, documenting, using, and maintaining that interface for all direct and indirect users of that interface for all time. Attributes in XML are a canonical example of this. The other parts of your problems such as using 'object' as a element name sound much more like bad design (got to live with it) or some extenuating circumstances not presented in your example. I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML I promise I will not whine about attributes in XML erik xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ebohlman at netcom.com Fri Oct 8 06:16:49 1999 From: ebohlman at netcom.com (Eric Bohlman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Kent Sievers wrote: > I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying to make sense out of data from multiple outside sources. Years ago when we started out we had our own proprietary way of representing "documents", and had to convert the different formats into ours in order to consume them. When we first heard about XML we got very excited and have been using it now for quite some time. But looking back, I have trouble seeing what it bought us. I will try to use a simple contrived example: The reason XML seems not to have bought you anything is that it's a technology, and as such is only capable of solving technical problems. The problems you have, OTOH, are essentially social and political problems that only look technical. Without knowing more about the inter- and intra-organizational relationships involved, I'm guessing that one of two things happened: 1) Failure to achieve true "buy-in" from the players involved. Their reactions look like a classic response to a "BOHICA"--an externally-imposed mandate with no perceived benefit to themselves. 2) Failure to communicate requirements in adequate detail, which is usually the result of failing to fully analyze the requirements oneself before impos^H communicating them to others. If you tell a bunch of outside sources "we want our data in XML format now" (leaving the people who have to actually implement the data production with the impression that you don't know much about XML other than that the press says it's the latest "killer app") and leave it at that, everyone will try to figure out what you mean, and they'll each wind up with a different understanding. "Figure out what I mean and just do it" simply doesn't work across customer boundaries, whether internal or external. Did you ever get representatives of your various data-generating organizations together with your own people to *jointly* hash out everybody's requirements and then come up with a specification (the requirements really do need to be worked out jointly, as they're more socio-political than technical; once they've been put down in detail and bought into, the translation to a spec can be done by one person or by representatives of only one player, as that's much more a pure technical endeavor)? Without such a process, the only other way to get a uniform data format is to create it in-house, spec it out in *excruciating* detail, down to the level of allowable positions for line breaks, amount of indentation to use, etc., and then inform your sources that they either observe it or quit doing business with you, and hope that they're staffed with drones who don't know the techniques of "creative rebellion." It sounds like there were mismatches between what you wanted and what their systems were capable of generating easily, and that those mismatches became apparent only *after* the new system was put in place. This is an absolutely classic project-management failure mode, and it's almost always the result of cutting corners somewhere. No technology can solve it; the best a technology can do is help you work around the after-effects of such a failure. Back in the 1980s some rather forward-looking people in the basically backward-looking US auto industry set out to gather and analyze real data in order to figure out why the Japanese auto industry was able to produce cars at much less cost. One of the things they discovered was that the costs attributable to engineering changes were far lower for the Japanese companies. They briefly considered that maybe Japanese engineers were just smarter, better educated, etc. than American engineers and therefore came up with fewer changes, but they stuck to their philosophy of only looking at real data rather than speculating, and they discovered that the Japanese companies were making *more* engineering changes than the US companies! They scratched their heads for a while, looked at more data, and finally came up with the answer to this seeming paradox by doing plots of engineering-change frequency vs. product lifecycle stage. It turned out that the Japanese companies were making most of their engineering changes very early on in the product-development cycle, whereas the American companies' engineering changes peaked in the early phases of production, right *after* all the tooling had been ordered, production lines committed, etc.! IOW, the Japanese companies were putting more effort upfront, when engineering changes were cheap (a few hundred dollars each) to make, while the US companies were itchy to get production started as quickly as possible (probably to impress Wall Street) and deferred a good chunk of the engineering effort to a point where changes were expensive (millions of dollars each) to make. (Legend has it that Detroit was full of tool-and-die companies who, when one of the Big Three ordered tooling for a new model, would supply it almost free, knowing that a few months later the manufacturer would be running to them looking for revised tooling on a need-it-yesterday basis, at which point the tooling companies could charge whatever they felt like). This is one of those problems that looks boring and trivial from a nerds-eye view, and therefore tends to get glossed over by nerds in favor of purely technical issues, but it's a real, *social* problem that requires hard work on the part of all the parties involved. It ultimately comes down to realizing that technology is a means, not an end, and that it's a means to the ends of the internal *customers* of IT, not the ends of IT itself. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net Fri Oct 8 07:10:51 1999 From: AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net (AlanM) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE68978BDA2B@MAIL> Hello. I am new to xml development. My application revolves round financial transactions, How do u suggest I start. Alan xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Fri Oct 8 07:27:57 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991007222807.00cf5dd0@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 10:39 AM 10/8/99 +0530, AlanM wrote: >Hello. >I am new to xml development. >My application revolves round financial transactions, >How do u suggest I start. Get some money. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Fri Oct 8 08:06:06 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. References: <3.0.32.19991007222807.00cf5dd0@pop.intergate.bc.ca> Message-ID: <37FD89AF.F7D702E9@pacbell.net> > >I am new to xml development. > >My application revolves round financial transactions, > >How do u suggest I start. > > Get some money. And as for how to do that, I think the official procedure is to hang out under a money tree over on Sand Hill Road, and wait for a Venture Capitalist to throw some money down to you. For developers outside of Silicon Valley, there may be some different procedure to follow. Or, airlines are glad to help. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken_north at csi.com Fri Oct 8 10:17:14 1999 From: ken_north at csi.com (Ken North) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <000601bf1166$9cf1ec60$4d12d3d4@laptop> Does the mainframe operating system include a Java Virtual Machine? -----Original Message----- From: John Evdemon To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Date: Thursday, October 07, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? Thanks! _______________________________________________________ Get Visto! Groups, event calendars, email, and more... Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ebohlman at netcom.com Fri Oct 8 10:49:13 1999 From: ebohlman at netcom.com (Eric Bohlman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: Accessing XML via Javascript? In-Reply-To: <37FD15A0.490859CD@my-dejanews.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Paul wrote: > I have searched several popular sites and the XML-DEV archive for > any developments on Javascript and XML, but have found very little > activity in the last many months. I suspect I am looking in the wrong > place, so I'd appreciate any links! > > What I am looking for is a means via javascript to access XML via a > high-level tagged notation (e.g. foo.bar[i].etc) rather than the > low-level > generic navigational style access imposed by DOM. The W3C is only now beginning formal activity on query languages for XML, which is really what you're talking about (they held a symposium last November where various organizations submitted position papers; you can read them on the W3C site). People have done implementations of a couple proposals, chiefly XQL and XML-QL, with more of the former; Microsoft's DOM implementation handles a subset of XQL in its selectSingleNode method, which is accessible via JS. I suspect most people are waiting to see what the W3C will propose, and were waiting for the XPath specification to stabilize (which it pretty much has), before putting much effort into actual implementations. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From digitome at iol.ie Fri Oct 8 10:57:41 1999 From: digitome at iol.ie (Sean Mc Grath) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:55 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. In-Reply-To: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE68978BDA2B@MAIL> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.19991008094037.009ed8e0@gpo.iol.ie> At 10:39 AM 10/8/99 +0530, you wrote: >Hello. >I am new to xml development. >My application revolves round financial transactions, >How do u suggest I start. Check out VCML - Venture Capitalist Markup Language:-) Seriously though: OTP = Open Trading Protocol OFX = Open Financial Exchange (seems to have gone a bit dead) CBL = Common Business Library XML/EDI Biztalk XFRML = Financial Reporting Markup Language As always with these things, the place to start is Robin Covers pages on http://www.oasis-open.org Word of warning: The normal laws of the XML 1.0 recommendation do not necessarily apply in the vicinity of large amounts of money. regards, Developers Day co-Chair WWW9, April 2000, Amsterdam http://www.www9.org xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jon.payne at integral.com Fri Oct 8 11:24:19 1999 From: jon.payne at integral.com (Jon Payne) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: >At 10:39 AM 10/8/99 +0530, you wrote: >>Hello. >>I am new to xml development. >>My application revolves round financial transactions, >>How do u suggest I start. > >Check out VCML - Venture Capitalist Markup Language:-) > >Seriously though: > OTP = Open Trading Protocol > OFX = Open Financial Exchange (seems to have gone a bit dead) > CBL = Common Business Library > XML/EDI > Biztalk > XFRML = Financial Reporting Markup Language > >As always with these things, the place to start is Robin >Covers pages on http://www.oasis-open.org > >Word of warning: The normal laws of the XML 1.0 recommendation >do not necessarily apply in the vicinity of large amounts >of money. If you are interested in XML for the capital markets, try FinXML (http://www.finxml.org) jon.payne@integral.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From nicmerr at microsoft.com Fri Oct 8 11:40:11 1999 From: nicmerr at microsoft.com (Nic Merriman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: Alan, You could try looking at http://www.microsoft.com/industry/finserv/initiatives/windowsdnafs/ DNAfs is a initiative driven by the major players in the banking industry to define as standard set of business schemas in XML for messaging between financial applications and components. DNAfs, at a basic level, defines a common business message set plus a standard set of interfaces that consume those messages. This will facilitate 'plug and play' between application components. It is hoped that vendors will adopt DNAfs and 'wrap' existing components with DNAfs interfaces to move this forward. The message set is based on OFX and Gold, it is called IFX, the Interactive Financial Exchange, as is based entirely on XML. See http://www.ifxforum.org/ for more details. DNAfs itself sits under the BizTalk umbrella. The BizTalk framework is an open imitative, started by Microsoft and supported by a wide range of organizations, from technology vendors like SAP and CommerceOne to technology users like Boeing and BP/Amoco. BizTalk is not a standards body it is a community of standards users, with the goal of driving the rapid, consistent adoption of XML to enable electronic commerce and application integration. It designed to facilitate application integration in a loosely coupled environment via the use of XML, and adoption of industry standards where appropriate(as in the case of financial services). For more information on this see www.biztalk.org. As part of this Microsoft have released piece of software, not a product, that is free to download that will assist in the development of applications that use the BizTalk framework. This is called the BizTalk Jumpstart kit, see http://www.biztalk.org/Resources/tools.asp Finally if you are NEW to XML a great place to start is http://msdn.microsoft.com/xml/default.asp Regards Nic Nic Merriman Technical Evangelist Financial Services - Business Solutions Group EMEA email. nicmerr@microsoft.com -----Original Message----- From: AlanM [mailto:AlanM@SYNECTICS.Soft.net] Sent: 08 October 1999 6:09 To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: New to XML Development. Hello. I am new to xml development. My application revolves round financial transactions, How do u suggest I start. Alan xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Fri Oct 8 13:05:40 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: "Kent Sievers"'s message of "Thu, 07 Oct 1999 16:05:44 -0600" References: Message-ID: "Kent Sievers" writes: > While these examples are totally contrived, they represent the > problem we are facing: Even after we have conversions that take care > of disagreements over tag names, data types and allowed values > (i.e. the point at which we would expect to reap a huge benefit from > XML) we are still doing as much conversion as when we had our own > proprietary (non-XML) format. Well, no, you might have had to do another level of processing on each file type as well -- one might have been comma-delimited, another might have been in INI file format, another might have been fixed-length fields, etc. Only after you managed to extract the raw information from each of these would you have had to do the same level that you're doing with XML right now. Your only problem is that XML is rather low level: it solves the lexical "how-do-I-represent-this" problem (see above), not the syntactic "what-do-I-represent" problem. XML is designed so that you can build layers on top of it for more specific kinds of data representation, such as object serialization. The two best candidates for representing objects right now are RDF and XMI (since they're both controlled by independent bodies). Personally, I prefer RDF for data exchange, because it's more Webby (XMI is just UML with tags instead of little pictures). Of course, that won't help you now, because you have a legacy problem that comes from your group's own underspecification: just saying "use XML" is like saying "use ASCII" or "use TCP/IP" -- it's a great start, but it's hardly enough by itself. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From greynolds at datalogics.com Fri Oct 8 15:17:36 1999 From: greynolds at datalogics.com (Reynolds, Gregg) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <51ED3F5356D8D011A0B1006097C3073401B16E4C@martinique> Yes; see http://www.s390.ibm.com/os390/os390elefeat.html#j > -----Original Message----- > From: Ken North [mailto:ken_north@csi.com] > Sent: Friday, October 08, 1999 3:25 AM > To: John Evdemon; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Mainframe-based parser? > > > Does the mainframe operating system include a Java Virtual Machine? > > -----Original Message----- > From: John Evdemon > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Date: Thursday, October 07, 1999 12:56 PM > Subject: Mainframe-based parser? > > > > Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? > > Thanks! > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dave at userland.com Fri Oct 8 15:33:53 1999 From: dave at userland.com (Dave Winer) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment References: Message-ID: <067601bf1192$3b0f7770$1918ccce@murphy> I've been following this thread started by Kent Sievers, and have a suggestion. It's OK to be disillusioned, but what are you going to do about it? My suggestion -- openly document the format you use and show people how to use your data (it has to be public, or at least a demo has to be). So many formats are closed, inaccessible, covered by marketing confusion. (I went to the Novell site for the XML directory stuff, and couldn't find a single example, much less any real data I could build an app off of.) http://www.novell.com/products/nds/dirxml/index.html Where are the examples? Where are the live servers we can test against? Where's the sample code that works? This is still a standards body, not a development community. Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jevdemon at acm.org Fri Oct 8 15:37:38 1999 From: jevdemon at acm.org (John Evdemon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <37F28C1F000CD5D1@isocor6.visto.com> (added by postmaster@isocor6.visto.com) Its an MVS system. I used to work on MVS during the pre-Java days. I've done a lot of work with Java, but not in a mainframe environment. Is there an MVS JVM? -----Original Message----- From: Ken North Sent: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 01:24:54 -0700 To: jevdemon@acm.org, xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: Mainframe-based parser? Does the mainframe operating system include a Java Virtual Machine? -----Original Message----- From: John Evdemon To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Date: Thursday, October 07, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? Thanks! _______________________________________________________ Get Visto! Groups, event calendars, email, and more... Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) _______________________________________________________ Get Visto! Groups, event calendars, email, and more... Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From stacy_whitney at stercomm.com Fri Oct 8 15:55:23 1999 From: stacy_whitney at stercomm.com (Stacy Whitney) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. Message-ID: <01BF1173.20B0C470.stacy_whitney@stercomm.com> Another general translator is available -- GENTRAN from Sterling Commerce. This product has a GUI mapper that lets you 'link' from someone else's data representation to your own (and vice versa). It understands DTDs, and can build a basic map structure for one side of a mapping from a DTD file. It can translate between XML, positional, and EDI syntaxes (I may be leaving a few out.) GENTRAN's XML support is currently on the NT platform, with plans to migrate it to our other GENTRAN platforms. You can find information on the GENTRAN products on the NT platform at http://www.stercomm.com/pdsv/ploc/gent/wnnt.html -Stacy -----Original Message----- From: Simon St.Laurent [SMTP:simonstl@simonstl.com] Sent: Thursday, October 07, 1999 8:45 PM To: Kent Sievers; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: Dissillusioned about interoperability. At 05:13 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: >A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one >way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. We haven't left anything behind yet, not by a long run. What I'm talking about is a tool that would let you map: everybody else's damn structures -> my structures where you'd set things up so that you could create mappings one time, and then your processor could identify incoming structures and map them to what _you_ want. If you only want name/value pairs structured one way, that's fine. You can do this kind of work with transformations like XSLT and architectural forms. What I haven't seen so far is something that lets people take 'random' XML documents and say 'make it look like this' in a general way without requiring major pain and suffering, which I suspect is the root of your disillusionment. Even if such a tool only handled simple cases, it could do a lot of good if it had a reasonable interface and easy automation. Mike Hatalski pointed out IBM's XML Translator Generator - it's one option, though I'd like to see it given a prettier face. http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/aw.nsf/techmain/5F60964153C427478825677600681 7AA I'm not ready to force the world into a single model for name-value pairs, sorry. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com Fri Oct 8 15:58:33 1999 From: Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com (Arnold, Curt) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? Message-ID: <61DAD58E8F4ED211AC8400A0C9B468731AAFC0@THOR> John Evdemon [mailto:jevdemon@acm.org] wrote: Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? The description for the IBM Parser in C++ at http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/xml4c says that it supports OS/390 Open Edition. It would require you to download the source and build it using a C++ compiler and is represented as not being throughly tested. Expat in C at http://www.jclark.com is also available in source code form that could possibly be built on a mainframe. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dave at userland.com Fri Oct 8 16:05:42 1999 From: dave at userland.com (Dave Winer) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment References: <067601bf1192$3b0f7770$1918ccce@murphy> Message-ID: <068901bf1196$a29566d0$1918ccce@murphy> More thoughts about this. I just read Tim Berners-Lee's book, Weaving the Web. There are so many lessons there, esp about W3C, between the lines. I admire TBL for his work in defining HTTP, HTML and URIs. Totally. I was working in similar areas, but I didn't believe in hypertext the way Nelson described it or the way the web defines it. Ooops. I was wrong about desktop publishing too.;-> So hats off to TBL, the web is one of the truly remarkable inventions of our generation. Amazing stuff. By coincidence, I also did some work on cookies this morning, and in doing the work I referred back to the original Netscape document about cookies: http://home.netscape.com/newsref/std/cookie_spec.html Those were the days! Such low-tech easy stuff. No DTDs, schemas, no need to render cookies in browsers. It just happened. One day there was a spec for cookies and an implementation and within weeks the cookies were in the HTTP headers. And look at all that has been accomplished with them. Without them the web wouldn't be a commercial medium. And I'd argue that without them you could never do the collaborative web that TBL says is the real vision of the web (and I totally agree!). Moral of the story --> let's build more apps, fewer specs. Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jlapp at webMethods.com Fri Oct 8 16:35:50 1999 From: jlapp at webMethods.com (Joe Lapp) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991008103629.013bed60@nexus.webmethods.com> webMethods is having a lot of success with using XML for interoperability. XML is capable of expressing as large a variety of incompatible data formats as we alway have, so XML by itself obviously does not solve the problem. Here are the ingredients that solve the problem: (1) XML is extremely well-hyped. By virtue of having a standard syntactic representation freely available everywhere, we'll be able to get any XML data into any application. (2) Because XML allows you to label its constituent data, it is possible to create tools that generically between XML document types. Poorly designed XML does not have this benefit, though. Put (1) and (2) together and you can get powerful any-to-any mapping between XML document types. But these leaves unaddressed mapping into and out of the various protocols (regardless of their data formats) and between XML and other data formats, creating opportunities for companies such as ours. -- Joe Lapp (Looking for some good people to Senior Engineer help create XML technologies that http://www.webMethods.com connect businesses to businesses jlapp@webMethods.com over the web.) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk Fri Oct 8 17:10:50 1999 From: msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk (Miles Sabin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment Message-ID: Dave Winer wrote, > By coincidence, I also did some work on cookies this > morning, and in doing the work I referred back to the > original Netscape document about cookies: > > http://home.netscape.com/newsref/std/cookie_spec.html > > Those were the days! Such low-tech easy stuff. No > DTDs, schemas, no need to render cookies in browsers. > It just happened. Yes, and a right mess it was too: originally a 2 digit year (when did that spec date from? the early '90s!), HTTP header folding not supported, and a whole raft of security issues. RFC2109 was supposed to be the cleaned up version but it still had a lot of holes and has never been fully implemented (except maybe in Lynx), and the current Internet-Draft has reached it's twelfth revision after a couple of years work, mostly caused by the desire to try and remain interoperable with Netscapes broken design. All in all, the cookie spec is about the *best* example you come up with of something that would have benefitted from a more formal process ;-) Cheers, Miles -- Miles Sabin Cromwell Media Internet Systems Architect 5/6 Glenthorne Mews +44 (0)181 410 2230 London, W6 0LJ msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk England xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Fri Oct 8 17:09:08 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Mainframe-based parser? References: <51ED3F5356D8D011A0B1006097C3073401B16E4C@martinique> Message-ID: <00e001bf119e$3a09f7e0$8d066d8c@sinica.edu.tw> > > Is anyone aware of a mainframe-based XML parser? There are older versions of OmniMark available for some mainframes (VMS and MVS I think). It is possible to write a front end to make OmniMark accept XML (except numeric character references may cause a problem, and it needs to have a DTD). That may be a possibility. Contact www.omnimark.com I guess. Rick Jelliffe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Fri Oct 8 17:14:09 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment References: <3.0.32.19991008103629.013bed60@nexus.webmethods.com> Message-ID: <001701bf119f$611a5090$c5010180@p197> > (2) Because XML allows you to label its constituent data, it is possible to > create tools that generically between XML document types. Poorly designed > XML does not have this benefit, though. Generically map ? Such tools never actually work that well in real business. There generic rules are never anything like the business rules you actually want, you cant just map because the names are the same. However, it can form a good basis, but you than have to manually define the mapping, adding conditions etc. > Put (1) and (2) together and you can get powerful any-to-any mapping > between XML document types. But these leaves unaddressed mapping into and > out of the various protocols (regardless of their data formats) and between > XML and other data formats, creating opportunities for companies such as ours. Although this is an fairly established/old market populated by tools like Mercator, Mentor etc etc. Well established EDI mapping tools that now support XML. > -- > Joe Lapp (Looking for some good people to > Senior Engineer help create XML technologies that > http://www.webMethods.com connect businesses to businesses > jlapp@webMethods.com over the web.) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Fri Oct 8 17:32:08 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:56 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment References: <067601bf1192$3b0f7770$1918ccce@murphy> Message-ID: <37FE0CC6.F5B@hiwaay.net> Dave Winer wrote: > > This is still a standards body, not a development community. That's the rub. You say you need cooperation. On what? How? Quit writing standards. You aren't empowered for that. Start writing specs but first do a better job at writing requirements. Specs are easy to share. Start implementing specs and modifying them based on results. Take the specs to a legitimate and competent standards bodies for publication. Consortia are a good source of specs because their members have customers with immediate requirements. They are a bad way to write standards because the customer requirements and the vendor interests dominate the discussion with short range objectives. Inner loop and outer loop. The inner loop is what people refer to when they talk about "internet time". Think about nesting internet time inside project time and put that outer loop in the hands of organizations that are empowered and practiced for long term projects. Quit cheerleading people and start cheerleading requirements. The way out of disillusionment is to practice collaboration and understand what is easy and quick versus what is hard but stable: learning. Enterprises that thrive learn. The web can't do that for you. It destabilizes your processes and drives you back and forth, willy nilly across the same ground. It does not produce coherence. It wastes energy. It repeats history. Worse, it loses referential integrity of concepts so learning is serendipitous at best and superstitious at worst. The web does not learn. It imitates. len xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Fri Oct 8 17:32:43 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment References: <3.0.32.19991008103629.013bed60@nexus.webmethods.com> <001701bf119f$611a5090$c5010180@p197> Message-ID: <37FE0D6D.3441@hiwaay.net> Richard Anderson wrote: > Generically map ? Such tools never actually work that well in real business. > There generic rules are never anything like the business rules you actually > want, you cant just map because the names are the same. However, it can form > a good basis, but you than have to manually define the mapping, adding > conditions etc. You have to understand namespaces in XML the way a relational designer understands recordsets and aliases. Then apply indexes. len xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rgl at decisionsoft.com Fri Oct 8 17:36:54 1999 From: rgl at decisionsoft.com (Richard Lanyon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: <199910080019.UAA12531@hesketh.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Simon St.Laurent wrote: > At 05:13 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: > >A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one > >way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. > We haven't left anything behind yet, not by a long run. What I'm talking > about is a tool that would let you map: > > everybody else's damn structures -> my structures You're going to need to do this with a transformation language of some sort - no other solution is going to be flexible enough to deal with the variety of formats in which data is likely to appear. I don't think this is a problem with XML, however, because I don't think specifying structures was the problem XML set out to answer. Indeed, a system rigorous enough to give only one layout for arbitrary data would probably be so complex that no-one would ever use it. The main advantages are: a) XML frees us from writing new parsers to accompany every new structure. b) XML is sufficiently familiar to anyone who's used HTML that it might actually catch on. The real problem is thus that writing transformations seems so painful, and that's really a fault with much of the current software available to do transformations. I'd like to think that XML Script (www.xmlscript.org) is a significant improvement in this field. > Mike Hatalski pointed out IBM's XML Translator Generator - it's one option, > though I'd like to see it given a prettier face. > http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/aw.nsf/techmain/5F60964153C4274788256776006817AA The problem being that this is essentially a DTD-to-DTD mapper. Lots of XML "out there" in the real world is going to be DTD-less or have very underspecified DTDs. More importantly, you're often going to find that you want your transformation to depend on the content/attributes of an element, rather than the element type. This is certainly the case with

Where you need to look at the `type' attribute to do your transformation. This is comparatively straightforward in XML Script, where you can do things like: <_if test="object.type == myType"> or <_foreach object="object{.type == myType}"> -- Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan DecisionSoft Ltd. | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jlapp at webMethods.com Fri Oct 8 17:43:45 1999 From: jlapp at webMethods.com (Joe Lapp) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Moving beyond disillusionment Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991008114359.029b8850@nexus.webmethods.com> Excellent points, all. Comments below... At 04:11 PM 10/8/99 +0100, Richard Anderson wrote: >Generically map ? Such tools never actually work that well in real business. >There generic rules are never anything like the business rules you actually >want, you cant just map because the names are the same. However, it can form >a good basis, but you than have to manually define the mapping, adding >conditions etc. Yes, this is definitely an infinitely huge problem. You can pick a market space and continually strive to genericize the most urgent transformations of this space. Meanwhile, you provide mechanisms for inserting hand-crafted conversions where they cannot yet be configured. >Although this is an fairly established/old market populated by tools like >Mercator, Mentor etc etc. Well established EDI mapping tools that now >support XML. Another excellent point. But there's more to business than just a product. It needs to easily fit into the right places, to satisfy the most urgent needs of the space, to be known to customers when they need it, to be priced favorably, to have the right kind of support, to have the right plan for embracing the future, to be managed well, and so on. -- Joe Lapp (Looking for some good people to Senior Engineer help create XML technologies that http://www.webMethods.com connect businesses to businesses jlapp@webMethods.com over the web.) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at prescod.net Fri Oct 8 18:23:39 1999 From: paul at prescod.net (Paul Prescod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. References: Message-ID: <37FE17F4.A23F0297@prescod.net> Kent Sievers wrote: > > A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that > only had one way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is > what we left behind. Okay, but did your old language have a) parsers in dozens of programming languages? b) transformation languages that could map between your name/value pairs and other people's? c) a schema language for defining the allowed contents of the name/value pairs? d) support for deeply hierarchical and linked values? If you don't need these features then I think that there would be no shame in going back to what you were using before. Just be clear on what you would be giving up. Paul Prescod xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From bsteele at tdiinc.com Fri Oct 8 18:35:49 1999 From: bsteele at tdiinc.com (Robert Steele) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: unsubscribe References: <512EBEF97F02D311B89900A0C9D17760122499@thor.operations.bluestone.com> Message-ID: <37FE1D04.6E7903A3@tdiinc.com> unsubscribe -- xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 8 19:10:12 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: DTD tools Message-ID: <199910081709.NAA13842@hesketh.net> I'm writing about a lot of DTD-intensive work, and I'm surprised by how few tools appear to be available for working with XML DTD's. I can write some of the code myself, but I'm wondering if it's already out there. Here's my wish list - I'd love to know if anyone else either has these tools or would find them useful. * DTD normalizer - takes a DTD (including the internal subset?) and processes out all duplicate declarations (overrides) and sorts out parameter entities, returning a 'final' copy of the DTD the parser will actually use. * DTD document validator - takes an arbitrary DTD and validates a document against it. The DTD needn't be the one specified by the document. (I asked for this one earlier, and there doesn't seem to be much.) * DTD subset guide - takes a DTD and lets you chop out the parts you don't want, while preserving compatibility with the original. * automated mapping - takes documents arriving in one structure and maps them to another. Not necessarily DTD-dependent, but useful, especially if given a friendly interface. (Some possibilities have emerged in the disillusionment discussion.) * DTD map builder - produces a graphic representation of DTDs that use external resources, identifying dependencies between modules and things like overrides. (Extensibility's XML Authority already provides useful content model maps, but the outline for modules doesn't identify dependencies.) * DTD extensions - standardized conventions for data typing within DTDs (Extensibility's XML Authority has some very useful ones) and namespace prefix mapping within DTDs and processors for applying these extensions to documents. Maybe this is all too much work for what I hear described more and more as a legacy technology, but DTDs are a technology we have today, that's well understood, and not very hard to convert to future schema approaches. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Fri Oct 8 19:26:37 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277EAF@MDYNYCMSX1> >OTP = Open Trading Protocol >OFX = Open Financial Exchange (seems to have gone a bit dead) >CBL = Common Business Library >XML/EDI >Biztalk >XFRML = Financial Reporting Markup Language To add to Sean's list: FpML = "Financial Product Markup Language" www.fpml.org FiXML = "Financial Information Exchange Protocol (FIX)" www.fixprotocol.org FinXML = www.finxml.com I suppose YAFXML will be next. But seriously, if any xml-dev people have opinions on or involvement in these last three, I'd be interested in hearing about it. Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Fri Oct 8 19:44:36 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: DTD tools Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277EB0@MDYNYCMSX1> >* DTD normalizer - takes a DTD (including the internal subset?) and >processes out all duplicate declarations (overrides) and sorts out >parameter entities, returning a 'final' copy of the DTD the parser will >actually use. With a command like the following, James Clarke's spam will output the input with all the declarations in its internal subset. I have a dtdnorm.bat file that sends that to a perl script that outputs the declarations into their own DTD file. Being an SGML tool, the xml.dcl declaration is necessary and duplicate declarations aren't allowed. spam -mms -p -p xml.dcl test.xml >* automated mapping - takes documents arriving in one structure and >maps them to another. Not necessarily DTD-dependent, but useful, >especially if given a friendly interface. (Some possibilities have >emerged in the disillusionment discussion.) Maybe I misunderstand what you're looking for, but the more I look at XSLT, the more I think it will be great for this. I'm sure plenty of vendors will get in touch with you to tell your "Our X-Whatever product sort of kind of does everything you listed, and more! Well, the next release will!" Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob "The elements be kind to thee, and make thy spirits all of comfort!" Anthony and Cleopatra, III ii xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at prescod.net Fri Oct 8 21:11:40 1999 From: paul at prescod.net (Paul Prescod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. References: Message-ID: <37FD83A4.FA9739A3@prescod.net> Kent Sievers wrote: > > I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying > to make sense out of data from multiple outside sources. Years > ago when we started out we had our own proprietary way of > representing "documents", and had to convert the different > formats into ours in order to consume them. Without getting into philosophy and magic let me point out that you've won two things: * you know longer have to write parsers for these "properietary languages" * there are dozens of tools for doing standardized transformations between these sorts of languages -- including XSLT So XML is a nice simple specification that makes your life a little bit easier. It doesn't magically solve the entire "interoperability problem." It solves one little layer. Things like RDF, HyTime, XLink and so forth solve other (also fairly thin) layers. I'm sorry it is so often sold as doing more. Paul Prescod xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From donpark at docuverse.com Fri Oct 8 22:11:33 1999 From: donpark at docuverse.com (Don Park) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. In-Reply-To: <37FD89AF.F7D702E9@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <000e01bf11c9$63da1ac0$b69918d1@docuverse1> >> Get some money. > >And as for how to do that, I think the official procedure is to >hang out under a money tree over on Sand Hill Road, and wait >for a Venture Capitalist to throw some money down to you. Err, correct procedure is to shake the tree until one falls out of the tree and then enchant them with hype words like 'XML', 'XSL', and 'e-commerce' before they recover from the fall. Be warned that some of them are mighty hungry so you have to feed them one or two of your limbs. Best, Don Park - mailto:donpark@docuverse.com Docuverse - http://www.docuverse.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From andrewl at microsoft.com Fri Oct 8 22:47:27 1999 From: andrewl at microsoft.com (Andrew Layman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: New to XML Development. Message-ID: <5BF896CAFE8DD111812400805F1991F712E17427@RED-MSG-08> RE "OFX = Open Financial Exchange (seems to have gone a bit dead)", see http://www.bitsinfo.org/ifx/index.htm . xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Sat Oct 9 01:44:28 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Latest from Cambridge Message-ID: <199910082344.TAA31323@hesketh.net> http://www.w3.org/TR/schema-arch "The Cambridge Communique" XML meets RDF meets all kinds of 'extension mechanisms' for XML Schema and XSLT. That sounds like a monster movie, but it seems accurate, if too short. Should be interesting weekend reading! Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tanson at mail.pcc.gov.tw Sat Oct 9 11:20:44 1999 From: tanson at mail.pcc.gov.tw (tanson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: What is xml repository? Message-ID: <37FF09E7.66ECF452@mail.pcc.gov.tw> Hi: I am studing XML now. Who can tell me What is XML Repository definition? What is it's mechanism? Best wishes, tanson 10/09/99 -- xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ To (un)subscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; (un)subscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tanson at mail.pcc.gov.tw Sat Oct 9 11:19:53 1999 From: tanson at mail.pcc.gov.tw (tanson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: <37FF09A9.A9F046D6@mail.pcc.gov.tw> Hi: I am studing XML now. Who can tell me What is XML Repository definition? What is it's mechanism? Best wishes, tanson 10/09/99 -- xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ To (un)subscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; (un)subscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Sat Oct 9 14:51:36 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. Message-ID: <001801bf1258$4b859190$50f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> From: Dan Brickley >I've been playing today with using XSL stylesheets to map arbitrary XML >dialects into the RDF resource/property/value world. Seems quite >feasible; I've been telling my students that, to a certain extent, RDF merely involves making certain of the semantics that are implicit in any DTD explicit (and thereby computer-processable). As far as this is true, people do not need to author data in RDF XML, since they can transform into it. What is more important is that designers of a DTD should consider whether the DTD (and documentation) has everything in it to allow the document to be satisfactorily transformed into RDF XML if needed. And I suspect that this ultimately boils down to using well-known controlled vocabularies which have accepted names (formal public identifiers such as URNs) and also to using as specific element types as possible. Does this sound right? Rick Jelliffe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From karthik at india.adventnet.com Sat Oct 9 18:33:39 1999 From: karthik at india.adventnet.com (karthik) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:57 2004 Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: <37FF7163.87751728@india.adventnet.com> unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From webdev at bluprints.com Sun Oct 10 22:18:29 1999 From: webdev at bluprints.com (Henrik) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Sv: Dissillusioned about interoperability. References: Message-ID: <00a601bf135b$f2e35680$4600a8c0@bluprints.com> How about XSLT ? ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Lanyon To: Sent: Friday, October 08, 1999 5:32 PM Subject: Re: Dissillusioned about interoperability. > On Thu, 7 Oct 1999, Simon St.Laurent wrote: > > At 05:13 PM 10/7/99 -0600, Kent Sievers wrote: > > > >A tool like, say, a markup language other than XML? One that only had one > > >way to mark up a simple name/value pair? That is what we left behind. > > > We haven't left anything behind yet, not by a long run. What I'm talking > > about is a tool that would let you map: > > > > everybody else's damn structures -> my structures > > You're going to need to do this with a transformation language of some > sort - no other solution is going to be flexible enough to deal with the > variety of formats in which data is likely to appear. I don't think this > is a problem with XML, however, because I don't think specifying > structures was the problem XML set out to answer. Indeed, a system > rigorous enough to give only one layout for arbitrary data would probably > be so complex that no-one would ever use it. The main advantages are: > > a) XML frees us from writing new parsers to accompany every new structure. > b) XML is sufficiently familiar to anyone who's used HTML that it might > actually catch on. > > The real problem is thus that writing transformations seems so painful, > and that's really a fault with much of the current software available to > do transformations. I'd like to think that XML Script (www.xmlscript.org) > is a significant improvement in this field. > > > Mike Hatalski pointed out IBM's XML Translator Generator - it's one option, > > though I'd like to see it given a prettier face. > > http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/aw.nsf/techmain/5F60964153C4274788256776006817AA > > The problem being that this is essentially a DTD-to-DTD mapper. Lots of > XML "out there" in the real world is going to be DTD-less or have very > underspecified DTDs. More importantly, you're often going to find that you > want your transformation to depend on the content/attributes of an > element, rather than the element type. This is certainly the case with >

> Where you need to look at the `type' attribute to do your transformation. > This is comparatively straightforward in XML Script, where you can do > things like: > <_if test="object.type == myType"> > or > <_foreach object="object{.type == myType}"> > > -- > Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" > XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan > DecisionSoft Ltd. | > > > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jtauber at jtauber.com Mon Oct 11 07:50:19 1999 From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: FOP 0.11.0 released Message-ID: <002d01bf13ab$af59da60$0300000a@cygnus.uwa.edu.au> http://www.jtauber.com/fop/ Major code changes. The way in which the formatting object tree creates the area tree has radically changed to allow much easier support for keeps, etc in the future. Numerous bugs were introduced (hence the delay in release) but even more fixed. In particular, line breaks work within inline-sequences now. FOP now uses namespaces. The prefix "fo" is no longer hard-coded. This version supports all of the Latin-1 characters now as well as some others available in PDF. Font metrics and character encoding mappings are specified in XML at compile time. Thanks to Fotis Jannidis for doing the conversion to XML for me. Basic display-graphic support is now in, but I consider it unusable at present. James xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Mon Oct 11 09:38:51 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: Richard Lanyon's message of "Fri, 8 Oct 1999 16:32:12 +0100 (BST)" References: Message-ID: >>>>> Richard Lanyon : > a) XML frees us from writing new parsers to accompany every new > structure. No it doesn't. Not with the level of the current tools. We're replacing our old lisp-oid format, parsed with a PCCTS recursive descent parser, with XML, based on a C++ SAX wrapper over expat. And the handwritten state machine logic of the DocumentHandler feels like a step back from the EBNF specification of our old format. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rgl at decisionsoft.com Mon Oct 11 10:57:37 1999 From: rgl at decisionsoft.com (Richard Lanyon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Sv: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: <00a601bf135b$f2e35680$4600a8c0@bluprints.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 10 Oct 1999, Henrik wrote: > How about XSLT ? We have a white paper comparing XML Script and XSL(T) on our website: http://www.xmlscript.org/xsl.html Without wishing to start a flame war, it seems to me that XSL's roots in stylesheet languages mean that some sorts of programming are unecessarily awkward. It's difficult to be objective about ease-of-use in different programming languages, especially when you're better acquainted with one than another, but I personally find XSL's declarative syntax rather unwieldy. YMMV. -- Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan DecisionSoft Ltd. | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From richard at cogsci.ed.ac.uk Mon Oct 11 12:54:38 1999 From: richard at cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: DTD tools In-Reply-To: Simon St.Laurent's message of Fri, 08 Oct 1999 13:12:05 -0400 Message-ID: <199910111054.LAA00245@rhymer144.cogsci.ed.ac.uk> > * DTD document validator - takes an arbitrary DTD and validates a document > against it. The DTD needn't be the one specified by the document. (I > asked for this one earlier, and there doesn't seem to be much.) LT XML can do this. When you open a document, you can specify a doctype structure to use with it. To do it from the command line, you need a (trivial) XML document that refers to the desired DTD, and give that as the value of the -d argument to xmlnorm. For example, if you want to validate foo.xml against bar.dtd, you need a file (say bar.xml) that contains . Then you do xmlnorm -V -d bar.xml foo.xml -- Richard xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at prescod.net Mon Oct 11 13:20:01 1999 From: paul at prescod.net (Paul Prescod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. References: Message-ID: <3801C782.6900112B@prescod.net> Steinar Bang wrote: > > We're replacing our old lisp-oid format, parsed with a PCCTS recursive > descent parser, with XML, based on a C++ SAX wrapper over expat. > > And the handwritten state machine logic of the DocumentHandler feels > like a step back from the EBNF specification of our old format. If this is a problem then why are you using an event-handler based tool instead of a tree tool? Or if you would prefer something in-between, what do you have in mind? Paul Prescod xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From archiver at db.geocrawler.com Mon Oct 11 15:27:33 1999 From: archiver at db.geocrawler.com (Micah Brown) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Looking for an XML author Message-ID: <199910111328.GAA01167@db.geocrawler.com> This message was sent from Geocrawler.com by "Micah Brown" Be sure to reply to that address. Im looking for an experienced XML programmer/writer to author an XML book for a very well established web development series through Prentice Hall. The book will be approximatly 200 pages in length. And yes you will be paid for doing this based on a royalty plan. These types of books are for the intermediate level reader. If your interested please email me and we can discuss this further. Email me at grafix@he.net Geocrawler.com - The Knowledge Archive xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tangivass at compuserve.com Mon Oct 11 16:12:55 1999 From: tangivass at compuserve.com (Tangi Vass) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: DOM serialization Message-ID: <006f01bf13f3$62e0bee0$cc8c050a@parisdev> Hi, Is it possible to serialize/deserialize DOM trees into/from binary format? I have multiple XML and XSL files, and don't to want to spend time parsing them for each XML/XSL combinaison. Tangi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991011/bf4fab3d/attachment.htm From ldodds at ingenta.com Mon Oct 11 16:44:52 1999 From: ldodds at ingenta.com (Leigh Dodds) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: DOM serialization In-Reply-To: <006f01bf13f3$62e0bee0$cc8c050a@parisdev> Message-ID: <004401bf13f6$ed5f6dc0$ab20268a@pc-lrd.bath.ac.uk> >Is it possible to serialize/deserialize DOM trees into/from binary format? >I have multiple XML and XSL files, and don't to want to spend time parsing them for >each XML/XSL combinaison. You could implement a proprietary method to do so, but there is as yet no standardised method. I refer you to the following thread in the archive on binary encoding of XML for communication: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Sep-1999/0766.html Particularly: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Sep-1999/0839.html L. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Tue Oct 12 06:57:43 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: DOM serialization Message-ID: <000301bf1471$855e6840$2df96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> Because DOM is an interface, you don't know details of its implementation. It may be that the cost of generating or parsing XML is small compared to the constant cost of accessing the DOM data or building the DOM data. You cannot save a DOM tree simply by saving every byte between two addresses, in particular (unless the implementation allows this and provdes some non-DOM mechanism). If the binary format of the document preserves lots of pointers, then it may be that the binary form is larger than the XML form. This may take more time to parse (i.e., deserialize), even though binary. Rick Jelliffe -----Original Message----- From: Tangi Vass To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Date: Monday, 11 October 1999 22:30 Subject: DOM serialization Hi, Is it possible to serialize/deserialize DOM trees into/from binary format? I have multiple XML and XSL files, and don't to want to spend time parsing them for each XML/XSL combinaison. Tangi xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Tue Oct 12 09:37:12 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Higher level parsing (Was: Dissillusioned...) In-Reply-To: Paul Prescod's message of "Mon, 11 Oct 1999 07:18:26 -0400" References: <3801C782.6900112B@prescod.net> Message-ID: >>>>> Paul Prescod : > Steinar Bang wrote: >> >> We're replacing our old lisp-oid format, parsed with a PCCTS recursive >> descent parser, with XML, based on a C++ SAX wrapper over expat. >> >> And the handwritten state machine logic of the DocumentHandler feels >> like a step back from the EBNF specification of our old format. > If this is a problem then why are you using an event-handler based > tool instead of a tree tool? Because I'm using the xml to build up memory data structures, and I would like to avoid creating big temporary data structures. > Or if you would prefer something in-between, what do you have in > mind? What I've been thinking, is that much of the state-machine logic I'm writing could be machine generated from some sort of description. A DTD could provide the bit of the logic that deals with document syntax checking, but there isn't any way to associate semantic actions with the DTD element definitions. Besides semantic actions for sub-elements may be different based on what parent it has. Maybe something like the XSL queries, combined with semantic actions in a different namespace...? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Tue Oct 12 13:15:46 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: AttributeList in C++ SAX In-Reply-To: Steinar Bang's message of "06 Oct 1999 14:56:49 +0200" References: <002601bf0f0a$26b94970$c5010180@p197> Message-ID: >>>>> Steinar Bang : > The good thing about my string as argument alternative is the > possibility for minimizing string copies. I can UTF-8 decode > directly into the string I use all the way into callback class > arguments (ie. one copy may be enough). And this still is valid for my use of the attributes. However, my reasons for "going SAX" was to be able at one point, to throw away my own SAX implementation, or use a different parser altogether (e.g. to one supporting namespace expansion, and/or one doing validation). And at last count 2 out of 4 existing C++ SAX implementations were returning "const string&". One of the two even had customers using the SAX API, so returning "const string&" is what I'll do as well. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jes at kuantech.com Tue Oct 12 22:23:34 1999 From: jes at kuantech.com (Jeffrey E. Sussna) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: Dissillusioned about interoperability. In-Reply-To: <37FD83A4.FA9739A3@prescod.net> Message-ID: <000501bf14ee$ee667fd0$0f36a8c0@quokka.com> Paul, This is one of the most concise expressions I've ever heard of both the power and limitations of the entire XML universe. Thank you. Jeff Sussna > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > Paul Prescod > Sent: Thursday, October 07, 1999 10:40 PM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Dissillusioned about interoperability. > > > Kent Sievers wrote: > > > > I am working on a project that is heavily involved with trying > > to make sense out of data from multiple outside sources. Years > > ago when we started out we had our own proprietary way of > > representing "documents", and had to convert the different > > formats into ours in order to consume them. > > Without getting into philosophy and magic let me point out that you've > won two things: > > * you know longer have to write parsers for these "properietary > languages" > > * there are dozens of tools for doing standardized transformations > between these sorts of languages -- including XSLT > > So XML is a nice simple specification that makes your life a > little bit > easier. It doesn't magically solve the entire "interoperability > problem." It solves one little layer. Things like RDF, > HyTime, XLink and > so forth solve other (also fairly thin) layers. I'm sorry it > is so often > sold as doing more. > > Paul Prescod > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, > mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and > on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mlepley at worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 13 00:36:33 1999 From: mlepley at worldnet.att.net (Mike Lepley) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:58 2004 Subject: IBM xml4j parser vs. Datachannel Message-ID: <006d01bf1502$a49c7c60$e5ea4e0c@Lepley> At our firm we are considering using the XML4j parser. The XML4j parser has gotten some excellent reviews. That is why I cannot understand the test results that I've done myself. For example: IBM XML4j --------- Time to File size | Tags | visit all -------------------------------- 3kb 100 .55s 2,229kb 7000 8.51s 6,368 20000 115.29s and the Datachannel Datachannel ----------- Time to File size | Tags | visit all ------------------------------- 3kb 100 .13 2,229kb 7000 2.99s 6,368kb 20000 9.76s And I have many more data points all the way to a 10MB file. Has anyone else experienced such poor results with the IBM parser? Why is there such a difference? I've included my sample code for the XML4j parser. Thanks in advance! Mike --------------------------------- import java.io.*; import java.net.*; import com.ibm.xml.parsers.*; // For the IBM Parser stuff import org.w3c.dom.Attr; import org.w3c.dom.Document; import org.w3c.dom.NamedNodeMap; import org.w3c.dom.Node; // The W3C definition of a node import org.w3c.dom.NodeList; public class DOMibm4j { int ELEMENT_NODE = 1; public static String szText = ""; Document doc; public DOMibm4j (String file, String sch /**, RichEdit re */) { try com.ibm.xml.parsers.DOMParser parser = new com.ibm.xml.parsers.DOMParser (); parser.setValidating (false); parser.parse (file + ".x"); doc = parser.getDocument (); } catch (Exception e) { e.printStackTrace(); return; } // Let's loop through all the nodes and look at them... for (int i=0; i < doc.getChildNodes().getLength (); i++) { Visit (doc.getChildNodes ().item(i), 0); } } public void Visit (Node node, int spaces) { // Recursively visits every node under this top node // Make sure that it's not an attribute or CDATA or processing instruction, etc. if (node.getNodeType () == ELEMENT_NODE) { int length = node.getChildNodes().getLength (); for (int i=0; i < length; i++) { Visit (node.getChildNodes().item(i), spaces+5); } } } } xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ejfreed at infocanvas.com Wed Oct 13 01:13:06 1999 From: ejfreed at infocanvas.com (Erik James Freed) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: IBM xml4j parser vs. Datachannel In-Reply-To: <006d01bf1502$a49c7c60$e5ea4e0c@Lepley> Message-ID: We are in kind of interesting position to comment on what you are doing because we just ported our code from Datachannel to IBM. While we did no rigorous objective testing, it is is pretty easy to tell differences in performance because of obvious user interactivity changes. We noticed no dramatic change one way or the other. However our code does a 'visit all' pattern and when we turn on the 'deferred' DOM processing, it slows way way down (guessing factor of 4-5). Works fine in the non-deferred (full) mode. The default is I believe the deferred mode, so I would try turning this off. (if you are using the DOM parser) One thing I have noticed is that the datachannel parser running on the MS JVM had no memory leaks, the IBM seems to have memory leaks. (NOTE: this remains unsolved and perhaps is my problem, though I am beginning to doubt it) IBM said that running under JProbe they had no leaks, but were aware of possible problems in certain JVMs (MS?) for complex graph structures (DOM). I am just now running tests to localize the problem, but I am a bit concerned. I would be interested if you (or anyone out there) experiences leaks... Clearly we need performance tests to go along with Dave Brownell's fine conformance tests! good luck! erik > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > Mike Lepley > Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 1999 3:39 PM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: IBM xml4j parser vs. Datachannel > > > At our firm we are considering using the XML4j parser. > The XML4j parser has gotten some excellent reviews. > That is why I cannot understand the test results that I've done myself. > > For example: > > IBM XML4j > --------- > Time to > File size | Tags | visit all > -------------------------------- > 3kb 100 .55s > 2,229kb 7000 8.51s > 6,368 20000 115.29s > > and the Datachannel > > Datachannel > ----------- > Time to > File size | Tags | visit all > ------------------------------- > 3kb 100 .13 > 2,229kb 7000 2.99s > 6,368kb 20000 9.76s > > And I have many more data points all the way to a 10MB file. > > Has anyone else experienced such poor results with the IBM parser? > Why is there such a difference? I've included my sample code for > the XML4j > parser. > > Thanks in advance! > Mike > > --------------------------------- > > import java.io.*; > import java.net.*; > > import com.ibm.xml.parsers.*; // For the IBM Parser stuff > > import org.w3c.dom.Attr; > import org.w3c.dom.Document; > import org.w3c.dom.NamedNodeMap; > import org.w3c.dom.Node; // The W3C definition of a node > import org.w3c.dom.NodeList; > > public class DOMibm4j > { > int ELEMENT_NODE = 1; > public static String szText = ""; > > Document doc; > > public DOMibm4j (String file, String sch /**, RichEdit re */) > { > try > > > com.ibm.xml.parsers.DOMParser parser = > new com.ibm.xml.parsers.DOMParser (); > > parser.setValidating (false); > parser.parse (file + ".x"); > > doc = parser.getDocument (); > } > catch (Exception e) > { > e.printStackTrace(); > return; > } > > // Let's loop through all the nodes and look at them... > > for (int i=0; i < doc.getChildNodes().getLength (); i++) > { > Visit (doc.getChildNodes ().item(i), 0); > } > } > > public void Visit (Node node, int spaces) > { > // Recursively visits every node under this top node > > // Make sure that it's not an attribute or CDATA or processing > instruction, etc. > > if (node.getNodeType () == ELEMENT_NODE) > { > int length = node.getChildNodes().getLength (); > for (int i=0; i < length; i++) { Visit > (node.getChildNodes().item(i), spaces+5); } > } > } > } > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 13 14:23:24 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) Message-ID: <14340.31061.245383.331182@localhost.localdomain> In case people haven't noticed, on Sunday a beta PSGML 1.2.0 appeared on Lennart's site (previous versions with XML support had been alpha): ftp://ftp.lysator.liu.se/pub/sgml/psgml-1.2.0.tar.gz PSGML provides fully DTD-driven XML and SGML editing support for Gnu Emacs and its XEmacs cousin, and it's 100% Python-free. On a similar note, there's now an XEmacs binary kit for people disadvantaged with the Windows operating system: ftp://ftp.xemacs.org/pub/xemacs/binary-kits/win32/ XEmacs is a much prettier, GUI-ish branch of Gnu Emacs -- this distribution probably comes with an earlier PSGML version bundled, but I haven't checked. XEmacs+PSGML is my editor of choice for all of my XML and SGML work. I've used it to create probably close to 10,000 printed pages of documentation over the last few years, and have used XEmacs's regular-expression facilities for adding complex markup to e-texts. It's probably not suitable for naive users (give 'em XMetaL or WordPerfect, or maybe XED), but for the tech-savvy, it's great. Of course, I also use XEmacs as my mail and news reader, so I'm probably not sane. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From GTUZMAN at sigs.com Wed Oct 13 15:07:09 1999 From: GTUZMAN at sigs.com (Gail Tuzman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: XML Learning Opportunity Message-ID: Just want to make sure fellow xml mailing list subscribers who plan to attend XML One Fall in Santa Clara, CA don't miss the early bird registration date and a chance to save $100. XML One Fall Conference: November 8-11, 1999 Exhibition: November 9-10, 1999 The Westin Santa Clara Santa Clara, CA Sponsored by IBM, Oracle, Sun, Object Design, Microsoft Save $100 - Register by October 15, 1999. If you didn't already know*. The conference program includes a wide range of 62 intensive sessions (a total of 88 combined hours of valuable instruction) totally devoted to XML technology. XML One Fall features 4 tracks to reflect the latest advances in XML technology. The top experts in the field will present day and night sessions and full-day tutorials and put together 4 action-packed days of non-stop learning. It's all centered around the topics you need to know. Tracks ? XML-Based Content on the Internet ? XML-Based Commerce on the Internet ? Implementing XML-Based Software ? XML in the Enterprise A two-day exhibition features leading vendors. You can test drive the latest products, have your questions answered, take a sneak preview of what's new and compare what works best for you. For complete details on the program visit the conference website at: http://www.xmlconference.com/xmlusa. You can get a free issue of Java Report just for visiting! xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Wed Oct 13 16:10:20 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277EDE@MDYNYCMSX1> >On a similar note, there's now an XEmacs binary kit for people >disadvantaged with the Windows operating system: There's also NT Emacs (great FAQ at http://www.cs.washington.edu/homes/voelker/ntemacs.html) which I've used for years (under W95 as well as NT), and the new PSGML works fine with it. I just ignored PSGML's installation instructions, which are more UNIX-oriented, and did a byte-recompile-directory on all the ps*.el files. NT Emacs and Xemacs are similar enough that switching back and forth between NT Emacs at work and Xemacs on my Linux laptop has never been a problem. If you've never used Emacs, you can check it out without joining the cult...just play with it for a while and see if you like it...(one of us, one of us, we accept you, we accept you) See the "Editing SGML Documents with the Emacs Text Editor" chapter of my "SGML CD" book; the chapter is available for free as an Acrobat file at http://www.snee.com/bob/sgmlfree/. It assumes no previous knowledge of Emacs, and everything in it applies to XML as well as SGML. Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 13 18:30:56 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: DOM serialization References: <006f01bf13f3$62e0bee0$cc8c050a@parisdev> Message-ID: <3804B353.D470842F@pacbell.net> > Tangi Vass wrote: > > Is it possible to serialize/deserialize DOM trees into/from binary format? Possible, yes. A good idea, probably not -- most binary formats will be no more efficient than XML text (in terms of either space or time!), and they certainly sacrifice the ability to read the document into any other DOM implementation. See if your DOM implements the "Serializable" interface; some do. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Wed Oct 13 18:56:02 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991013095954.00f13b0c@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 10:11 AM 10/13/99 -0400, DuCharme, Robert wrote: >There's also NT Emacs (great FAQ at >http://www.cs.washington.edu/homes/voelker/ntemacs.html) which I've used for >years (under W95 as well as NT), and the new PSGML works fine with it. Yup, I'm another happy NTemacs user and it's a super environment for editing XML. David, have you tried that, and if so, is it better than NTemacs, and if so, how? -T. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lee.harding at autodesk.com Wed Oct 13 18:59:29 1999 From: lee.harding at autodesk.com (lee.harding@autodesk.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Where to start? Message-ID: <258E47267E4BD3118DCA00805FA72E089FBD3F@hqmsgsrf03.autodesk.com> I'm trying to understand XML. Stop laughing. The single question is, of course, "what do I need to do in my applications?" My apps being the type that create documents (productivity). I have found a glut of information about what XML is and isn't, but somehow I'm still unable to see how it makes sense in such applications. What I understand is: 1) I can offload some code. Pre-fab parsers/validators, XLink and XPointer solve some problems that I have already solved. If I switch to XML I don't have to maintain some code that enables this magic. Less code is better, but in reality it's a pretty small amount of code that doesn't take much effort to maintain. 2) Although XML is not a solution to interoperability problems, solutions will probably evolve in terms of XML. It might make sense to use an XML format to be prepared for future developments. Gambling. I have more questions than information at the moment. Is that the general case out there? Where does it make sense to start integrating XML? As a document storage format? For object exchanges (interchange formats)? Elsewhere? Just thought I'd ask, :) Lee xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smohr at voicenet.com Wed Oct 13 20:04:41 1999 From: smohr at voicenet.com (Stephen T. Mohr) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Where to start? References: <258E47267E4BD3118DCA00805FA72E089FBD3F@hqmsgsrf03.autodesk.com> Message-ID: <004201bf159f$e26ef890$e9d9f2cc@omicron.com> As an interchange format, absolutely. For example, you might want to enable someone to extract plumbing specifications from a house plan for export to the plumbing contractor. As a native file format, not unless you plan interoperability with competing products. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, 13 October 1999 12:59 PM Subject: Where to start? > > I'm trying to understand XML. Stop laughing. > > The single question is, of course, "what do I need to do in my > applications?" My apps being the type that create documents (productivity). > I have found a glut of information about what XML is and isn't, but somehow > I'm still unable to see how it makes sense in such applications. What I > understand is: > > 1) I can offload some code. Pre-fab parsers/validators, XLink and XPointer > solve some problems that I have already solved. If I switch to XML I don't > have to maintain some code that enables this magic. Less code is better, but > in reality it's a pretty small amount of code that doesn't take much effort > to maintain. > > 2) Although XML is not a solution to interoperability problems, solutions > will probably evolve in terms of XML. It might make sense to use an XML > format to be prepared for future developments. Gambling. > > I have more questions than information at the moment. Is that the general > case out there? Where does it make sense to start integrating XML? As a > document storage format? For object exchanges (interchange formats)? > Elsewhere? > > Just thought I'd ask, :) > Lee > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 13 20:16:27 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: IBM xml4j parser vs. Datachannel References: Message-ID: <3804CC19.441494F2@pacbell.net> Erik James Freed wrote: > > Clearly we need performance tests to go along with Dave Brownell's fine > conformance tests! Yep -- but far better than the only one I saw (the February Java Report) which benchmarked only the DOM getElementsByTagName() method, and which had a notable set of serious factual and methodological flaws. SAX and DOM performance should be separately weighed, and balanced against conformance. As they say, it's easy to be fast if you don't do it right! As I recall, xml.com had an article looking at some performance comparisons (C, Java, Python) a while back. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From andrewl at microsoft.com Wed Oct 13 20:26:11 1999 From: andrewl at microsoft.com (Andrew Layman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Where to start? Message-ID: <5BF896CAFE8DD111812400805F1991F712E1745C@RED-MSG-08> Regarding using XML as a storage format for data, Stephen Mohr suggested "not unless you plan interoperability with competing products." Actually, I think that a good case can be made for using XML if you intend interoperability with future versions of the same product. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricker at xmls.com Wed Oct 13 20:35:11 1999 From: ricker at xmls.com (Jeffrey Ricker) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: DOM serialization In-Reply-To: <3804B353.D470842F@pacbell.net> References: <006f01bf13f3$62e0bee0$cc8c050a@parisdev> Message-ID: XML __is__ the serialization. DOM is the instantiation of the serialization as an object. We call XML "universal serialization." At 09:29 AM 10/13/99 -0700, David Brownell wrote: >> Tangi Vass wrote: >> >> Is it possible to serialize/deserialize DOM trees into/from binary format? > >Possible, yes. A good idea, probably not -- most binary formats will >be no more efficient than XML text (in terms of either space or time!), >and they certainly sacrifice the ability to read the document into any >other DOM implementation. > >See if your DOM implements the "Serializable" interface; some do. > >- Dave > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From niko at cmsplatform.com Wed Oct 13 20:44:38 1999 From: niko at cmsplatform.com (Nik O) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Parser benchmarks (WAS: Re: IBM xml4j parser vs. Datachannel) Message-ID: <001201bf15aa$e3d25820$1a5e360a@tetondata.com> The XML.COM article was "Summary of XML Parser Performance Testing" of 5 May 1999, at "http://www.xml.com/pub/Benchmark/exec.html". Six parsers were tested: two in C (expat and RXP); two in Java (Java XP and IBM's Java XML4J); plus Perl and Python wrappers for expat. Another (overlapping) article was "Benchmarking XML Parsers on Solaris" of 9 June 1999, at "http://www.awaretechnologies.com/XML/xmlbench/solaris.html". This also looked at six parsers, dropping RXP, and testing another Java parser (xml-tr2 from Javasoft). -Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smohr at voicenet.com Wed Oct 13 21:16:56 1999 From: smohr at voicenet.com (Stephen T. Mohr) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Where to start? References: <5BF896CAFE8DD111812400805F1991F712E1745C@RED-MSG-08> Message-ID: <005001bf15af$7209d3d0$e9d9f2cc@omicron.com> Andrew makes a good point. In fact, if you are clever, you can have limited forward as well as backward compatibility, i.e., your app doesn't choke when it sees a future version, it just grabs what it can use. I laid out such an approach using XML in my book Designing Distributed Applications (Wrox Press, ISBN 1-861002-27-0). That sort of thing depends on how much "outdated" data you want to keep around and how clever your vocabulary is. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From niko at cmsplatform.com Wed Oct 13 21:16:56 1999 From: niko at cmsplatform.com (Nik O) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:15:59 2004 Subject: Parser benchmarks (me bad!) Message-ID: <006101bf15af$69d52660$1a5e360a@tetondata.com> Sorry all, i just belatedly noticed that the e-mail list software (or maybe it's just my mail-reader) likes to merge the trailing quotation mark into the URLs in my last post -- of course you'll need to delete that character to get good links. In the future, i'll just put the links on separate lines (a la Megginson, et al). -Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 13 21:55:22 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) In-Reply-To: Tim Bray's message of "Wed, 13 Oct 1999 10:06:24 -0700" References: <3.0.32.19991013095954.00f13b0c@pop.intergate.bc.ca> Message-ID: Tim Bray writes: > Yup, I'm another happy NTemacs user and it's a super environment for > editing XML. David, have you tried that, and if so, is it better than > NTemacs, and if so, how? -T. I have tried NTemacs in the past; currently, I don't have Windows on my notebook at all (StarOffice removed my last excuse for wasting all that disk space), so to try the Windows XEmacs I'd have to hijack some space on the family computer. I'd be very interested in hearing the experience of other users. Under Unix, at least, XEmacs does interesting things (like displaying graphics inline) that plain Emacs doesn't, though PSGML doesn't provide explicit support for this yet (it would take a good evening of custom coding, probably). All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From michael_champion at ameritech.net Wed Oct 13 23:27:07 1999 From: michael_champion at ameritech.net (Michael Champion) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Where to start? References: <258E47267E4BD3118DCA00805FA72E089FBD3F@hqmsgsrf03.autodesk.com> <004201bf159f$e26ef890$e9d9f2cc@omicron.com> Message-ID: <004301bf15c1$0a8a2400$aabeb3c7@mccdell> ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen T. Mohr To: Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 1999 1:25 PM Subject: Re: Where to start? > As a native file format, not unless you plan interoperability with competing > products. A good case can be made for using XML "natively" to allow interoperability with complementary tools, such as schema editors, forms editors, stylesheet wizards, databases, search engines, format converters .... The way I see it, supporting XML (and some XML API like the DOM) fairly "deep" in your product let's you focus on what YOU do best, and let's you acquire (by purchase, from open source groups, or by partnering) the necessary auxiliary components from people who do what THEY do best. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com Thu Oct 14 00:17:43 1999 From: uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com (uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 13 Oct 1999 08:21:41 EDT." <14340.31061.245383.331182@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <199910140025.SAA02047@malatesta.local> > PSGML provides fully DTD-driven XML and SGML editing support for Gnu > Emacs and its XEmacs cousin, and it's 100% Python-free. I'm wondering whether I missed a flame-war or something. Why are you "taunting" unnamed persons with the quite astonishing revelation that there is software out there not written in Python. Then again, you throw a random grenade at Windows users as well, so I'll just assume that you are missing flamewars here, and hoping for one that has nothing to do with XHTML namespaces. -- Uche Ogbuji FourThought LLC, IT Consultants uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com (970)481-0805 Software engineering, project management, Intranets and Extranets http://FourThought.com http://OpenTechnology.org xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Thu Oct 14 02:32:27 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Where to start? References: <5BF896CAFE8DD111812400805F1991F712E1745C@RED-MSG-08> Message-ID: <380523CA.18A2@hiwaay.net> Andrew Layman wrote: > > Regarding using XML as a storage format for data, Stephen Mohr suggested > "not unless you plan interoperability with competing products." Actually, I > think that a good case can be made for using XML if you intend > interoperability with future versions of the same product. And if you keep the DTD or schema, future versions of the same class of products should your product vendor go away. Information outlives applications. For some, that reads like rhetoric, but for the SGML community with a decade more experience, it is self-evident fact. Markup works. len xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From c.galiano at ua.es Thu Oct 14 11:36:52 1999 From: c.galiano at ua.es (Cristobal Galiano Fernandez) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Finding XML applet tree Message-ID: <3805A4EE.5B4534E5@ua.es> I find an light XML applet tree like Outline (http://www.demon.co.uk/davidg/) but more standard. I can add attributtes. Ej .... Thanks in advance Cristobal xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Thu Oct 14 15:29:23 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: About PSGML 1.2.0 (Open-Source XML editor) In-Reply-To: <199910140025.SAA02047@malatesta.local> References: <14340.31061.245383.331182@localhost.localdomain> <199910140025.SAA02047@malatesta.local> Message-ID: <14341.55901.843591.379767@localhost.localdomain> uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com writes: > I'm wondering whether I missed a flame-war or something. Why are > you "taunting" unnamed persons with the quite astonishing > revelation that there is software out there not written in Python. > > Then again, you throw a random grenade at Windows users as well, so > I'll just assume that you are missing flamewars here, and hoping > for one that has nothing to do with XHTML namespaces. No -- they're both friendly inside jokes (hence the tags). Paul Prescod gave a quite enthusiastic and well-remembered talk about XML and Python in Montreal a little over a year ago, and a Python comment still goes back and forth once in a while. Sorry for the missing context. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Thu Oct 14 17:17:58 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings Message-ID: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> Does anyone know of a good central site for finding information on the several hundred character encodings that seem to be options on various XML processors? I'm aware of unicode.org and the other standards bodies, but it doesn't seem like anyone's compiled a list of the many possibilities out there, and resources on these standards are few and far between. Lots of pieces, but no real detail. I'd love to find a central switchboard site that lists encodings and character sets, with pointers to more detailed information. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From elharo at metalab.unc.edu Thu Oct 14 18:05:30 1999 From: elharo at metalab.unc.edu (Elliotte Rusty Harold) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings In-Reply-To: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> References: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> Message-ID: >Does anyone know of a good central site for finding information on the >several hundred character encodings that seem to be options on various XML >processors? There is no good single source of reference for all these. However, the reason all these are present in most XML parsers is that most XML parsers use Java's InputStreamReader and OutputStreamWriter classes. Those classes support all these different encodings. Details are covered in Chapter 14 and 15 of my Java I/O book from O'Reilly. However, if all you want are the official names of all the different encodings you'll find them at http://java.sun.com/products/jdk/1.2/docs/guide/internat/encoding.doc.html This gives the basic list for JDK 1.2.2. (To get an exhaustive list you have to dejar the jar file and look at certain class names in the sun packages.) Other VMs (especially 1.1 VMs and Microsoft VMs) may be slightly different. The big addition to the 1.2.2 list was ASCII which was notable by its absence in earlier VMs. +-----------------------+------------------------+-------------------+ | Elliotte Rusty Harold | elharo@metalab.unc.edu | Writer/Programmer | +-----------------------+------------------------+-------------------+ | Java I/O (O'Reilly & Associates, 1999) | | http://metalab.unc.edu/javafaq/books/javaio/ | | http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=1565924851/cafeaulaitA/ | +----------------------------------+---------------------------------+ | Read Cafe au Lait for Java News: http://metalab.unc.edu/javafaq/ | | Read Cafe con Leche for XML News: http://metalab.unc.edu/xml/ | +----------------------------------+---------------------------------+ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Thu Oct 14 18:11:19 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings In-Reply-To: References: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <199910141610.MAA02572@hesketh.net> At 11:58 AM 10/14/99 -0400, Elliotte Rusty Harold wrote: >There is no good single source of reference for all these. [...] >However, if all you want are the official names of all the different >encodings you'll find them at > >http://java.sun.com/products/jdk/1.2/docs/guide/internat/encoding.doc.html Wow! This is great. It figures that I should have been looking through your Java I/O book sitting on my shelf rather than surfing through too many bad search engine results. Now if only they'd link that list to more details about each encoding... Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk Thu Oct 14 18:17:45 1999 From: msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk (Miles Sabin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings Message-ID: Simon St.Laurent wrote, > Does anyone know of a good central site for finding > information on the several hundred character encodings > that seem to be options on various XML processors? http://www.isi.edu/in-notes/iana/assignments/character-sets Gives a good (but not exhaustive) list along with references to supporting documentation in most cases. Cheers, Miles -- Miles Sabin Cromwell Media Internet Systems Architect 5/6 Glenthorne Mews +44 (0)181 410 2230 London, W6 0LJ msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk England xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wunder at infoseek.com Thu Oct 14 18:39:11 1999 From: wunder at infoseek.com (Walter Underwood) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings In-Reply-To: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991014093801.00a9dc70@corp.infoseek.com> At 11:21 AM 10/14/99 -0400, Simon St.Laurent wrote: >Does anyone know of a good central site for finding information on the >several hundred character encodings that seem to be options on various XML >processors? I go here for pointers: http://www.w3.org/International/O-charset.html That includes a link to the IANA's list of registered charsets, and a really useful list of the popular charsets in various countries. The IANA list also has aliases and pointers to standards. Even those lists fall short. For example, the IANA list doesn't have windows-1252, but it does have ISO-8859-1-Windows-3.0-Latin-1, which might be the same thing. It does list the other windows-125x code pages. wunder -- Walter R. Underwood wunder@infoseek.com wunder@best.com (home) http://software.infoseek.com/cce/ (my product) http://www.best.com/~wunder/ 1-408-543-6946 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Thu Oct 14 18:45:08 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:00 2004 Subject: Encodings References: <199910141517.LAA32117@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <38060845.4C1521DE@pacbell.net> "Simon St.Laurent" wrote: > > Does anyone know of a good central site for finding information on the > several hundred character encodings that seem to be options on various XML > processors? Check out the IETF resources identified in ftp://ftp.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2278.txt especially this big file (as referenced in section 5 of that RFC) ftp://ftp.isi.edu/in-notes/iana/assignments/character-sets Note that Elliote's ref to Sun's doc is the JDK 1.2 one -- see Sun's "Project X" docs (package com.sun.xml.parser) for the corresponding ref to JDK 1.1 encoding support (1.1 has about 120 encodings, while 1.2 has about 150, if you ignore the aliases). - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 15 03:38:35 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: scripts and PIs Message-ID: <199910150137.VAA28581@hesketh.net> While writing a bit more about notations and PIs, it struck me that maybe PIs do in fact have a use in Web applications. They seem like a good container for scripts within documents, perhaps a better container than the elements and CDATA sections we're stuck using now (in section 4.8 of XHTML 1.0, for instance). (That was my first posting about XML, made a couple of years ago, and I'm still not convinced that 'bozo' scripters _should_ be fond of CDATA sections. See http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Oct-1997/0128.html and the thread that followed.) Suppose I declare a notation like: and then a PI like: It seems more reasonable in many ways than Any thoughts on the subject? I'm aware that notations and PIs are both bits of XML 1.0 that seem to be very much out of official favor. PIs have the same escaping effect as CDATA sections (terminating with ?> instead of ]]>), and scripts seem to be pretty much, well, instructions. Applications would need to know what the ECMAScript URI meant, but that doesn't seem much harder than processing > > Any thoughts on the subject? I prefer PIs. I don't like the idea that the currrent mechanism to insert script also carries an implied structural significance - that might sometimes be true, but I'd prefer to be able to make that decision. Also, I think that script is very much a "processing instruction" type of thing. Would we then require/desire more control over PIs by allowing them to support attributes though? If you had to wrap the PI in an element just so you had somewhere to store other information it would seem not to buy much, but it would be interesting if the PI was able to handle them as well. Even without attributes I prefer PIs - they seem more natural than an element and a CDATA section. -- Regards, Marcus Carr email: mrc@allette.com.au ___________________________________________________________________ Allette Systems (Australia) www: http://www.allette.com.au ___________________________________________________________________ "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." - Einstein xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Fri Oct 15 08:28:02 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: Encodings Message-ID: <001401bf16d9$ba9451e0$41f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> From: Simon St.Laurent >Does anyone know of a good central site for finding information on the >several hundred character encodings that seem to be options on various XML >processors? For details of allowed names, see IANA. For mappings from these sets to Unicode, check out the unicode.org site. For a list which includes all sorts of EBCDIC encodings, see IBMs XML parsers and their new C++ transcoder. For an introduction to how the basic character sets relate to each other, see my book "The XML & SGML Cookbook" chapter 20 "The Flowering of Coded Character Sets". This book also has an introduction to the character/glyph model underlying modern ISO and W3C specifications, in chapter 18 "About Characters and Glyphs". For a wonderful book explaining all the details of the encodings used in China, Korea, Japan & Vietnam see Ken Lunde's book "CVJK Information Processing" from O'Reilly. This is an utterly amazing book: single-handedly Lunde has found the regularities behind the seemingly chaotic world of encodings and characters in East Asia. For other details of the encodings, see my experimental GLUE transcoder project at http://www.ascc.net/xml/en/utf-8/glue.html and go "software": the idea of the GLUE project is that there is not an adequate specification format for the mappings from encoding to encoding: one needs to be able to specify arithmetical functions on encodigns which may use various number of bytes for efficiency: tables are not good enough. Also, character sets in reality exhibit base/variant characteristics, which again should be specified. And finally, transcoders need to be able to generate numeric character entities (or the correct kind for that point in the document) when the output character set does not support a character found in the input. Rick Jelliffe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Fri Oct 15 08:53:32 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: scripts and PIs Message-ID: <002701bf16dd$47d38050$41f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> From: Marcus Carr >>"Simon St.Laurent" wrote: > >> Suppose I declare a notation like: >> >> >> and then a PI like: >> >> >> It seems more reasonable in many ways than >> >> >> Any thoughts on the subject? > > I prefer PIs. I don't like the idea that the currrent mechanism to insert > script also carries an implied structural significance - that might > sometimes be true, but I'd prefer to be able > to make that decision. I think there is a programming factor too. Ask yourself, "Is the PI a child of the parent element or is it an effect at that point in the document?" If it is not an effect for that point in the document but has been bundled into a section perhaps with other similar markup (e.g. into in HTML) then I think it should be an element. Similarly, if you ask yourself "Does this have the same scope as an element, or is it scoped to one entity or to the document (regardless of the document element)?" In that case, it should be a PI not an element. For elements and attributes, there is also the factor that programmers often like to process XML so that elements "push" a function (in James Clark's terminology) while attributes are "pulled" from within that function. You will see in CSS stylesheets that people use element rules (or class rules) but rarely rules base solely on the existance of an attribute. So perhaps the following is true Element PI Attribute ----------------- -------- ------ --------- Push/pull Push Push Pull effect/structure structure effect structure More rules could be added to provide more guidence: in particular, whether the script was applicable to all uses of the document. But there is no reason why even all these rules will give a clear answer in all cases: in that case, house style will probably apply and W3C house-style is clearly to favour elements and to favour processing by element type (or HTML class) rather than supporting point-based markup. So, in the case of SCRIPT in HTML, I think it should be an element not a PI. There is no special processing that a PI invokes at the point of its declaration in an HTML document. Rick Jelliffe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From elm at arbortext.com Fri Oct 15 12:49:47 1999 From: elm at arbortext.com (Eve L. Maler) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: scripts and PIs In-Reply-To: <002701bf16dd$47d38050$41f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991015063907.00b96bf0@pophost.arbortext.com> At 03:17 PM 10/15/99 +0800, Rick Jelliffe wrote: > Element PI Attribute >----------------- -------- ------ --------- >Push/pull Push Push Pull >effect/structure structure effect structure This is a very useful matrix; it explains neatly something I've been trying to articulate about XML processing. It's pretty harmless to add attributes to a document, because "by default" they don't get used in the output stream, but for formatting, elements must all be "consumed" somewhere by default. For data-oriented processing, everything seems to be pull, though. By the way, the main reason why we changed the closing delimiter of SGML PIs from > to ?> in creating XML was to make PIs safer for containing scripting and code. It's pretty common to have the string ">" appear in scripting, but (we hoped) far less common to have "?>". Besides, it made it more symmetrical... Eve xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tpassin at idsonline.com Fri Oct 15 14:22:49 1999 From: tpassin at idsonline.com (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: scripts and PIs References: <002701bf16dd$47d38050$41f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> Message-ID: <002101bf1708$4fdfafa0$5d15b0cf@tomshp> Rick Jelliffe wrote: >... > So, in the case of SCRIPT in HTML, I think it should be an element > not a PI. There is no special processing that a PI invokes at the > point of its declaration in an HTML document. > >... Generally, I agree that a SCRIPT could (should) be an element. But some script languages or even statements require specific formatting. For example, a Javascript single-line comment must not wrap; some Python code depends on specific indenting; etc. I can imagine that a processor, finding a PI at that point, would preserve the special formatting where otherwise it would not. Of course, the processor could simply know to preserve formatting when it hits a HTML 4.01 supports this convention - see http://www.w3.org/TR/html40/interact/scripts.html#h-18.3.2 XHTML 1.0 has nothing to say about this convention, even in its 'Script and Style Elements' section (http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#h-4.8) where it discusses the use of CDATA sections to escape potentially difficult code. Comments appear not to be described at all, though they are used in examples. I'd guess the convention has come to the end of the line, but it's not really clear. Thoughts? Is the final final review period (after members have voted) over yet? Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From gkholman at CraneSoftwrights.com Fri Oct 15 19:01:20 1999 From: gkholman at CraneSoftwrights.com (G. Ken Holman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: Announce: Fifth Edition of XSLT/XPath Tutorial Materials Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991015114830.00cc1ab0@CraneSoftwrights.com> Announce: Fifth Edition of XSLT/XPath Tutorial Materials Practical Transformation Using XSLT and XPath (XSL Transformations and the XML Path Language) Fifth Edition - 1999-10-14 - ISBN 1-894049-02-0 Copyright (c) 1999 Crane Softwrights Ltd. 288 Pages / Subscription price includes free updates New in the comprehensive Fifth Edition: (1) - all constructs of the Proposed Recommendations for XSLT and XPath are documented (2) - new examples and illustrations have been added to old material as well as new (3) - the material is supplied in ten different renditions (4) - the reference annexes in the free preview excerpt download have been updated to the PR and to the latest version of XT As with our other editions of this XSLT training material, the purchase of any edition of this publication entitles the customer to any future edition of the same material. Information can be obtained from the link below to the "Commercial Training Materials" section the Crane web site (also the location of the free preview download). .............. Ken p.s. Attention existing customers: You all should have received your update notice by now, but some email addresses are bouncing. If you do not receive your update notice soon, please forward a copy of your receipt in order to obtain the latest username/password for download. cc: XSL List XML-DEV XML-L XML-EDI comp.text.xml microsoft.public.xml -- G. Ken Holman mailto:gkholman@CraneSoftwrights.com Crane Softwrights Ltd. http://www.CraneSoftwrights.com/x/ Box 266, Kars, Ontario CANADA K0A-2E0 +1(613)489-0999 (Fax:-0995) Web site: XSL/XML/DSSSL/SGML services, training, libraries, products. Practical Transformation Using XSLT and XPath ISBN 1-894049-02-0 Next instructor-led training: 1999-11-08, 1999-11-09, 1999-12-05/06, 1999-12-07, 2000-02-27/28, 2000-05-11/12 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 15 19:06:51 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: scripts and XHTML In-Reply-To: <199910151646.MAA29285@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <199910151706.NAA30347@hesketh.net> At 12:50 PM 10/15/99 -0400, Simon St.Laurent wrote: > > Here's an example HTML document that uses this convention: Oops. Not so smart of me, and it got stripped. The file is at http://www.simonstl.com/refs/scriptcommenttest.htm Sorry for the bother. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From pmandgi at hotmail.com Fri Oct 15 19:15:54 1999 From: pmandgi at hotmail.com (Prakash Mandgi) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:01 2004 Subject: Reconciling old versions of xml4j_2_0_5.jar parser with xml4j_1_1_6.jar parser Message-ID: <19991015171519.74125.qmail@hotmail.com> Hi, I am trying to use XMLDiff with the latest xml4j_2_0_5.jar parsers. Unfortunately this does not sit well with the parser. XMLDiff works well with the xml4j_1_1_6 version. However there is a need to persist and use the latest DOM implementation i.e. xml4j2.x. Has anyone managed to merge the new DOM structures with the old parser i.e. xml4j1.x versions. Thanks for your help Prakash -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991015/cea3d175/attachment.htm From tpassin at mitretek.org Fri Oct 15 20:59:33 1999 From: tpassin at mitretek.org (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: scripts and XHTML Message-ID: <002801bf173f$446f8140$38a3f1ce@ls-.mitretek.org> Simon St.Laurent wrote: >Continuing the explorations I was making last night, this time for a 'ways to >abuse comments' section, I was working on a piece about the common use in HTML >of comments around the contents of SCRIPT elements. (It hides the content from >browsers that don't support scripts, basically.) >... >I'd guess the convention has come to the end of the line, but it's not really >clear. Thoughts? Is the final final review period (after members have voted) >over yet? The convention is used for old browsers that don't understand

XML CONTENT NET Application

But nothing seeems to be working , I would like to to know how can we write to xml files ? Thanks in advance, Prashant ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Sat Oct 16 17:40:44 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: XML Search Engine Holy War - Attributes vs. Elements References: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F28@MDYNYCMSX1> Message-ID: <38089B92.590A@hiwaay.net> DuCharme, Robert wrote: > > >1. Ignore Attributes all together and index Elements and Character Data > >only. > > >The feeling is that the use of attributes should be restricted (by > >authors) and used to allow other scripts/applications to either include > >or preclude the element and resultant children nodes from some sort of > >processing, displaying or further manipulation. > > This shouldn't even be considered. Yes, although a schema designer is free to document a semantic, this is application level design. "All politics is local." A search engine built on that premise is restricting its application space. > Attributes are used for far more than > what the above paragraph describes. Typical uses include many classic search > criteria such as meta-information about authorship, revision stages, and > revision dates. Include security markings in that too. While one might not be smart to use that in a web application, security markings in attributes have been used in SGML DTDs. Redacting... > The sole purpose of ID type attributes is to uniquely > identify elements, and unique identifiers ought to be pretty handy when > searching for information. A system that can quickly locate elements with a > particular value in an IDREF type attribute would be very useful in link > maintenance and implementation. And as in X3D, (being discussed(ID/IDREFS vs NMTOKENS)), for DEF/USE relationships. There are also examples of putting what others might consider "content" into attributes to preserve a symmetry with nodes and fields. Some use and will use XML just as a binding to an abstract description (eg, X3D). There is no simple case or practice that enables an engine to ignore attribute values and types unless one is blinding the engine by design. > but a nice > thing about implementing storage of attributes is that they map more easily > to relational databases where ID and IDREF attributes can be easily indexed > for searching. Yes. There are scripts and samples that do that now. What I see in practice is that export and import systems start out using only elements mapping field names to GIs, then after some experimentation, they begin to rely more on GIs and attributes. Applying ID/IDREF depends on how you use the names. It is good for primary key/foreign key relationships if strict relational rules are followed, but when packing/serializing, it isn't necessarily strict so NMTOKENs may be preferred. The question is one of requiring a validity pass from the XML processor. len xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken_north at compuserve.com Sat Oct 16 23:24:08 1999 From: ken_north at compuserve.com (Ken North) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: (Off topic) Shaken not stirred References: <00aa01bbf79a$9e16f6f0$3ff96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> Message-ID: <004401bf181c$f341f440$0b00a8c0@grissom> From: Rick Jelliffe > Thanks for the email from people on this list enquiring how I fared in > our earthquake. We had a 7.0 in Southern California in the wee hours of the morning. That's more powerful than the Loma Prieta quake in the Bay Area 10 years ago, but damage was minimal because it was centered in the desert outside of Los Angeles. One train was derailed, but there was no loss of life -- certainly nothing like the commuter trains colliding in London last week. Today's quake was felt as far east as Las Vegas, where people in high-rise hotels got dressed and exited their rooms for a while. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken_north at compuserve.com Sat Oct 16 23:37:53 1999 From: ken_north at compuserve.com (Ken North) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: XML Search Engine Holy War - Attributes vs. Elements References: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F28@MDYNYCMSX1> Message-ID: <005001bf181e$e13510a0$0b00a8c0@grissom> DuCharme, Robert wrote: > The sole purpose of ID type attributes is to uniquely > identify elements, and unique identifiers ought to be pretty handy when > searching for information. A system that can quickly locate elements with a > particular value in an IDREF type attribute would be very useful in link > maintenance and implementation. > > Come to think of it, a system that left out element content might be more > useful than one that left out attributes. Of course I'm kidding, but a nice > thing about implementing storage of attributes is that they map more easily > to relational databases where ID and IDREF attributes can be easily indexed > for searching. It's probably appropriate to make a distinction between precise matches and similarity searching. Using unique identifiers and indexing attributes will improve performance of the former. On the other hand, a search engine such as AT&T Whirl can recognize patterns in data. That enables it to do similarity matches, even in the absence of unique identifiers. ================== Ken North ============================= http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Ken_North knorth@my-deja.com ken_north@compuserve.com Java Developer's Conference, San Jose, California October 17-21, 1999 http://www.javadevcon.com XML One Fall, Santa Clara, CA November 8-11, 1999 http://www.xmlconference.com/xmlusa xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Sun Oct 17 19:28:30 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: DOM for Expat - what was that URL again ? References: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F28@MDYNYCMSX1> <005001bf181e$e13510a0$0b00a8c0@grissom> Message-ID: <001301bf18c4$ff788b90$4a5eedc1@arp01> Hi, Can somebody remind of the URL where I can find the DOM support that somebody ( could have been more than one ) posted that sits on top of expat. Cheers, Rich. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david.power at fms.ie Mon Oct 18 10:05:07 1999 From: david.power at fms.ie (David Power) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: Why XML? Message-ID: Hello group, Firstly I must say that I support the use of XML, where it fits. Sometimes I think it is difficult to see exactly where it fits. One of our Directors has decided that XML is a great solution for our internal out-sourcing system. It is an SQL database that we render on browsers in HTML 4.0 using VB + Javascripting. It is strictly for internal use and everyone uses IE 4.0 to view it (no probs). What is the advantage of using XML in this loop? Our accounting is SAP and there are moves towards integrating that with our out-sourcing system, I can see where XML is useful here, by the way are there any Case Studies of SAP/XML integration? Thank you, David Power. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sbloom at calweb.com Mon Oct 18 11:25:35 1999 From: sbloom at calweb.com (Scott Bloom) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:02 2004 Subject: DOM for Expat - what was that URL again ? In-Reply-To: <001301bf18c4$ff788b90$4a5eedc1@arp01> Message-ID: Rich, I think this thread is what you were looking for. http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail-archive/xml-dev/xml-dev-Sep-1999/0742.ht ml Scott -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of Richard Anderson Sent: Sunday, October 17, 1999 10:28 AM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: DOM for Expat - what was that URL again ? Hi, Can somebody remind of the URL where I can find the DOM support that somebody ( could have been more than one ) posted that sits on top of expat. Cheers, Rich. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Mon Oct 18 14:26:32 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Why XML? In-Reply-To: David Power's message of "Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:03:31 +0100" References: Message-ID: David Power writes: > Firstly I must say that I support the use of XML, > where it fits. Sometimes I think it is difficult to > see exactly where it fits. One of our Directors has > decided that XML is a great solution for our internal > out-sourcing system. It is an SQL database that > we render on browsers in HTML 4.0 using VB + > Javascripting. It is strictly for internal use and everyone > uses IE 4.0 to view it (no probs). > > What is the advantage of using XML in this loop? That's the wrong question (though I'm sure that you'll be flooded with well-meaning replies in the next few hours). The right question will look something like this: My requirements are X and Y: what are the best standards and technologies to meet these requirements? Obviously, in this case the phrasing of the question is the Director's fault and not yours, but it doesn't sound as if you actually have any unmet requirements in this part of your current system, so why is your Director looking? Here's a hunch: do you (or your directors) have other, unexpressed requirements like future-proofing, vendor-independence, open-standards conformance, techno-diversity, or security? Even just looking for a bit of a media buzz is a legitimate requirement, but you (or your director) should make it explicit so that everyone knows what their real goals are and so that you can do a reasonable cost/benefit analysis. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net Mon Oct 18 13:53:01 1999 From: AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net (AlanM) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: xml parser Message-ID: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE6897909455@MAIL> Hi Guys, * Is there a XML parser available on the net which i can use to parse my XML documentat the server side. I will be using Windows NT server and ASP for the processing * In what format will XML document be sent over the network is it in ASCII? If so is it faster than sending a binary file? Thanks and Regards, Alan xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From richard at cogsci.ed.ac.uk Mon Oct 18 17:25:44 1999 From: richard at cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Windows version of RXP Message-ID: <199910181524.QAA14434@rhymer197.cogsci.ed.ac.uk> I have made an MSDOS/Windows executable of RXP available at ftp://ftp.cogsci.ed.ac.uk/pub/richard/rxp.exe This is identical to the unix version. There is a unix-type man page in rxp.txt in the same directory. The unix distribution (rxp.tar.gz) is unchanged. Typical usages: To check for well-formedness: rxp -xs url To check for validity: rxp -xsV url To check for namespace-correctness: rxp -xsN url Thanks to Ian Hughson for building this version. -- Richard xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dent at oofile.com.au Mon Oct 18 20:19:31 1999 From: dent at oofile.com.au (Andy Dent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: DOM for Expat - what was that URL again ? In-Reply-To: <001301bf18c4$ff788b90$4a5eedc1@arp01> References: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F28@MDYNYCMSX1> <005001bf181e$e13510a0$0b00a8c0@grissom> <001301bf18c4$ff788b90$4a5eedc1@arp01> Message-ID: >Hi, > >Can somebody remind of the URL where I can find the DOM support that >somebody ( could have been more than one ) posted that sits on top of expat. > >Cheers, I've been too busy to pay attention to the list for a while but if you're talking about expatpp that's the c++ layer I put on top of expat. It is used heavily in our OOFILE Report Writer which is now also available as Open Source from the below URL. The report writer uses XML to save standalone report documents that include database schemae, data and report layout. As our Open Source project continues I'll be keen to involve more of the XML community - we have the seeds here of a nicely factored presentation engine for some aspects of XML, with rendering on Mac and Windows and output to HTML and RTF as well. Andy Dent BSc MACS AACM, Software Designer, A.D. Software, Western Australia OOFILE - Database, Reports, Graphs, GUI for c++ on Mac, Unix & Windows PP2MFC - PowerPlant->MFC portability http://www.oofile.com.au/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ulf.wendel at kiel.netsurf.de Mon Oct 18 21:44:18 1999 From: ulf.wendel at kiel.netsurf.de (Ulf Wendel) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Installation of expad (php on Win32) Message-ID: <380B78C0.9123B62E@kiel.netsurf.de> Hello everybody, I hope it's not a common question and you have the patience to give an answer: How to install expad on Win32 (php 3.0.13, NT4, IIS 3)? I checked the distribution and the FAQ on http://www.jclark.com/xml/expatfaq.html. There'n no step by step, is there? :-( Ulf xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sajid.rehman at tatainfotech.com Mon Oct 18 22:05:06 1999 From: sajid.rehman at tatainfotech.com (Sajid Rehman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Java Parser Message-ID: I'd like some advice on which Java parser to use ( Sun TR2 or XML4J ). Primarily, it would involve using SAX & it's use would be server side ! Also, how good is AElfred for use in an applet ? Sajid xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jtauber at jtauber.com Mon Oct 18 23:48:01 1999 From: jtauber at jtauber.com (James Tauber) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Java Parser References: Message-ID: <011e01bf19b2$1c0584a0$eb020a0a@bowstreet.com> > I'd like some advice on which Java parser to use ( Sun TR2 or > XML4J ). Primarily, it would involve using SAX & it's use would be server > side ! Do you need validation? If not, and you are interested in just SAX and not DOM, then add James Clark's XP to your parsers under consideration. James xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sajid.rehman at tatainfotech.com Mon Oct 18 23:59:40 1999 From: sajid.rehman at tatainfotech.com (Sajid Rehman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Java Parser In-Reply-To: <011e01bf19b2$1c0584a0$eb020a0a@bowstreet.com> Message-ID: > > I'd like some advice on which Java parser to use ( Sun TR2 or > > XML4J ). Primarily, it would involve using SAX & it's use would be server > > side ! > > Do you need validation? If not, and you are interested in just SAX and not > DOM, then add James Clark's XP to your parsers under consideration. Ummmm...I need validation ! So, which one should it be ? TR2 or XML4J ? Performance is an issue here ! Sajid xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ml at swiftinc.co.jp Tue Oct 19 02:49:40 1999 From: ml at swiftinc.co.jp (K.Kawaguchi) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Announce: New Server-Side Components for XML-based solutions Message-ID: <380BC06073.BE55ML@gauntlet> Swift,Inc. is now shipping XML ServerWare, which consists from two components. 1. HTML-X HTML-X translates XML to another XML ( possibly HTML ) by applying XSL. This translation is done on the server when clients request data to the server. Thus, you can use XML contents while supporting non-XML-aware browsers ( such as IE4,Netscape. ) 2. DB-X DB-X retrieves data from any RDBMS, transform it into a XML by XSL-like script, and send it back to the client. Thus retrieving data from the server can be done much easier. If interested in this, please visit us at http://www.swiftinc.co.jp/ ---------------------- K.Kawaguchi Swift,Inc. E-Mail:k-kawa@swiftinc.co.jp xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 19 02:46:35 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Java Parser References: Message-ID: <380BBF49.A64FA2C5@pacbell.net> Sajid Rehman wrote: > > > > I'd like some advice on which Java parser to use ( Sun TR2 or > > > XML4J ). Primarily, it would involve using SAX & it's use would be server > > > side ! > > > > Do you need validation? If not, and you are interested in just SAX and not > > DOM, then add James Clark's XP to your parsers under consideration. > > Ummmm...I need validation ! So, which one should it be ? TR2 or > XML4J ? Performance is an issue here ! Correctness should be too -- see my XML.com review. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cbullard at hiwaay.net Tue Oct 19 03:30:37 1999 From: cbullard at hiwaay.net (Len Bullard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Why XML? References: Message-ID: <380BC86E.42F7@hiwaay.net> David Power wrote: > > One of our Directors has > decided that XML is a great solution for our internal > out-sourcing system. Why is a great solution for outsourcing? Who (business role) uses XML for what transaction? > It is an SQL database that > we render on browsers in HTML 4.0 using VB + > Javascripting. It is strictly for internal use and everyone > uses IE 4.0 to view it (no probs). SQL enables you via IIS and an ADO connection to easily return HTML so you could skip the XML internally unless you need to persist the data elsewhere. Is the relational database the record of authority? Is XML used to make copies of this data and reuse it on another system other than internal clients? > What is the advantage of using XML in this loop? Do you persist XML on the client or the servers? If not, not much. Essentially, IE4 and 5 treat XML like it is a small object-database. You can use the DOM to manipulate this, get information from schemas for things such as standard GUIs, and otherwise keep as much metadata as you want on the client side. You can also store these properties on the relational side as long strings amenable to slicing and dicing (eg, split()) etc. or as individual fields and get them on request. Loading them as XML is a one time connection for some metadata sets, so that is some advantage on the client side. You can take very cheap databases engines such as MS Access, link cross-department database applications, and easily create intelligent namespace aggregates simlar to recordset views (produced by, in fact) that can be taken offsite or local to use as say, diagnostic systems or acceptance test documents. Because there are now XML applications for graphics such as SVG and soon, real-time 3D animation (X3D), you can do fascinating multi-applications aggregates bound for just in time applications (the IETM as needed). If I want to do loosely coupled enterprise work, there are some distinct advantages in that you can use XML for import and export (spoorMans serialization). These are hybrid systems so, the answer is really, what do you need to do with these tools? The data is manipulable and persistable in both forms and readily interchangeable. The DOM/XML browser is only a fair front-end for database manipulation, but it is an excellent means to download and synchronize data for occasionally-connected systems: say, anything on a Palm unit or below. len bullard xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From hpyle at agora.co.uk Tue Oct 19 09:26:32 1999 From: hpyle at agora.co.uk (hpyle@agora.co.uk) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Parser in Lingo? Message-ID: <8025680F.00288FC2.00@mailhost.agora.co.uk> Does anyone have a (minimal) XML parser written in Macromind Director's Lingo? -Hugh hpyle@agora.co.uk xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jmdyck at netcom.ca Tue Oct 19 09:45:13 1999 From: jmdyck at netcom.ca (Michael Dyck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: English dictionary in XML! Message-ID: <380C20B5.4F0982C9@netcom.ca> Two months ago, I wrote: > MICRA, Inc. (http://humanities.uchicago.edu/homes/MICRA/) is working on a > freely-available online knowledge base, which currently includes a > marked-up version of Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (G&C Merriam > Co., 1913, edited by Noah Porter), with over 100,000 headwords. It's still > a work in progress: many of the pronunciations and Greek etymologies are > missing, and it needs a lot of proof-reading, but it's a huge start. (It's > the basis for a searchable dictionary at > http://humanities.uchicago.edu/forms_unrest/webster.form.html, hosted by > the University of Chicago's ARTFL Project.) > > Now [the source files] are not in XML format, but they're close. I'd be > willing to do the conversion, but I don't have the space to host the > result. Does anyone want to volunteer some web space? Many people volunteered web space (thanks to you all); I chose Metalab at the University of North Carolina. And now, I'm pleased to announce that I have completed the conversion of the source files to XML, and the results are available at http://metalab.unc.edu/webster/ . The XML files total about 52 megabytes, but you can download it as about 13 megabytes of zip files. Please let me know if anything doesn't work, or if I've left out something crucial. Ker-plop! Michael Dyck jmdyck@netcom.ca xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Ross_Mehlman at emeraldsolutions.com Tue Oct 19 14:33:10 1999 From: Ross_Mehlman at emeraldsolutions.com (Ross Mehlman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: error trapping Message-ID: <6BEB28284D0AD311931C0090276265D64B7BBD@ESBELMAIL1> The parsers/validators I've come across thus far stop when they come across an error. Is there anything out there that will resume after finding an error (and possibly find more?), writing errors to a report instead? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ldodds at ingenta.com Tue Oct 19 15:09:30 1999 From: ldodds at ingenta.com (Leigh Dodds) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: XML ids and XSL keys Message-ID: <001301bf1a33$002767e0$ab20268a@pc-lrd.bath.ac.uk> Hi, I've been working on a DTD recently, and rejected the use of ID and IDREF definitions for cross-referenced attributes largely because of the reasons outlined in the XSL spec (12.2 Keys) - IDs just don't seem to be flexible enough for all purposes. XSL defines the xsl:key element which mitigates these limitations by providing links between elements which are not defined as ID/IDREF pairs. My questions then (if anyone has the time to answer them :) are 1. what are the historic reasons for the current definition of ID/IDREF/IDREFS attributes? 2. are there ever likely to be any plans to allow the definition of attributes in a similar way to XSL keys - i.e. 'ensure that this attribute has a unique value within the set of elements having that attribute in the document'. 3. or is it that no-one has so far need this kind of functionality at the document validation level - is it in fact something which should be dealt with at the application level? 4. or have I missed something along the way in RDF/Schemas/...? Thanks for any responses. L. ================================================================== "Never Do With More, What Can Be Achieved With Less" ---William of Occam ================================================================== Leigh Dodds Eml: ldodds@ingenta.com ingenta ltd Tel: +44 1225 826619 BUCS Building, University of Bath Fax: +44 1225 826283 HomePage : http://www.bath.ac.uk/~ccslrd/ WebLog : http://my.userland.com/viewChannel$1079 ================================================================== xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Tue Oct 19 15:34:30 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:03 2004 Subject: Java Parser In-Reply-To: David Brownell's message of "Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:46:01 -0700" References: <380BBF49.A64FA2C5@pacbell.net> Message-ID: David Brownell writes: > > Ummmm...I need validation ! So, which one should it be ? TR2 or > > XML4J ? Performance is an issue here ! > > Correctness should be too -- see my XML.com review. True, but you need to divide the correctness question into two parts: a) the parser accepts all well-formed/valid documents b) the parser rejects all malformed/invalid documents A parser that fails either of these is non-conforming; that said, you probably care a lot more about (a) than (b) for light-weight clients. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From James.Anderson at mecomnet.de Tue Oct 19 17:45:54 1999 From: James.Anderson at mecomnet.de (james anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: error trapping References: <6BEB28284D0AD311931C0090276265D64B7BBD@ESBELMAIL1> Message-ID: <380C9289.E0BAA768@mecomnet.de> the xml parser with cl-http signals exceptions. lisp's control model permits the handler to execute in the dynamic context of the parser which would permit the caller to decide what to do. on the other hand, i've yet to implement any continuations: i terminate the parser, but other options are possible. one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler obtains control. this would mean that a callback interface would have to be proposed, ratified, and implemented. i recall discussions of such a thing when sax started, but the recollection is vague. Ross Mehlman wrote: > > The parsers/validators I've come across thus far stop when they come across > an error. > > Is there anything out there that will resume after finding an error (and > possibly find more?), writing errors to a report instead? > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jesmith at kaon.com Tue Oct 19 17:41:28 1999 From: jesmith at kaon.com (Joshua E. Smith) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: Windows version of RXP In-Reply-To: <199910181524.QAA14434@rhymer197.cogsci.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19991019113801.008e3c70@tiac.net> Thanks!!! I went looking for a lightweight validator a while back and came up empty. Everyone on the list: This is a terrific tool -- check it out! At 04:24 PM 10/18/99 +0100, Richard Tobin wrote: >I have made an MSDOS/Windows executable of RXP available at > > ftp://ftp.cogsci.ed.ac.uk/pub/richard/rxp.exe > >This is identical to the unix version. There is a unix-type man page >in rxp.txt in the same directory. The unix distribution (rxp.tar.gz) >is unchanged. > >Typical usages: > >To check for well-formedness: rxp -xs url >To check for validity: rxp -xsV url >To check for namespace-correctness: rxp -xsN url > >Thanks to Ian Hughson for building this version. > >-- Richard > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > > -Joshua Smith xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Tue Oct 19 18:30:03 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: XML ids and XSL keys In-Reply-To: <001301bf1a33$002767e0$ab20268a@pc-lrd.bath.ac.uk> from "Leigh Dodds" at Oct 19, 99 02:08:13 pm Message-ID: <199910191713.NAA19465@locke.ccil.org> Leigh Dodds scripsit: > 1. what are the historic reasons for the current definition of > ID/IDREF/IDREFS attributes? ID and IDREF(S) allow general directed graphs to be encoded as hierarchical documents. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Tue Oct 19 18:30:40 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: error trapping Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991019092807.00ba3d30@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 05:47 PM 10/19/99 +0200, james anderson wrote: >one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces >exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler >obtains control. this would mean that a callback interface would have to be >proposed, ratified, and implemented. Well, many of the Java parsers will in fact continue emitting error messages after the first wellformedness error. What none of them will do is go on emitting structure/content callbacks. That's correct behavior per the XML spec, and highly desirable. -Tim xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Tue Oct 19 18:47:48 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: XML ids and XSL keys Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991019094643.00b9aaf0@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 01:13 PM 10/19/99 -0400, John Cowan wrote: >> 1. what are the historic reasons for the current definition of >> ID/IDREF/IDREFS attributes? > >ID and IDREF(S) allow general directed graphs to be encoded as >hierarchical documents. I think the real question was why is there no scoping other than document-scope ID/IDREF. The answer is that we inherited that from SGML, which was typically applied in more traditional publishing environments where documents were created, used, and managed as units. Leastways, I don't recall the ID/IDREF issues getting in the way back then, but since XML came along, it's been a continual irritant. -Tim xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Tue Oct 19 18:56:31 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: error trapping In-Reply-To: <380C9289.E0BAA768@mecomnet.de> from "james anderson" at Oct 19, 99 05:47:20 pm Message-ID: <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> james anderson scripsit: > one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces > exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler > obtains control. It is no accident that C++ and Java have termination semantics only for their exceptions. Unfortunately I cannot find a citation to this story, but it is instructive. Mesa, a dialect of Pascal with modules, exceptions, and many other things, was the language of a group at Xerox PARC. Its exceptions were defined with resumption semantics. Over the course of many years of large-scale development, including the Xerox Star and ViewPoint document workstations, it was found that wherever resumption was actually employed, it was invariably buggy. One by one, resumptive exception handlers were tracked down and removed, until in the end nothing was left but termination. The essential problem with resumption, IMHO, is that it breaks encapsulation: the resumptive handler is written by the author of the calling routine, but runs as a friend of the called routine. To work correctly, then, the caller must know everything about the callee. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Tue Oct 19 21:19:43 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:04 2004 Subject: Ann: New Release of Oracle XSQL Servlet Message-ID: <01da01bf1a67$5dc812d0$54561990@us.oracle.com> Fellow XML'ers and XSL'ers, Release 0.9.6 of the Oracle XSQL Page Processor, XSQL Servlet, and XSQL Command Line processor were posted today at: http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml The XSQL Servlet makes it easy to serve database-driven XML information (optionally transformed by XSLT stylesheets) to requestors over the Web. New Features Include -------------------- -> Uses the new Oracle XMLParser V2 2.0.2.4 that implements the XSLT Proposed Rec of 08-OCT-99 -> Support for all popular Servlet Engines (JServ, JRun, ServletExec,...) -> Support for any JDBC driver -> Support for Command-line processing of XSQL pages for use in scripts -> Comes with upgraded demos and samples, including a demo of an entire dynamic website built with a single .XSQL page and one XSLT stylesheet featuring stateless paging through database query results. ... Database + SQL + XML + XSLT = Powerful Stuff ... ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 19 21:33:33 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping References: <6BEB28284D0AD311931C0090276265D64B7BBD@ESBELMAIL1> Message-ID: <380CC767.A3430C7D@pacbell.net> Ross Mehlman wrote: > > The parsers/validators I've come across thus far stop when they come across > an error. > > Is there anything out there that will resume after finding an error (and > possibly find more?), writing errors to a report instead? Sure. Sun's validating parser continues processing after reporting nonfatal errors. Assemble your own report, I've done it lots! :-) It's a puzzle to me why so many validating parsers treate validity errors as fatal errors; big bug IMHO. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 19 21:39:37 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: Java Parser References: <380BBF49.A64FA2C5@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <380CC8D8.3242BF58@pacbell.net> David Megginson wrote: > > David Brownell writes: > > > > Ummmm...I need validation ! So, which one should it be ? TR2 or > > > XML4J ? Performance is an issue here ! > > > > Correctness should be too -- see my XML.com review. > > True, but you need to divide the correctness question into two parts: > > a) the parser accepts all well-formed/valid documents > b) the parser rejects all malformed/invalid documents > > A parser that fails either of these is non-conforming; that said, you > probably care a lot more about (a) than (b) for light-weight clients. Let's say it's application-dependent. If the light-weight client cared enough to validate, presumably it cares a lot about (b) ... else why bother to validate? This is an issue I wish I'd highlighted in that review, though it comes out pretty quickly when you look at the raw testing results. Oh well, next time -- analysing that much data on a dozen parsers was no small task! Did anyone mention size? Size should be an issue too. All other things being equal, smaller means fewer lines for bugs to nest in. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Tue Oct 19 22:04:27 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: Java Parser In-Reply-To: <380CC8D8.3242BF58@pacbell.net> References: <380BBF49.A64FA2C5@pacbell.net> <380CC8D8.3242BF58@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <14348.52805.737347.806739@localhost.localdomain> David Brownell writes: > Did anyone mention size? Size should be an issue too. All other > things being equal, smaller means fewer lines for bugs to nest in. Agreed. It also means faster download time (in an applet), less space (in a palmtop), etc. Many existing Java-based parsers could be made *much* smaller by spinning off non-core functionality into separate packages layered on top. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 19 22:43:55 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: Java Parser References: <380BBF49.A64FA2C5@pacbell.net> <380CC8D8.3242BF58@pacbell.net> <14348.52805.737347.806739@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <380CD7FF.E7C63879@pacbell.net> David Megginson wrote: > > David Brownell writes: > > > Did anyone mention size? Size should be an issue too. All other > > things being equal, smaller means fewer lines for bugs to nest in. > > Agreed. It also means faster download time (in an applet), less space > (in a palmtop), etc. Many existing Java-based parsers could be made > *much* smaller by spinning off non-core functionality into separate > packages layered on top. Validation's a good choice there. Any other particular favorites? Turns out that with SAX2, I think that all the information needed to validate is layered ... you get all the declarations (minus some holes in enumerated values, and you need to get one declaration from the LexicalHandler) with all the data, so this should be easily doable. In a discussion elsewhere this morning, someone else raised the notion of having a XML processing pipeline component that takes SAX(2) events and uses them to validate data "on the fly". Hey, I like this -- folk are starting to get the right perspective on this stuff. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Tue Oct 19 23:03:52 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping References: <6BEB28284D0AD311931C0090276265D64B7BBD@ESBELMAIL1> <380C9289.E0BAA768@mecomnet.de> Message-ID: <380CDCAB.B7B19503@pacbell.net> james anderson wrote: > > the xml parser with cl-http signals exceptions. lisp's control model permits > the handler to execute in the dynamic context of the parser which would permit > the caller to decide what to do. on the other hand, i've yet to implement any > continuations: i terminate the parser, but other options are possible. > > one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces > exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler > obtains control. this would mean that a callback interface would have to be > proposed, ratified, and implemented. i recall discussions of such a thing when > sax started, but the recollection is vague. SAX has an "ErrorHandler" object which is used to decide how to handle the error ... throwing an exception is the default for fatal (WF) errors, but for all other errors (and warnings) the default is to continue processing. So the effect is similar to the Lisp approach you mentioned, except that the context for the "continue?" decision is less dynamic. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From leeanne at leeanne.com Wed Oct 20 05:30:07 1999 From: leeanne at leeanne.com (Lee Anne Phillips) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: XML Schema I18N Development Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991019201651.009b9320@shell16.ba.best.com> Hi All, Does anyone know what's going on lately with I18N in regard to the Working Draft of XML Schema? The current version seems excessively, even scandalously, Eurocentric. I've seen what sounds like a good reference to the confluence of these two streams on the indexing engines but it's inside the members only section of W3C so I, the least of all, can't see it... Do they have a tentative timetable for release of the Recommendation? Thanks in advance, Lee Anne http://www.leeanne.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 20 06:51:53 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: RSS in Java Message-ID: <380D4A64.C1AF821@pacbell.net> Just curious -- does anyone happen to have any Java code that does some fun stuff with RSS? - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Wed Oct 20 07:29:16 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: Is this Immpossible !! Message-ID: <006e01bf1abb$fba2cbe0$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi All, I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml document. Presently, I am doing something like this String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is full of such string concatenations. Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All the material on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks & Best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991020/676a9862/attachment.htm From smuench at us.oracle.com Wed Oct 20 08:05:29 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: Is this Immpossible !! References: <006e01bf1abb$fba2cbe0$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf1ac1$ba89da30$4aed1990@us.oracle.com> If you're looking for a class library in Java that will handle all of the SQL-to-XML rendering for you, check out the Oracle XML SQL Utility at: http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml Given any JDBC connection "conn" and any SQL query "q" you can do: OracleXMLQuery oxq = new OracleXMLQuery(conn,q); String result = oxq.getXMLString(); to get the query results as a String, or String resultWithDTD = oxq.getXMLString(true); to get the query results as a String (with a dynamic DTD generated), or Document xmlDoc = oxq.getXMLDOM(); to get the query results as an in-memory DOM Document This is a robust implementation that works for any valid SQL construct Oracle supports (including user-defined structures and complex, dynamic object views) but when working against another database will work fine against its SQL as long as you have a JDBC driver for it. The Oracle XSQL Servlet (new release out today, also available at same URL) adds a convenient "page processing" layer on top of this XML SQL utiltity to very easily server XML documents based on multiple SQL statements in a "datapage". The "datapage" can be returned as a datagram over the web, or transformed using XSLT into XML, HTML, or text by supplying an appropriate stylesheet processing instruction in your "datapage". Believe you'll find these do exactly what you're looking for, depending on whether you want programmatic control (XMLSQL) or simple way to deploy new data services without programming (XSQL). ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Abhishek Srivastava To: xml dev mailing list Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 10:28 PM Subject: Is this Immpossible !! Hi All, I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml document. Presently, I am doing something like this String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is full of such string concatenations. Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All the material on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks & Best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From James.Anderson at mecomnet.de Wed Oct 20 11:45:58 1999 From: James.Anderson at mecomnet.de (james anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping References: <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> Message-ID: <380D8F9B.8425A773@mecomnet.de> interesting account re MESA. well, resumption does require that the module which raises the exception provide meaningfull and correctly operating provisions for restarts/continuations, and that it provide exceptions which carry information adequate to decide upon and undertake appropriate corrective action. the necessary interfaces are on the same level as the principal functional interface and, as such, would not appear to do anything to compromise encapsulation. they may be harder to correctly program than simply exiting, but that's another story. as mr. bray notes, they may not be desirable, but that's also another story. John Cowan wrote: > > james anderson scripsit: > > > one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces > > exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler > > obtains control. > >... > > The essential problem with resumption, IMHO, is that it breaks > encapsulation: the resumptive handler is written by the author of the > calling routine, but runs as a friend of the called routine. > To work correctly, then, the caller must know everything about the > callee. not necessarily: yes, the caller must understand the causes and consequences of the conditions raised, but they must also know and abide by the interface provided by the exceptions and are constrained to the defined restarts/continuations, both of which are specified by the callee. while this form of encapsulation may have more facets, where's it broken? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From matthew at praxis.cz Wed Oct 20 14:06:44 1999 From: matthew at praxis.cz (Matthew Gertner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping References: <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> <380D8F9B.8425A773@mecomnet.de> Message-ID: <380DB05C.5F1BF5B9@praxis.cz> james anderson wrote: > > interesting account re MESA. > > well, resumption does require that the module which raises the exception > provide meaningfull and correctly operating provisions for > restarts/continuations, and that it provide exceptions which carry information > adequate to decide upon and undertake appropriate corrective action. the > necessary interfaces are on the same level as the principal functional > interface and, as such, would not appear to do anything to compromise encapsulation. > > they may be harder to correctly program than simply exiting, but that's > another story. > as mr. bray notes, they may not be desirable, but that's also another story. > > John Cowan wrote: > > > > james anderson scripsit: > > > > > one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces > > > exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler > > > obtains control. > > > >... > > > > The essential problem with resumption, IMHO, is that it breaks > > encapsulation: the resumptive handler is written by the author of the > > calling routine, but runs as a friend of the called routine. > > To work correctly, then, the caller must know everything about the > > callee. > > not necessarily: yes, the caller must understand the causes and consequences > of the conditions raised, but they must also know and abide by the interface > provided by the exceptions and are constrained to the defined > restarts/continuations, both of which are specified by the callee. while this > form of encapsulation may have more facets, where's it broken? > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Wed Oct 20 14:26:52 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping Message-ID: <002501bf1af9$b1348010$38f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> From: Ross Mehlman >The parsers/validators I've come across thus far stop when they come across >an error. > >Is there anything out there that will resume after finding an error (and >possibly find more?), writing errors to a report instead? If you are talking about validity issues only (*not* well-formedness) then you might find my new tree-pattern validator "The Schematron" useful. If you use "assert" elements you can get error reports when validity conditions are not met (the validity conditions use XPath expressions.) If you use "report" elements, you can get messages when certain patterns are found, which can help you figure out what kind of structures are in your documents. The Schematron website is at. http://www.ascc.net/xml/resource/schematron/schematron.html You can also use it for string-testing of the values of elements and attributes, and many things that DTDs cannot give. Rick Jelliffe Computing Centre Academia Sinica Taipei, Taiwan xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Wed Oct 20 14:17:57 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: XML Schema I18N Development Message-ID: <001801bf1af8$7521bc60$38f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> From: Lee Anne Phillips >Does anyone know what's going on lately with I18N in regard to the Working Draft of XML Schema? The current version seems excessively, even scandalously, Eurocentric. I am on the W3C i18n interest group (*not* the working group) and I can say that I am pretty impressed with the care that Martin, Misha and the other W3C I18N working group members take when going through the specs. I think there is always a running issue of whether internationalization requires locale-neutrality or the support of lots of locales. For example, does i18n require that we don't use "1" or "2" for "Monday", or does it mean we should support many synonyms. If you have concerns about i18n and W3C specifications, please let the relevent W3C people know: i18n is one area where large-commercial interests are not particularly contrary to the public interest IMHO. Rick Jelliffe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From matthew at praxis.cz Wed Oct 20 14:07:47 1999 From: matthew at praxis.cz (Matthew Gertner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:05 2004 Subject: error trapping Message-ID: <380DB086.836DF781@praxis.cz> Of course it is possible to implement resume semantics in C++ or Java using exception handlers, although this places a significant burden on the developer. Termination is only the default behavior. If I am not mistaken, good old SP has excellent facilities for reporting validity errors while continuing to validate, although I don't know whether it uses standard C++ exceptions or some proprietary approach. In any case, this seems very much desirable for certain types of XML applications, such as authoring tools. Matthew james anderson wrote: > > interesting account re MESA. > > well, resumption does require that the module which raises the exception > provide meaningfull and correctly operating provisions for > restarts/continuations, and that it provide exceptions which carry information > adequate to decide upon and undertake appropriate corrective action. the > necessary interfaces are on the same level as the principal functional > interface and, as such, would not appear to do anything to compromise encapsulation. > > they may be harder to correctly program than simply exiting, but that's > another story. > as mr. bray notes, they may not be desirable, but that's also another story. > > John Cowan wrote: > > > > james anderson scripsit: > > > > > one intrinsic problem with java parsers is that the java control model forces > > > exceptions to unwind from the initiator's dynamic context before the handler > > > obtains control. > > > >... > > > > The essential problem with resumption, IMHO, is that it breaks > > encapsulation: the resumptive handler is written by the author of the > > calling routine, but runs as a friend of the called routine. > > To work correctly, then, the caller must know everything about the > > callee. > > not necessarily: yes, the caller must understand the causes and consequences > of the conditions raised, but they must also know and abide by the interface > provided by the exceptions and are constrained to the defined > restarts/continuations, both of which are specified by the callee. while this > form of encapsulation may have more facets, where's it broken? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Wed Oct 20 17:33:27 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML processors may have no way to resolve them to actual resources. What should a validating parser do when confronted by: Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk Wed Oct 20 17:58:50 1999 From: msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk (Miles Sabin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: Simon St.Laurent wrote, > URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML > processors may have no way to resolve them to actual > resources. What should a validating parser do when > confronted by: > > Exactly the same as what it would do if confronted by if it had no way of resolving an http URI to an actual resouce: report an error. Given that not many XML processors have URN resolution support at the mo', I guess this means the combination of URNs for DTDs + validation isn't a very good idea (yet). Cheers, Miles -- Miles Sabin Cromwell Media Internet Systems Architect 5/6 Glenthorne Mews +44 (0)181 410 2230 London, W6 0LJ msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk England xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu Wed Oct 20 18:09:19 1999 From: jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu (Jerome McDonough) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations In-Reply-To: <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <199910201609.MAA04836@westnet.com> At 11:33 AM 10/20/99 -0400, Simon St.Laurent wrote: >URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML processors may have no >way to resolve them to actual resources. What should a validating parser >do when confronted by: > > Well, if I can restate your example to the more appropriate URN syntax of: then it should go to DNS and ask for a NAPTR record describing both the location and communication protocol for a resolution service that can resolve URNs within the "itsSo" namespace. Then, if it supports the appropriate protocol (THTTP, say), it contacts the resolver for the itsSo namespace to ask where the resource identified by the NSS "Obvious" hangs out. Having obtained a URL for urn:itsSo:Obvious from the resolver, it goes and gets the actual DTD. Not a huge problem to implement, as long as we don't see too huge an explosion of protocols for contacting resolution services. At the moment, however, THTTP and the Handle system are about the only resolution protocols I've seen in use. Jerome McDonough -- jmcdonou@library.Berkeley.EDU | (......) Library Systems Office, 386 Doe, U.C. Berkeley | \ * * / Berkeley, CA 94720-6000 (510) 642-5168 | \ <> / "Well, it looks easy enough...." | \ -- / SGNORMPF!!! -- From the Famous Last Words file | |||| xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com Wed Oct 20 18:31:56 1999 From: Curt.Arnold at hyprotech.com (Arnold, Curt) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: <61DAD58E8F4ED211AC8400A0C9B468731AAFE2@THOR> Shouldn't throw some event out to its caller and have the calling application have the first shot at resolving the URI. Even if it is a traditional URL, the application may know that a copy is available locally and substitute it for actual resource. If the caller doesn't want to handle the event, then the parse could try to resolve it the best it could. -----Original Message----- From: Simon St.Laurent [mailto:simonstl@simonstl.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 10:33 AM To: XML-Dev Mailing list Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML processors may have no way to resolve them to actual resources. What should a validating parser do when confronted by: Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Wed Oct 20 18:35:48 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations In-Reply-To: <199910201609.MAA04836@westnet.com> References: <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <199910201635.MAA12530@hesketh.net> At 12:10 PM 10/20/99 -0400, Jerome McDonough wrote: [excellent detailed answer to details of URN resolution] >Not a huge problem to implement, as long as we don't see too huge an explosion >of protocols >for contacting resolution services. At the moment, however, THTTP and the >Handle >system are about the only resolution protocols I've seen in use. Next question... do any XML parsers support URNs? Do they use these resolution protocols? Does a lack of support for URNs in any way affect XML conformance? I tend to doubt it, but it just popped up in a document I was working on and made life interesting. In the meantime, I think we're stuck with Miles Sabin's description of what actually happened to me: >if it had no way of resolving an http URI to an actual >resouce: report an error. URNs feel a lot like FPIs to me in terms of their resolvability and lack of infrastructure thereof, and I often wonder if they really belong mixed with URLs. Oh well. Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From camk at channelpoint.com Wed Oct 20 18:48:53 1999 From: camk at channelpoint.com (Kelly Campbell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: We're using something similar to the URN. Basically, we just put the filename in the system declaration, and have a EntityResolver registered with the parser that knows where all the dtd files reside, and can return them as InputStreams. This makes it so we can store the dtd's in a central location on the filesystem, or in a database. For example: This works great on xml4j, except it only works with one file. For example, if we try to include another dtd with an in the main dtd, the parsing fails unless we use the full path in the system designator. Does anyone know if this is a valid use of the system declaration, and if so, is xml4j just buggy on resolving multiple files? Thanks, Kelly -- Kelly A. Campbell Commerce Core Engineer ChannelPoint, Inc. Colorado Springs, Co. Voice: 719-867-9324 AIM: chptcamk > -----Original Message----- > From: Miles Sabin [mailto:msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk] > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 9:57 AM > To: XML-Dev Mailing list > Cc: Simon St.Laurent > Subject: RE: URNs in SYSTEM declarations > > > Simon St.Laurent wrote, > > URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML > > processors may have no way to resolve them to actual > > resources. What should a validating parser do when > > confronted by: > > > > > > Exactly the same as what it would do if confronted by > > > > if it had no way of resolving an http URI to an actual > resouce: report an error. > > Given that not many XML processors have URN resolution > support at the mo', I guess this means the combination of > URNs for DTDs + validation isn't a very good idea (yet). > > Cheers, > > > Miles > > -- > Miles Sabin Cromwell Media > Internet Systems Architect 5/6 Glenthorne Mews > +44 (0)181 410 2230 London, W6 0LJ > msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk England > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk Wed Oct 20 18:55:51 1999 From: msabin at cromwellmedia.co.uk (Miles Sabin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: Simon St.Laurent wrote, > Next question... do any XML parsers support URNs? Do > they use these resolution protocols? If you're working in java you could put together a URN protocol handler, in which case a java.net.URLConnection would be able to do the resolution. Most java parsers will, by default, use a URLConnection to fetch the external subset, so that should do the trick. Alternatively, if you're using SAX, or a SAX-like API you could put together a custom EntityResolver. > Does a lack of support for URNs in any way affect XML > conformance? Well, if the parser claims to be validating, *and* doesn't have URN resolution support, then it wouldn't be conformant if it didn't report a fatal error. By the sound of it, the parser you're using was doing the Right Thing. Cheers, Miles -- Miles Sabin Cromwell Media Internet Systems Architect 5/6 Glenthorne Mews +44 (0)181 410 2230 London, W6 0LJ msabin@cromwellmedia.co.uk England xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 20 19:50:32 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations In-Reply-To: "Simon St.Laurent"'s message of "Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:33:09 -0400" References: <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> Message-ID: "Simon St.Laurent" writes: > URNs are an acceptable part of the URI spec, but XML processors may have no > way to resolve them to actual resources. What should a validating parser > do when confronted by: > > Send it to the SAX EntityResolver and pray that a usable InputSource comes back (at least this is one thing that we did allow for in SAX 1.0). Actually, URN resolution is a *really* good candidate for a SAX filter: the filter can take the URN from the SAX parser, replace it with a URL, and pass than on to the client application for (optional) further processing before returning it to the parser. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 20 19:54:04 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: SAX and URNs In-Reply-To: "Simon St.Laurent"'s message of "Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:35:30 -0400" References: <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> <199910201635.MAA12530@hesketh.net> Message-ID: "Simon St.Laurent" writes: > Next question... do any XML parsers support URNs? Do they use these > resolution protocols? Hmm -- this sounds like a really good candidate for a SAX conformance test. Make up an XML document that references a URN, then implement an EntityResolver that maps the URN to a URL that actually points to something. SAX parsers shouldn't choke on this (even if they know nothing about URNs), but I'm not willing to bet too much: I think that AElfred might be OK, and James almost certain does it right in XT. > URNs feel a lot like FPIs to me in terms of their resolvability and lack of > infrastructure thereof, and I often wonder if they really belong mixed with > URLs. Oh well. Yeah, there's been a lot of discussion on this point. By the way, do we have any usable URN schemes yet? All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Wed Oct 20 20:01:42 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: error trapping In-Reply-To: <380D8F9B.8425A773@mecomnet.de> from "james anderson" at Oct 20, 99 11:47:09 am Message-ID: <199910201845.OAA21380@locke.ccil.org> james anderson scripsit: > well, resumption does require that the module which raises the exception > provide meaningfull and correctly operating provisions for > restarts/continuations, and that it provide exceptions which carry information > adequate to decide upon and undertake appropriate corrective action. I think that Common Lisp continuations are definitely more structured than what Mesa allowed, which was a silent return to the signaler (as if the exception hadn't been thrown), and even a goto to an arbitrary label in the signaler's context, IIRC! -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu Wed Oct 20 20:14:22 1999 From: jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu (Jerome McDonough) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations In-Reply-To: <199910201635.MAA12530@hesketh.net> References: <199910201609.MAA04836@westnet.com> <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> Message-ID: <199910201814.OAA22896@westnet.com> At 12:35 PM 10/20/99 -0400, Simon St.Laurent wrote: >Next question... do any XML parsers support URNs? Do they use these >resolution protocols? > None, to the best of my knowledge. Justin Couch, who's been working on the IETF WG on URNs, proposed a file-based resolution system that I suspect could be integrated into a lot of XML parsers without too much fuss. You can find his proposal at http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/java/urn/file_based_resolver.html. It would only give you a local solution, instead of a global one, but that could be enough for many uses. >URNs feel a lot like FPIs to me in terms of their resolvability and lack of >infrastructure thereof, and I often wonder if they really belong mixed with >URLs. Oh well. Many places (including the university where I work) would probably switch to a URN based system of tracking resources tomorrow, *if* Navigator and IE both supported URN resolution. Occassionally when stricken with fever I consider going to work for Microsoft just to get URN resolution incorporated in to the damned browsers..... Jerome McDonough -- jmcdonou@library.Berkeley.EDU | (......) Library Systems Office, 386 Doe, U.C. Berkeley | \ * * / Berkeley, CA 94720-6000 (510) 642-5168 | \ <> / "Well, it looks easy enough...." | \ -- / SGNORMPF!!! -- From the Famous Last Words file | |||| xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com Wed Oct 20 20:16:04 1999 From: Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com (Gordon, Simon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: CDATA Section Message-ID: > I need to send non-parsable character data between applications so I hoped > to use a CDATA section. Before I committed myself I decided to run some > sample messages through a validator (rxp). It consistently rejects the > CDATA section yet I can't see anything wrong. Short test example:- > > > > ]> > > > Output from "rxp -xsV test.xml":- > > Warning: CDATA section not allowed here > in unnamed entity at line 5 char 16 of file:test.xml > > As I'm new to this (XML), it must be something I'm doing wrong. The XML > Spec says that CDATA can occur anywhere character data can occur. Can > anyone help? > > PS. Just tried and removing the DOCTYPE section > altogether. The former passes the validation test and the latter passes > the well-formedness test (rxp -xs test.xml)! > > Regards, > > Simon Gordon xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From cowan at locke.ccil.org Wed Oct 20 20:38:52 1999 From: cowan at locke.ccil.org (John Cowan) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: CDATA Section In-Reply-To: from "Gordon, Simon" at Oct 20, 99 01:01:00 pm Message-ID: <199910201923.PAA22592@locke.ccil.org> Gordon, Simon scripsit: > > > > > The problem is with this line, which says that TEST elements must contain a single *element* whose name is "CDATA". This has nothing to do with CDATA sections. > > Warning: CDATA section not allowed here > > in unnamed entity at line 5 char 16 of file:test.xml Quite right; your document is invalid because your TEST element contains character data instead of an element named CDATA. > > PS. Just tried and removing the DOCTYPE section > > altogether. The former passes the validation test and the latter passes > > the well-formedness test (rxp -xs test.xml)! And rightly so. You cannot *compel* the content of an element to be a CDATA section or not by using DTD-based validation. Elements declared with #PCDATA content may express that content with or without CDATA sections. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Wed Oct 20 22:00:22 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: Encodings Message-ID: http://www.unicode.org ?? Vane lists -----Original Message----- From: Simon St.Laurent [mailto:simonstl@simonstl.com] Sent: Thursday, October 14, 1999 12:14 PM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: Encodings At 11:58 AM 10/14/99 -0400, Elliotte Rusty Harold wrote: >There is no good single source of reference for all these. [...] >However, if all you want are the official names of all the different >encodings you'll find them at > >http://java.sun.com/products/jdk/1.2/docs/guide/internat/encoding.doc.html Wow! This is great. It figures that I should have been looking through your Java I/O book sitting on my shelf rather than surfing through too many bad search engine results. Now if only they'd link that list to more details about each encoding... Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From burton at relativity.yi.org Wed Oct 20 22:26:14 1999 From: burton at relativity.yi.org (Kevin Burton) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: RSS in Java References: <380D4A64.C1AF821@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <380E25A8.2142E455@relativity.yi.org> I do... Kind of basic. It is under my JetSpeed (http://java.apache.org/jetspeed) project and used the XML4J. You will have to check out the code from CVS as I have'nt release this into the latest beta... Here is a URL of them in action: http://relativity.yi.org:8080/servlet/org.apache.jetspeed.Home?action=1&page=2 Let me know what you think. If you make any modifications I would love to incorporate them back into the code (but you don't have to.) Kevin. David Brownell wrote: > > Just curious -- does anyone happen to have any Java code that > does some fun stuff with RSS? > > - Dave > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wchen at tri.sbc.com Wed Oct 20 23:52:58 1999 From: wchen at tri.sbc.com (Chen, Weijing) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) Message-ID: <6C5FB3C08FCBD1118EE600805FEA9CC201FD6F9E@trimail.tri.sbc.com> Folks, I am thinking about using XML DTD (or its schema specification) as a DDL to define schema of a database. Following is the simularity of XML and traditional SQL: DTD database schema a huge XML document database table XML query language SQL small XML document SQL query result HTTP ODBC, JDBC Now logically you are not storing data into traditional SQL table, but as a large XML document. Physically they could still relational database, or object database. The advantage of this is that XML is object-oriented. It is much easy and close to real application to model in XML than SQL. A step farther, one could use XML to model his specific domain and provide a query engine to handle the query and dispatch it to an application module. In this environment, there is not actually physical database but application process running behind the scene. The user will have all the freedom provided by XML query language to manipulate system as he want. No more API. What your thought? Anybody out there build such framework? Weijing Chen xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mcdowella at mcdowella.demon.co.uk Thu Oct 21 01:08:53 1999 From: mcdowella at mcdowella.demon.co.uk (A. G. McDowell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:06 2004 Subject: error trapping In-Reply-To: <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> References: <380C9289.E0BAA768@mecomnet.de> <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> Message-ID: <2aDHJHA9skD4EwHl@mcdowella.demon.co.uk> In article <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org>, John Cowan writes > >It is no accident that C++ and Java have termination semantics only >for their exceptions. Unfortunately I cannot find a citation to this >story, but it is instructive. > The Design and Evolution of C++ Bjarne Stroustrup, published by Addison Wesley, ISBN 0-201-54330-3 Section 16.6, P.390-393 in my copy There is also a two-line summary of Cedar/Mesa experience, which was apparently repeated in two large IBM projects, and was supported by many others: termination is preferred over resumption; this is not a matter of opinion but a matter of years of experience. Resumption is seductive, but not valid. The suggested alternative to resumption makes most sense in the context of resource acquisition. Sacrificing rigor for brevity: while((resource = acquire()) != null) callback(); The callback should either release some more resource or throw a (terminating) exception, so you exit the loop either normally, with the resource, or via the exception. I was amused by the following section: ... Martin O'Riordan reported that "Microsoft had several years of positive experience with resumable exception handling", but the absence of specific examples and doubts about the value of OS/2 Release 1 as a proof of technical soundness weakened his case. I have no experience of OS/2 Release anything, and so cannot comment. Perhaps somebody out there can tell us if later releases evolved away from resumable exceptions. -- A. G. McDowell xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mcdowella at mcdowella.demon.co.uk Thu Oct 21 07:44:50 1999 From: mcdowella at mcdowella.demon.co.uk (A. G. McDowell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: error trapping In-Reply-To: <2aDHJHA9skD4EwHl@mcdowella.demon.co.uk> References: <380C9289.E0BAA768@mecomnet.de> <199910191740.NAA20238@locke.ccil.org> <2aDHJHA9skD4EwHl@mcdowella.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: In article <2aDHJHA9skD4EwHl@mcdowella.demon.co.uk>, A. G. McDowell writes > >The suggested alternative to resumption makes most sense in the context >of resource acquisition. Sacrificing rigor for brevity: >while((resource = acquire()) != null) callback(); >The callback should either release some more resource or throw a >(terminating) exception, so you exit the loop either normally, with the >resource, or via the exception. > but meant while((resource = acquire()) == null) callback(); assuming that acquire() returns null when it fails to get the resource, so that is when we need to callback and retry. Oops! -- A. G. McDowell ... If it's not tested, it doesn't work! xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From pmandgi at hotmail.com Thu Oct 21 07:41:13 1999 From: pmandgi at hotmail.com (Prakash Mandgi) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: XML Implementation in IBM XML4J2_0_15 parser with XPath Message-ID: <19991021054029.74893.qmail@hotmail.com> Hi All, I am running into a problem using the lotus XSL XPath implementation on IBM XML4J2_0_15. Problem: I have an rmi service which basically takes and XPath string ( query string ), runs it across a persisted DOM object, which is retrieved from the object database, and returns a document fragment back. The problem i am running into is creating a new document object of which the root element is the document fragment. I am trying to append to this root node, the nodes obtained from the XPath query. Unfortunately the implementation of IBM parsers is that it compares the nodes owner document with that of the element under which i need to insert the nodes. If the owner document are not the same, as it is my case, it will not allow you to append a child. Questions: Is this a DOM thingie or is it at an IBM implementation feature. Does any one have a way to work around this problem without cloning the document, which can be fairly large, and then creating a document fragment which has the Node list embedded within it. Is there a better implementation than that IBM parser, with source code ;-) which has the following features - XPath integration - XML TreeDiff to find out the difference between two dom documents and then merging the two. Has any one implemented DOM with copy constructors for the node impl etc objects ( I know its a C++ feature but it makes life much simpler ;-) ) Other -- Java 1.2 implementation Regards Prakash - Need the entire source code in java -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991021/4d7eba7f/attachment.htm From Gilles.Filippini at edf.fr Thu Oct 21 09:01:50 1999 From: Gilles.Filippini at edf.fr (Gilles FILIPPINI) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: libxml on Solaris 2.6 Message-ID: <049AD380EBA370F1*/c=fr/admd=atlas/prmd=edfgdf/o=notes/s=Filippini/g=Gilles/@MHS> Hi, I'd like to use the library libxml on Sun/Solaris 2.6, but I can't succeed compiling it. Although the ./configure step seems OK, I get the folowing error message during the compilation of nanohttp.c : ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I. -I. -DLIBXML_VERSION=\"1.7.3\" -g -O2 -c -fPIC -DPIC nanohttp.c -o .libs/nanohttp.lo nanohttp.c:444: warning: `struct in_addr' declared inside parameter list nanohttp.c:444: warning: its scope is only this definition or declaration, nanohttp.c:444: warning: which is probably not what you want. nanohttp.c:445: parameter `ia' has incomplete type nanohttp.c: In function `xmlNanoHTTPConnectAttempt': nanohttp.c:446: `IPPROTO_TCP' undeclared (first use this function) nanohttp.c:446: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once nanohttp.c:446: for each function it appears in.) nanohttp.c:447: storage size of `sin' isn't known nanohttp.c: In function `xmlNanoHTTPConnectHost': nanohttp.c:549: warning: assignment makes pointer from integer without a cast nanohttp.c:558: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type nanohttp.c:560: storage size of `ia' isn't known nanohttp.c:561: dereferencing pointer to incomplete type nanohttp.c:562: type of formal parameter 1 is incomplete *** Error code 1 make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `nanohttp.lo' Current working directory /usr2/eid/libxml-1.7.3 *** Error code 1 make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `all-recursive' Current working directory /usr2/eid/libxml-1.7.3 *** Error code 1 make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `all-recursive-am' ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I tried to hack in nanohttp.c to include but other errors followed... Has anyone experienced this problem before ? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. - Gilles Filippini. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From matthew at praxis.cz Thu Oct 21 10:58:11 1999 From: matthew at praxis.cz (Matthew Gertner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations References: <199910201609.MAA04836@westnet.com> <199910201533.LAA09097@hesketh.net> <199910201814.OAA22896@westnet.com> Message-ID: <380ED5A5.A86D4724@praxis.cz> > Many places (including the university where I work) would probably switch to > a URN based system of tracking resources tomorrow, *if* Navigator and > IE both supported URN resolution. Occassionally when stricken with fever > I consider going to work for Microsoft just to get URN resolution incorporated > in > to the damned browsers..... If you are happy with a Microsoft-only solution, you could use asynchronous pluggable protocols (http://msdn.microsoft.com/workshop/networking/pluggable/pluggable.asp) as an alternative to moving to Redmond. (I assuming that you have some code for resolving the URNs and are just looking for a way to integrate this into the browser.) For Netscape, of course, you just need to download, modify and build the Mozilla sources. ;-) Ease of extensibility is one of the reasons that Microsoft won the browser wars. Matthew xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Daniel.Veillard at w3.org Thu Oct 21 14:59:37 1999 From: Daniel.Veillard at w3.org (Daniel Veillard) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: libxml on Solaris 2.6 In-Reply-To: <049AD380EBA370F1*/c=fr/admd=atlas/prmd=edfgdf/o=notes/s=Filippini/g=Gilles/@MHS> References: <049AD380EBA370F1*/c=fr/admd=atlas/prmd=edfgdf/o=notes/s=Filippini/g=Gilles/@MHS> Message-ID: <19991021085923.C24739@w3.org> On Thu, Oct 21, 1999 at 09:01:11AM +0200, Gilles FILIPPINI wrote: > Hi, > > I'd like to use the library libxml on Sun/Solaris 2.6, but I can't succeed compiling it. > Although the ./configure step seems OK, I get the folowing error message during the compilation of nanohttp.c : > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I. -I. -DLIBXML_VERSION=\"1.7.3\" -g -O2 -c -fPIC -DPIC nanohttp.c -o .libs/nanohttp.lo Hum, I'm unable to reproduce it, it compiles leanly on the Solaris 2.6 box I have a login on: gcc -Wall -g -O2 -I. -I.. -I. -DLIBXML_VERSION=\"1.7.3\" -c nanohttp.c ar rc libxml.a tree.o parser.o entities.o error.o SAX.o encoding.o debugXML.o valid.o xpointer.o HTMLtree.o HTMLparser.o xpath.o xmlIO.o xmlmemory.o nanohttp.o ~/XML -> uname -a SunOS www26 5.6 Generic_105181-16 sun4u sparc This is really strange could you check that configure detected the same set of headers on your machine ? ~/XML -> grep HAVE_STDLIB_H confih.h grep: confih.h: No such file or directory ~/XML -> grep HAVE_STDLIB_H config.h #define HAVE_STDLIB_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_UNISTD_H config.h #define HAVE_UNISTD_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_SYS_SOCKET_H config.h #define HAVE_SYS_SOCKET_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_NETINET_IN_H config.h #define HAVE_NETINET_IN_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_ARPA_INET_H config.h #define HAVE_ARPA_INET_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_FCNTL_H config.h #define HAVE_FCNTL_H 1 ~/XML -> grep HAVE_SYS_SELECT_H config.h #define HAVE_SYS_SELECT_H 1 > > I tried to hack in nanohttp.c to include but other errors followed... > > Has anyone experienced this problem before ? That's the first time I get such a report, Daniel P.S.: BTW the libxml mailing-list is xml@rufus.w3.org :-) -- Daniel.Veillard@w3.org | W3C, INRIA Rhone-Alpes | Today's Bookmarks : Tel : +33 476 615 257 | 655, avenue de l'Europe | Linux, WWW, rpmfind, Fax : +33 476 615 207 | 38330 Montbonnot FRANCE | rpm2html, XML, http://www.w3.org/People/W3Cpeople.html#Veillard | badminton, and Kaffe. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com Thu Oct 21 15:46:00 1999 From: Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com (Goyal, Sanjeev) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: XML Implementation in IBM XML4J2_0_15 parser with XPath Message-ID: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239DCE@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Hi Prakash, I have also experiences the same problem. But I am using the sun XML-TR2 release as XML Parser. The solution to this problem is to use changeNodeOwner() API on DocumentEx (extension of Document interface) provided in sun's implementation. You can call this API on your Document (which has the root node, where you want to append nodes obtained from XPath Query) object and pass the node from XPath as parameter to this API. After that if you append these nodes, it will work. DOM Level 1 APIs doesn't have this support defined in the spec. But DOM Level 2 spec has an API importNode() which I guess, is what we need in this problem. I don't know if any XML Parser with DOM Level 2 support is available as of now. Try using sun's XML Parser. Cheers, Sanjeev -----Original Message----- From: Prakash Mandgi [mailto:pmandgi@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 1:47 AM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: XML Implementation in IBM XML4J2_0_15 parser with XPath Hi All, I am running into a problem using the lotus XSL XPath implementation on IBM XML4J2_0_15. Problem: I have an rmi service which basically takes and XPath string ( query string ), runs it across a persisted DOM object, which is retrieved from the object database, and returns a document fragment back. The problem i am running into is creating a new document object of which the root element is the document fragment. I am trying to append to this root node, the nodes obtained from the XPath query. Unfortunately the implementation of IBM parsers is that it compares the nodes owner document with that of the element under which i need to insert the nodes. If the owner document are not the same, as it is my case, it will not allow you to append a child. Questions: Is this a DOM thingie or is it at an IBM implementation feature. Does any one have a way to work around this problem without cloning the document, which can be fairly large, and then creating a document fragment which has the Node list embedded within it. Is there a better implementation than that IBM parser, with source code ;-) which has the following features - XPath integration - XML TreeDiff to find out the difference between two dom documents and then merging the two. Has any one implemented DOM with copy constructors for the node impl etc objects ( I know its a C++ feature but it makes life much simpler ;-) ) Other -- Java 1.2 implementation Regards Prakash - Need the entire source code in java -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991021/523eb4ed/attachment.htm From Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com Thu Oct 21 15:52:06 1999 From: Sanjeev.Goyal at usa.xerox.com (Goyal, Sanjeev) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: <8B049D471C61D111847C00805FA67B1C03239DCF@usa0129ms1.ess.mc.xerox.com> Abhishek, Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I have used sun's XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your Document Node. Hope it helps. Sanjeev -----Original Message----- From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM To: xml dev mailing list Subject: Is this Immpossible !! Hi All, I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml document. Presently, I am doing something like this String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is full of such string concatenations. Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All the material on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks & Best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991021/46bc6a18/attachment.htm From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Thu Oct 21 16:59:02 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: SOAP Return.asp Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3834 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991021/0957952a/SOAPReturn.obj From AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net Thu Oct 21 18:13:22 1999 From: AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net (AlanM) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:07 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE6897909E64@MAIL> Hi guys, Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the server in SQL or XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert it into SQL again, which may slow down the process. > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Birbeck [SMTP:Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net] > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:29 PM > To: xml dev mailing list > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > > > > Hi everyone, > > Very busy so can't give you in depth on this, but I note that you are > using VB scripting so here is a bit of code from a VB script version of > our SOAP server. > > It's not that complicated, but it provides you with an easy way to create > a results set from any values. For example, it could build a node list > from a three element array, with the first element being another array > that contains record sets, the second being an integer, and the third > being an XML DOM node (should you want to). > > Note that it copes with nested recordsets - which is great if you are > using the Microsoft data shaping facility in ADO. In fact using this > routine and data shaping is probably the easiest way to get an XML > document with real structure out of a relational database. > > Two quick things that are slightly off theme: > > First - if you are returning XML you should really consider querying in > XML. The client should not really be sending SQL queries since you are not > returning a SQL result set. You should accept an XML query (say, using > XPath) and then convert that on the server to an SQL query. That way the > fact that your data is currently relational will be hidden (since it may > change). > > Second - for those interested - note how much better SOAP structure is > than XML-RPC! I've fallen for it!! > > Best regards, > > Mark Birbeck > x-port.net Ltd. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 2:49 PM > To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' > Cc: xml dev mailing list > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > > > Abhishek, > > Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to > generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I have used sun's > XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your > Document Node. > > Hope it helps. > Sanjeev > > -----Original Message----- > From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM > To: xml dev mailing list > Subject: Is this Immpossible !! > > > > Hi All, > > I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a > database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server > side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. > > The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for > "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). > > Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml > document. > Presently, I am doing something like this > > String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") > > However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is > full of such string concatenations. > > Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All the material > on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are > there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would > create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks & Best Regards, > Abhishek. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > _/ Abhishek Srivastava > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 > _/ (Url) > > _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired > or get whacked. > You're networking or you're not > working. Dot-com or die > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > << File: SOAP Return.asp >> xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Thu Oct 21 18:53:45 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! References: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE6897909E64@MAIL> Message-ID: <013c01bf1be5$072eedc0$54561990@us.oracle.com> You need to decide what is an acceptable client interface for your server-side app. *Mark's* point about SQL is totally valid if what that means is that end-users would have to type-in SQL statements as their "user experience". *Your* point about not querying XML is totally valid since the database is going to do that querying and sorting much faster over non-trivial amounts of data than doing it in an XML document. A compromise is some kind of servlet that lets the user provide parameters to pre-defined SQL statements that they don't have to understand. For example, using the Oracle XSQL Servlet, I can deploy a page on my webserver that looks like: ======== employee.xsql =========================== SELECT firstnmame, lastname, birthday FROM employees_table WHERE ('{@lastname}' IS NOT NULL AND LASTNAME LIKE '%{@lastname}%') AND ('{@firstname}' IS NOT NULL AND FIRSTNAME LIKE '%{@firstname}%') ======== employee.xsql =========================== And then they can request (likely through an HTML form that they fill out) a URL like: http://yourserver/employee.xsql?lastname=jones They'll get the info they are looking for without writing SQL themselves. If you leave off the then they'll get the raw XML results of the query. ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: AlanM To: Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 9:11 AM Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | | Hi guys, | Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the server in SQL or | XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert it into SQL | again, which may slow down the process. | | | > -----Original Message----- | > From: Mark Birbeck [SMTP:Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net] | > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:29 PM | > To: xml dev mailing list | > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > | > | > Hi everyone, | > | > Very busy so can't give you in depth on this, but I note that you are | > using VB scripting so here is a bit of code from a VB script version of | > our SOAP server. | > | > It's not that complicated, but it provides you with an easy way to create | > a results set from any values. For example, it could build a node list | > from a three element array, with the first element being another array | > that contains record sets, the second being an integer, and the third | > being an XML DOM node (should you want to). | > | > Note that it copes with nested recordsets - which is great if you are | > using the Microsoft data shaping facility in ADO. In fact using this | > routine and data shaping is probably the easiest way to get an XML | > document with real structure out of a relational database. | > | > Two quick things that are slightly off theme: | > | > First - if you are returning XML you should really consider querying in | > XML. The client should not really be sending SQL queries since you are not | > returning a SQL result set. You should accept an XML query (say, using | > XPath) and then convert that on the server to an SQL query. That way the | > fact that your data is currently relational will be hidden (since it may | > change). | > | > Second - for those interested - note how much better SOAP structure is | > than XML-RPC! I've fallen for it!! | > | > Best regards, | > | > Mark Birbeck | > x-port.net Ltd. | > | > | > | > -----Original Message----- | > From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] | > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 2:49 PM | > To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' | > Cc: xml dev mailing list | > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > | > Abhishek, | > | > Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to | > generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I have used sun's | > XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your | > Document Node. | > | > Hope it helps. | > Sanjeev | > | > -----Original Message----- | > From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] | > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM | > To: xml dev mailing list | > Subject: Is this Immpossible !! | > | > | > | > Hi All, | > | > I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a | > database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server | > side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. | > | > The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for | > "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). | > | > Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml | > document. | > Presently, I am doing something like this | > | > String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") | > | > However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is | > full of such string concatenations. | > | > Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All the material | > on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are | > there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would | > create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? | > | > Any help would be greatly appreciated. | > | > Thanks & Best Regards, | > Abhishek. | > | > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > _/ Abhishek Srivastava | > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO | > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- | > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 | > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 | > _/ (Url) | > | > _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired | > or get whacked. | > You're networking or you're not | > working. Dot-com or die | > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS | > | > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > | > << File: SOAP Return.asp >> | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tpassin at mitretek.org Thu Oct 21 19:20:51 1999 From: tpassin at mitretek.org (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: <003201bf1be8$7f135800$38a3f1ce@ls-.mitretek.org> From: AlanM > >Hi guys, >Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the server in SQL or >XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert it into SQL >again, which may slow down the process. > > "Speed" is relative. If the query is complex and there is a lot of data, the time for the database to return the results will probably dominate the response time. If so, the time to convert into/out of XML would be unimportant. Conversely, if the normal queries got a very quick return from the database, the XML-query-conversion time might win. Also, the time to connect to the database could be significant. So there might be more than one answer to this, depending on your particular case. As an aside, there have been a number of efforts in the past to specify SQL as a general query language independent of any type of database. So it is not unreasonable to think of using it instead of XPATH strings, whatever the form of the data storage. Of course, either translating SQL into XPATH strings or vice versa is going to be a substantial effort for general or complex queries, no matter how you slice it. Thomas Passin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Thu Oct 21 19:22:08 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] Message-ID: I think speed is not an issue. As a proportion of the time spent sending the query, extracting the data and then packaging it up for return, the time you take to convert the query from one syntax to another is negligible. However, what you lose by using SQL syntax IS an issue. You have data stored in a relational database which you query in a relational way, but then return the results as a node set. This seems OK, until you consider what you have presented to the outside world - a node set which can be queried using SQL syntax. Now, imagine that someone else stores their data in an object database, but also returns their results in XML. They are presenting a node set which can be queried using some object query syntax. So we have two sets of data that to the outside world have similar structure - they are both a set of hierarchical nodes - but which have two different ways of being queried. Not good. Add to that, that the person who did the object database may convert you to his way of thinking and you then want to ditch your relational database, and suddenly all those queries that people have set up to access your server have to change. My point is simply that just as you return data from your server in a common format - XML - so too you should accept requests in a common format. You should convert requests in, say, XPath, to SQL queries or object queries or whatever queries. Otherwise you are not really presenting an XML-interface to your data. And we'll never get the Coca-Cola effect (the whole world singing the same song, if you're wondering). Best regards, Mark Birbeck x-port.net Ltd. > -----Original Message----- > From: AlanM [mailto:AlanM@SYNECTICS.Soft.net] > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 5:11 PM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > > > > Hi guys, > Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the > server in SQL or > XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert > it into SQL > again, which may slow down the process. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Mark Birbeck [SMTP:Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net] > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:29 PM > > To: xml dev mailing list > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > > > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > Very busy so can't give you in depth on this, but I note > that you are > > using VB scripting so here is a bit of code from a VB > script version of > > our SOAP server. > > > > It's not that complicated, but it provides you with an easy > way to create > > a results set from any values. For example, it could build > a node list > > from a three element array, with the first element being > another array > > that contains record sets, the second being an integer, and > the third > > being an XML DOM node (should you want to). > > > > Note that it copes with nested recordsets - which is great > if you are > > using the Microsoft data shaping facility in ADO. In fact using this > > routine and data shaping is probably the easiest way to get an XML > > document with real structure out of a relational database. > > > > Two quick things that are slightly off theme: > > > > First - if you are returning XML you should really consider > querying in > > XML. The client should not really be sending SQL queries > since you are not > > returning a SQL result set. You should accept an XML query > (say, using > > XPath) and then convert that on the server to an SQL query. > That way the > > fact that your data is currently relational will be hidden > (since it may > > change). > > > > Second - for those interested - note how much better SOAP > structure is > > than XML-RPC! I've fallen for it!! > > > > Best regards, > > > > Mark Birbeck > > x-port.net Ltd. > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 2:49 PM > > To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' > > Cc: xml dev mailing list > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > > > > > > Abhishek, > > > > Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to > > generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I > have used sun's > > XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your > > Document Node. > > > > Hope it helps. > > Sanjeev > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM > > To: xml dev mailing list > > Subject: Is this Immpossible !! > > > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > I have the following requirement. A client > wants to query a > > database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. > At the server > > side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. > > > > The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for > > "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for > are there). > > > > Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml > > document. > > Presently, I am doing something like this > > > > String("") + rs.getField("auName") + > String("") > > > > However, this is a very inelegant approach as > the code is > > full of such string concatenations. > > > > Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All > the material > > on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about > writing them ? Are > > there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would > > create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in > the code ? > > > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thanks & Best Regards, > > Abhishek. > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > _/ Abhishek Srivastava > > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO > > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- > > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 > > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 > > _/ (Url) > > > > > _/ You've heard it all by > now. Get wired > > or get whacked. > > You're networking or you're not > > working. Dot-com or die > > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > << File: SOAP Return.asp >> > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From schen at falconwing.com Thu Oct 21 19:54:49 1999 From: schen at falconwing.com (schen@falconwing.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Mark, everyone, On Thu, 21 Oct 1999, Mark Birbeck wrote: [ snip ] > My point is simply that just as you return data from your server in a > common format - XML - so too you should accept requests in a common > format. You should convert requests in, say, XPath, to SQL queries or > object queries or whatever queries. Otherwise you are not really > presenting an XML-interface to your data. > > And we'll never get the Coca-Cola effect (the whole world singing the > same song, if you're wondering). As it is now, it won't work until the XML Query Working Group publishes a spec. Until then, SQL is a semi-standard, pragmatic choice if you need to deploy now. On the other hand, I'll be happy to discuss various potential XML query language candidates if anyone is interested =) . . . Sean. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Thu Oct 21 20:38:15 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] References: Message-ID: <01c601bf1bf3$eb7d17f0$54561990@us.oracle.com> Mark, I'm not advocating returning the SQL query results in a SQL-query-results-looking format. By combining XSLT transformation with canonical SQL query results (including richly nested query results from an object/relational database) you can achieve the situation where what the user gets back is exactly the XML document you want it to be. The point about a common XML-based query language is right. Folks from many companies are now working in the XML Query Working group to try and nail that syntax for the future... ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Birbeck To: Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 10:14 AM Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] | I think speed is not an issue. As a proportion of the time spent sending | the query, extracting the data and then packaging it up for return, the | time you take to convert the query from one syntax to another is | negligible. | | However, what you lose by using SQL syntax IS an issue. You have data | stored in a relational database which you query in a relational way, but | then return the results as a node set. This seems OK, until you consider | what you have presented to the outside world - a node set which can be | queried using SQL syntax. Now, imagine that someone else stores their | data in an object database, but also returns their results in XML. They | are presenting a node set which can be queried using some object query | syntax. | | So we have two sets of data that to the outside world have similar | structure - they are both a set of hierarchical nodes - but which have | two different ways of being queried. Not good. Add to that, that the | person who did the object database may convert you to his way of | thinking and you then want to ditch your relational database, and | suddenly all those queries that people have set up to access your server | have to change. | | My point is simply that just as you return data from your server in a | common format - XML - so too you should accept requests in a common | format. You should convert requests in, say, XPath, to SQL queries or | object queries or whatever queries. Otherwise you are not really | presenting an XML-interface to your data. | | And we'll never get the Coca-Cola effect (the whole world singing the | same song, if you're wondering). | | Best regards, | | Mark Birbeck | x-port.net Ltd. | | > -----Original Message----- | > From: AlanM [mailto:AlanM@SYNECTICS.Soft.net] | > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 5:11 PM | > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > | > | > Hi guys, | > Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the | > server in SQL or | > XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert | > it into SQL | > again, which may slow down the process. | > | > | > > -----Original Message----- | > > From: Mark Birbeck [SMTP:Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net] | > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:29 PM | > > To: xml dev mailing list | > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > > | > > | > > | > > Hi everyone, | > > | > > Very busy so can't give you in depth on this, but I note | > that you are | > > using VB scripting so here is a bit of code from a VB | > script version of | > > our SOAP server. | > > | > > It's not that complicated, but it provides you with an easy | > way to create | > > a results set from any values. For example, it could build | > a node list | > > from a three element array, with the first element being | > another array | > > that contains record sets, the second being an integer, and | > the third | > > being an XML DOM node (should you want to). | > > | > > Note that it copes with nested recordsets - which is great | > if you are | > > using the Microsoft data shaping facility in ADO. In fact using this | > > routine and data shaping is probably the easiest way to get an XML | > > document with real structure out of a relational database. | > > | > > Two quick things that are slightly off theme: | > > | > > First - if you are returning XML you should really consider | > querying in | > > XML. The client should not really be sending SQL queries | > since you are not | > > returning a SQL result set. You should accept an XML query | > (say, using | > > XPath) and then convert that on the server to an SQL query. | > That way the | > > fact that your data is currently relational will be hidden | > (since it may | > > change). | > > | > > Second - for those interested - note how much better SOAP | > structure is | > > than XML-RPC! I've fallen for it!! | > > | > > Best regards, | > > | > > Mark Birbeck | > > x-port.net Ltd. | > > | > > | > > | > > -----Original Message----- | > > From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] | > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 2:49 PM | > > To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' | > > Cc: xml dev mailing list | > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > > | > > | > > Abhishek, | > > | > > Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to | > > generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I | > have used sun's | > > XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your | > > Document Node. | > > | > > Hope it helps. | > > Sanjeev | > > | > > -----Original Message----- | > > From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] | > > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM | > > To: xml dev mailing list | > > Subject: Is this Immpossible !! | > > | > > | > > | > > Hi All, | > > | > > I have the following requirement. A client | > wants to query a | > > database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. | > At the server | > > side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. | > > | > > The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for | > > "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for | > are there). | > > | > > Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml | > > document. | > > Presently, I am doing something like this | > > | > > String("") + rs.getField("auName") + | > String("") | > > | > > However, this is a very inelegant approach as | > the code is | > > full of such string concatenations. | > > | > > Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All | > the material | > > on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about | > writing them ? Are | > > there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would | > > create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in | > the code ? | > > | > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. | > > | > > Thanks & Best Regards, | > > Abhishek. | > > | > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > > _/ Abhishek Srivastava | > > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO | > > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- | > > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 | > > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 | > > _/ (Url) | > > | > | > > _/ You've heard it all by | > now. Get wired | > > or get whacked. | > > You're networking or you're not | > > working. Dot-com or die | > > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS | > > | > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > > | > > << File: SOAP Return.asp >> | > | > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, | mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on | CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following | message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com Thu Oct 21 21:31:23 1999 From: uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com (uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: ANN: 4XPath 0.7.2 Message-ID: <199910211930.NAA32379@malatesta.local> FourThought LLC (http://FourThought.com) announces the release of 4XPath 0.7.2 ----------------------- A python implementation of the W3C's XPath language 4XPath implements the W3C XPath language for indicating and selecting XML document components. http://www.w3.org/TR/xpath 4XPath implements the full 4XPath specification except for the lang core function. News ---- This version fixes several packaging and implementation bug-fixes. More info and Obtaining 4XPath ----------------------------- Please see http://FourThought.com/4Suite/4XPath Or you can download 4XPath from ftp://FourThought.com/pub/4Suite/4XPath 4XPath is distributed under a license similar to that of Python. -- Uche Ogbuji uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com Consulting Member, FourThought LLC http://FourThought.com http://OpenTechnology.org xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com Thu Oct 21 21:38:58 1999 From: uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com (uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: ANN: 4XSLT 0.7.2 Message-ID: <199910211939.NAA32433@malatesta.local> FourThought LLC (http://FourThought.com) announces the release of 4XSLT 0.7.2 ----------------------- A python implementation of the W3C's XSLT language 4XSLT is an XML transformation processor based on the W3C's specification for the XSLT transform language. http://www.w3.org/TR/xslt Currently, 4XSLT supports a sub-set of the October 8th working draft of XSLT including the following: Full expression support and attribute-value template expansion xsl:include xsl:import xsl:template xsl:apply-imports xsl:apply-templates xsl:copy xsl:call-template xsl:if xsl:for-each xsl:choose xsl:element xsl:when xsl:attribute xsl:otherwise xsl:text xsl:message xsl:value-of xsl:variable xsl:processing-instruction xsl:param xsl:comment xsl:with-param xsl:strip-space xsl:key xsl:preserve-space xsl:copy-of and, of course, literal elements and text 4XSLT produces its result tree by throwing events from the emerging SAX 2 standard to a handler, so it can be easily modified to supply results to any SAX 2 consumer. News ---- Changes in 0.7.2 ---------------- - Implemented named templates - Implemented the following instructions: o comment o copy o call-template o param o with-param - Packaging and implementation bug-fixes More info and Obtaining 4XSLT ----------------------------- Please see http://FourThought.com/4Suite/4XSLT Or you can download 4XSLT from ftp://FourThought.com/pub/4Suite/4XSLT 4XSLT is distributed under a license similar to that of Python. -- Uche Ogbuji uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com Consulting Member, FourThought LLC http://FourThought.com http://OpenTechnology.org xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Thu Oct 21 22:10:16 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: Steve Muench wrote: > *Mark's* point about SQL is totally valid > if what that means is that end-users > would have to type-in SQL statements as > their "user experience". Steve, My point is not about users typing in queries!! What if I write an application on my server that queries your server every day for new product information which is then stored in my database for local retrieval. Everyone has agreed that you should give me that data as XML (well everyone on this list, at least). But if you accept the query in some XML form as well, then you can do whatever you want with your data storage and I don't need to change my code. Your approach is fine for 'local' data - where you are very close to it, and have a lot of control over it. But the future will surely bring increasingly complex aggregations of data, where servers are talking to other servers before returning results sets. For example, how would I phrase a query to my server that returns results from two other databases - one relational, one object - especially if I don't control those other servers? With my approach, my server is like a large XML document and the two other servers are simply nodes within my document - and the lot can be queried with the same syntax. I've tended to use the term 'XML Server' to describe a server that can do this - XML in and XML out. Whether the XML is then stored as XML or in a relational or object store is only relevant to the server owner. To the outside world the are just dealing with a very large XML document. I wouldn't take that as knocking your RDBMS, Steve. I'm simply saying that people should put a layer over your product that hides the fact that it is an RDBMS. To do this they will need to convert the incoming queries to match the structure they have used. > *Your* point about not querying XML is totally > valid since the database is going to do > that querying and sorting much faster over > non-trivial amounts of data than > doing it in an XML document. I'm also saying you do the query in the 'native' format - that's obvious. My point is that you arrive at the native query by converting a more abstract, node query - XPath, XQL or whatever. Regards, Mark xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jvc at rapidlogic.com Thu Oct 21 22:47:02 1999 From: jvc at rapidlogic.com (Joseph Campolongo) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <001001bf1c05$5bf859c0$6f5101aa@rapidlogic.com> unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wchen at tri.sbc.com Thu Oct 21 23:05:10 1999 From: wchen at tri.sbc.com (Chen, Weijing) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) Message-ID: <6C5FB3C08FCBD1118EE600805FEA9CC201FD6FA2@trimail.tri.sbc.com> No. In my idea, one does not store the original XML document as regular flat file in a system. Instead stored as a parsed DOM tree or its like in a OO database or relational database. The query engine will do the search work on the tree based on XML-QL from user. This advantage is that XML is more suitable to describe application domain and data content than SQL. One don't have to twist the model and translate into relational database. Alternative view could be that XML to OO database is SQL to relational database. Weijing Chen > -----Original Message----- > From: Dharmesh [mailto:Dharmesh@digitalmarket.com] > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 6:39 PM > To: Chen, Weijing; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) > > > Chen, > > This is a good thought and will work for small applications. > But the concern here is when you have a huge database. > Currently databases > of the size of GigaBytes are pretty common and if you have a > XML file to > represent it, I am sure it will be atleast 20% more in size. > Now if you run > the XQL query on the file just imagine the preformance. > Another thing to consider is the Join of the tables. The 2 > scenarios are you > have different file for each table or same file. In either > case creating a > result set with a join will surely be a performance bottleneck. > > Good application would be to have an object represented as > XML and passed > across, so that the object can be instantiated along with the > behaviour from > its XML representation. This is like serializing the object > but with its > behaviour. > > Regards, > > Dharmesh Shah > (dharmesh@xm.com) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Chen, Weijing > To: > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 2:50 PM > Subject: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) > > > > Folks, > > > > I am thinking about using XML DTD (or its schema > specification) as a DDL > to > > define schema of a database. Following is the simularity of XML and > > traditional SQL: > > > > DTD database schema > > a huge XML document database table > > XML query language SQL > > small XML document SQL query result > > HTTP ODBC, JDBC > > > > Now logically you are not storing data into traditional SQL > table, but as > a > > large XML document. Physically they could still relational > database, or > > object database. The advantage of this is that XML is > object-oriented. It > is > > much easy and close to real application to model in XML than SQL. > > > > A step farther, one could use XML to model his specific > domain and provide > a > > query engine to handle the query and dispatch it to an > application module. > > In this environment, there is not actually physical database but > application > > process running behind the scene. The user will have all the freedom > > provided by XML query language to manipulate system as he > want. No more > API. > > > > What your thought? Anybody out there build such framework? > > > > > > Weijing Chen > > > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ceo at citix.com Fri Oct 22 00:08:10 1999 From: ceo at citix.com (Steven Livingstone) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:08 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! References: Message-ID: <028e01bf1c11$429cb050$0a0a0a0a@deltabiz> Marks points are what I think. > > *Your* point about not querying XML is totally > > valid since the database is going to do > > that querying and sorting much faster over > > non-trivial amounts of data than > > doing it in an XML document. I think we just have to look at the current search engines to see how ineffective pure SQLcan be. I agree it is faster, but that is where we need to think of querying *both* SQL and XML. It may be a perfomance impact, but this is up to the server to do it as quickly as possible (compare 300 very good searches against the 39439246 altavista results). The client (at least in XMLRPC and SOAP) wants a relevent answers and XML can provide this (rather than having to re-query the response constantly++). This is imperative for (remote) data sources. Indeed, much of my work in XML is working with remote (wire) services where local processing speed is not really an issue (relatively speaking). Cheers, Steven ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Birbeck To: Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 6:48 PM Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! > Steve Muench wrote: > > *Mark's* point about SQL is totally valid > > if what that means is that end-users > > would have to type-in SQL statements as > > their "user experience". > > Steve, > > My point is not about users typing in queries!! > > What if I write an application on my server that queries your server > every day for new product information which is then stored in my > database for local retrieval. Everyone has agreed that you should give > me that data as XML (well everyone on this list, at least). But if you > accept the query in some XML form as well, then you can do whatever you > want with your data storage and I don't need to change my code. > > Your approach is fine for 'local' data - where you are very close to it, > and have a lot of control over it. But the future will surely bring > increasingly complex aggregations of data, where servers are talking to > other servers before returning results sets. For example, how would I > phrase a query to my server that returns results from two other > databases - one relational, one object - especially if I don't control > those other servers? With my approach, my server is like a large XML > document and the two other servers are simply nodes within my document - > and the lot can be queried with the same syntax. > > I've tended to use the term 'XML Server' to describe a server that can > do this - XML in and XML out. Whether the XML is then stored as XML or > in a relational or object store is only relevant to the server owner. To > the outside world the are just dealing with a very large XML document. I > wouldn't take that as knocking your RDBMS, Steve. I'm simply saying that > people should put a layer over your product that hides the fact that it > is an RDBMS. To do this they will need to convert the incoming queries > to match the structure they have used. > > > *Your* point about not querying XML is totally > > valid since the database is going to do > > that querying and sorting much faster over > > non-trivial amounts of data than > > doing it in an XML document. > > I'm also saying you do the query in the 'native' format - that's > obvious. My point is that you arrive at the native query by converting a > more abstract, node query - XPath, XQL or whatever. > > Regards, > > Mark > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 22 00:44:55 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] References: <01c601bf1bf3$eb7d17f0$54561990@us.oracle.com> <19991021215702.38334.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: <027d01bf1c16$81712f40$54561990@us.oracle.com> If you are talking about querying a middle-tier cache of XML documents, this technique might work, but if you are talking about XML-enabling an ebusiness whose systems run on ERP and CRM and custom apps with lots of relational data lying around, none of these customers is intested in mass-converting their terabytes of mission-critical data into brontobytes of persisted DOM documents to search them in a fixed, hiearchical structure through XPath. A company's mission-critical business data represents *lots* of virtual XML documents depending on the particular point of view of the moment. Not a single, fixed document with a single root. Do you want a Bill of Materials for the part ordered on line item 10 of Order #10001 ? Or an XML document representing Order 10001 and all its line items? The ability to pick any important thing in the system and "make it the root" of a virtual XML document" is a powerful concept. ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Prakash Mandgi To: Steve Muench Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 3:03 PM Subject: Re: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] | If you persist a DOM implementation in an object database you should be able | to query | the DOM using XPATH without any hitch. ( if you have implemented XPATH but | of course ) | The advantage of using Object databases is that you persist your object data | as is and | retrieve it on the fly, without any expensive parsing or conversion of the | relational data set | into recreating the DOM document. ( mapping of relational data into the DOM | document | or document fragment or node list etc ) | The proper way to query a DOM document is to use XPATH and only XPATH | and not | OQL or SQL or any other query engine. | | Prakash | | ----- Original Message ----- | From: Steve Muench | To: Mark Birbeck | Cc: | Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 1:41 PM | Subject: Re: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] | | | > Mark, | > | > I'm not advocating returning the SQL query results | > in a SQL-query-results-looking format. | > | > By combining XSLT transformation with canonical | > SQL query results (including richly nested | > query results from an object/relational database) | > you can achieve the situation where what the | > user gets back is exactly the XML document you | > want it to be. | > | > The point about a common XML-based query language | > is right. Folks from many companies are now working | > in the XML Query Working group to try and nail that | > syntax for the future... | > | > ________________________________________________________ | > Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist | > http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java | > http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml | > ----- Original Message ----- | > From: Mark Birbeck | > To: | > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 10:14 AM | > Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] | > | > | > | I think speed is not an issue. As a proportion of the time spent sending | > | the query, extracting the data and then packaging it up for return, the | > | time you take to convert the query from one syntax to another is | > | negligible. | > | | > | However, what you lose by using SQL syntax IS an issue. You have data | > | stored in a relational database which you query in a relational way, but | > | then return the results as a node set. This seems OK, until you consider | > | what you have presented to the outside world - a node set which can be | > | queried using SQL syntax. Now, imagine that someone else stores their | > | data in an object database, but also returns their results in XML. They | > | are presenting a node set which can be queried using some object query | > | syntax. | > | | > | So we have two sets of data that to the outside world have similar | > | structure - they are both a set of hierarchical nodes - but which have | > | two different ways of being queried. Not good. Add to that, that the | > | person who did the object database may convert you to his way of | > | thinking and you then want to ditch your relational database, and | > | suddenly all those queries that people have set up to access your server | > | have to change. | > | | > | My point is simply that just as you return data from your server in a | > | common format - XML - so too you should accept requests in a common | > | format. You should convert requests in, say, XPath, to SQL queries or | > | object queries or whatever queries. Otherwise you are not really | > | presenting an XML-interface to your data. | > | | > | And we'll never get the Coca-Cola effect (the whole world singing the | > | same song, if you're wondering). | > | | > | Best regards, | > | | > | Mark Birbeck | > | x-port.net Ltd. | > | | > | > -----Original Message----- | > | > From: AlanM [mailto:AlanM@SYNECTICS.Soft.net] | > | > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 5:11 PM | > | > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | > | > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > | > | > | > | > | > | > Hi guys, | > | > Since speed is criteria is it faster to send Queries to the | > | > server in SQL or | > | > XML. If sent in XML we will have to parse it and then convert | > | > it into SQL | > | > again, which may slow down the process. | > | > | > | > | > | > > -----Original Message----- | > | > > From: Mark Birbeck [SMTP:Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net] | > | > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:29 PM | > | > > To: xml dev mailing list | > | > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > Hi everyone, | > | > > | > | > > Very busy so can't give you in depth on this, but I note | > | > that you are | > | > > using VB scripting so here is a bit of code from a VB | > | > script version of | > | > > our SOAP server. | > | > > | > | > > It's not that complicated, but it provides you with an easy | > | > way to create | > | > > a results set from any values. For example, it could build | > | > a node list | > | > > from a three element array, with the first element being | > | > another array | > | > > that contains record sets, the second being an integer, and | > | > the third | > | > > being an XML DOM node (should you want to). | > | > > | > | > > Note that it copes with nested recordsets - which is great | > | > if you are | > | > > using the Microsoft data shaping facility in ADO. In fact using this | > | > > routine and data shaping is probably the easiest way to get an XML | > | > > document with real structure out of a relational database. | > | > > | > | > > Two quick things that are slightly off theme: | > | > > | > | > > First - if you are returning XML you should really consider | > | > querying in | > | > > XML. The client should not really be sending SQL queries | > | > since you are not | > | > > returning a SQL result set. You should accept an XML query | > | > (say, using | > | > > XPath) and then convert that on the server to an SQL query. | > | > That way the | > | > > fact that your data is currently relational will be hidden | > | > (since it may | > | > > change). | > | > > | > | > > Second - for those interested - note how much better SOAP | > | > structure is | > | > > than XML-RPC! I've fallen for it!! | > | > > | > | > > Best regards, | > | > > | > | > > Mark Birbeck | > | > > x-port.net Ltd. | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > -----Original Message----- | > | > > From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] | > | > > Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 2:49 PM | > | > > To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' | > | > > Cc: xml dev mailing list | > | > > Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > Abhishek, | > | > > | > | > > Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to | > | > > generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I | > | > have used sun's | > | > > XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your | > | > > Document Node. | > | > > | > | > > Hope it helps. | > | > > Sanjeev | > | > > | > | > > -----Original Message----- | > | > > From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] | > | > > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM | > | > > To: xml dev mailing list | > | > > Subject: Is this Immpossible !! | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > | > | > > Hi All, | > | > > | > | > > I have the following requirement. A client | > | > wants to query a | > | > > database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. | > | > At the server | > | > > side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. | > | > > | > | > > The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for | > | > > "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for | > | > are there). | > | > > | > | > > Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml | > | > > document. | > | > > Presently, I am doing something like this | > | > > | > | > > String("") + rs.getField("auName") + | > | > String("") | > | > > | > | > > However, this is a very inelegant approach as | > | > the code is | > | > > full of such string concatenations. | > | > > | > | > > Is there a more elegant solution to this ? All | > | > the material | > | > > on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about | > | > writing them ? Are | > | > > there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would | > | > > create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in | > | > the code ? | > | > > | > | > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. | > | > > | > | > > Thanks & Best Regards, | > | > > Abhishek. | > | > > | > | > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > | > > _/ Abhishek Srivastava | > | > > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO | > | > > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- | > | > > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 | > | > > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 | > | > > _/ (Url) | > | > > | > | > | > | > > _/ You've heard it all by | > | > now. Get wired | > | > > or get whacked. | > | > > You're networking or you're not | > | > > working. Dot-com or die | > | > > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS | > | > > | > | > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | > | > > | > | > > << File: SOAP Return.asp >> | > | > | > | > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, | > | mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | > | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on | > | CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | > | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | > | unsubscribe xml-dev | > | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following | > | message; | > | subscribe xml-dev-digest | > | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | > | | > | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | > | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on | > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | > | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | > | unsubscribe xml-dev | > | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following | > message; | > | subscribe xml-dev-digest | > | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | > | | > | | > | > | > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on | CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | > unsubscribe xml-dev | > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following | message; | > subscribe xml-dev-digest | > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | > | > | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ceo at citix.com Fri Oct 22 02:04:03 1999 From: ceo at citix.com (Steven Livingstone) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Xml Techniques Message-ID: <005401bf1c21$741169e0$0a0a0a0a@deltabiz> I am interested in how popular XML has become for messaging type features (eg XMLRPC and SOAP etc...) relative to traditional document markup? - I see two distinct, but (possibly) similar markets. Any exciting project undergo? Thanks, Steven -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991022/761adf02/attachment.htm From jeanpa at microsoft.com Fri Oct 22 03:05:43 1999 From: jeanpa at microsoft.com (Jean Paoli) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Help needed in Microsoft for XML & XSL developers Message-ID: <2DCBFADAFCBBD21189D400805F6FA1AB06E6AA21@RED-MSG-12> Hello, Here, in Microsoft, my team is busy building the next round of products implementing innovative work on XML and XSL, specifically in the domain of productivity applications. I would love to hear from smart software designers, developers, and architects who are excited about the possiblities for innovation and the XML grand vision of things. If you are interested in further discussions about my project, please email me, with a resume and a brief explanation of what you would want to work on. I promise a very quick response. Jobs descriptions are posted on the Microsoft site: http://www.microsoft.com/jobs/search/jobDetail.asp?fromPage=viewJobs&jobNumb er=233394&page=2&msid1=-642851600&msid2=-1252569129&msid3=-1902726021&msid4= -427201348 http://www.microsoft.com/jobs/search/jobDetail.asp?fromPage=viewJobs&jobNumb er=233395&page=3&msid1=-642851600&msid2=-1252569129&msid3=-1902726021&msid4= -427201348 Thanks. Jean Paoli Microsoft xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Fri Oct 22 07:53:35 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Oracle SQL - XML Builder [ was : Is this Impossible !!] Message-ID: <010e01bf1c51$95d70a50$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi , I tried the Oracle's SQL - XML utility and it does what i want. Except a few things. I generated the following XML file as a result to a query to my oracle database. Huntington services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond The ROWSET and the ROW tags were introduced by the builder itself. I would like the document to look like : My Own Business Services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond This is very important because this xml file will be sent to the client who will "validate" it. Since ROWSET and ROW are not a part of standard message format we use... an exception will be thrown. Is there any way to customize the output from the builder so that it conforms to a predefined DTD ? Thanks, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991022/87596082/attachment.htm From sb at metis.no Fri Oct 22 08:42:13 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) In-Reply-To: "Chen, Weijing"'s message of "Thu, 21 Oct 1999 16:03:26 -0500" References: <6C5FB3C08FCBD1118EE600805FEA9CC201FD6FA2@trimail.tri.sbc.com> Message-ID: >>>>> "Chen, Weijing" : > No. In my idea, one does not store the original XML document as > regular flat file in a system. Instead stored as a parsed DOM tree > or its like in a OO database or relational database. The query > engine will do the search work on the tree based on XML-QL from > user. Isn't that how Object Design's eXcelon http://www.odi.com/excelon/main.htm is supposed to work? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 22 09:01:32 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Oracle SQL - XML Builder [ was : Is this Impossible !!] References: <010e01bf1c51$95d70a50$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Message-ID: <001401bf1c5b$ddb60b00$54561990@us.oracle.com> Sure, The release notes cover the options you can provide in your tag to control the raw database XML formatting of the query results, but the arbitrary reshaping power to really get the data to morph into any DTD shape comes by combining the XML "datapage" produced by your SQL query with an XSLT transformation that gets the data exactly how you want it. http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml/xsql_servlet/htdocs/relnotes.htm http://technet.oracle.com/docs/tech/xml/oracle_xsu/doc_library/relnotes.html My example will use the XSQL Servlet since it's easier to explain that way, but you can do this in your own code too if the XSQL Servlet is not what you want. Let's say your Customer.xsql page looks like: SELECT spname, custpermid, custloginid, firstname, lastname FROM your_customer_table WHERE custpermid = {@custid} Then by default the request for the URL: http://yourbox.com/Customer.xsql?custid=123456789123456 will produce exactly the result you had in your mail. If however you have a DTD you need to refer to like: http://xmlville.com/customer.dtd You can create the following XSL Stylesheet:

And then alter your Customer.xsql page to have one extra instruction at the top like: SELECT spname, custpermid, custloginid, firstname, lastname FROM your_customer_table WHERE custpermid = {@custid} And then when you request the same URL now, you'll receive: James Bond jamesb If you're not using XSQL Pages to do this, then you can use the same stylesheet along with the getXMLDOM() method of the OracleXMLQuery class you are using to do: OracleXMLQuery q = new OracleXMLQuery( conn, yourResultSet); // or OracleXMLQuery( conn, yourQueryString ); Document d = yourQuery.getXMLDOM(); XSLStylesheet xsl = new XSLStylesheet("ToCustomerDTD.xsl", null); XSLProcessor prc = new XSLProcessor(); prc.process(d,xsl, new PrintWriter(System.out)); // or DocumentFragment result = prc.process(d,xsl); You can use the companion OracleXMLSave class to *insert* XML into your tables, views, object tables, and object views of arbitrary structure, too. Hope this sample helps... ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Abhishek Srivastava To: xml dev mailing list Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 10:52 PM Subject: Oracle SQL - XML Builder [ was : Is this Impossible !!] Hi , I tried the Oracle's SQL - XML utility and it does what i want. Except a few things. I generated the following XML file as a result to a query to my oracle database. Huntington services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond The ROWSET and the ROW tags were introduced by the builder itself. I would like the document to look like : My Own Business Services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond This is very important because this xml file will be sent to the client who will "validate" it. Since ROWSET and ROW are not a part of standard message format we use... an exception will be thrown. Is there any way to customize the output from the builder so that it conforms to a predefined DTD ? Thanks, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Fri Oct 22 09:03:24 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] Message-ID: schen@falconwing.com wrote: > As it is now, it won't work until the XML Query Working Group > publishes a > spec. > > Until then, SQL is a semi-standard, pragmatic choice if you > need to deploy > now. I don't think you need to wait - there's plenty of stuff around that gives indications of how this is going to pan out. The obvious commitment to XPath is worth starting with - and to parse that into SQL queries is not that difficult. At least then you're on the right road, and starting to address some of the issues. More sophisticated approaches are the WebDAV 'property find' type angle, which is more difficult to implement but is very powerful once done. Mark xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Fri Oct 22 10:22:50 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:09 2004 Subject: C++ SAX Parser objects and a push InputSource Message-ID: Looking at two existing C++ SAX implementations, based on the Java interface, http://www.jezuk.demon.co.uk/SAX/ http://www.cgocable.net/~mlepage/minion/doc/ I note that Parser gets its input from InputSource or SystemId. It looks to me that Parser and InputSource are meant for the Parser to request data from. This is a little wrong from a network point of view, where you'd like to parse data as they arrive. Is there support within SAX (the Java one) for a request/response model, similar to the one used by libwww, where a file is requested, and the data is pushed onto a "stream" object as they arrive? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Fri Oct 22 10:39:47 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: C++ SAX Parser objects and a push InputSource In-Reply-To: Steinar Bang's message of "22 Oct 1999 10:22:17 +0200" References: Message-ID: >>>>> Steinar Bang : > Looking at two existing C++ SAX implementations, based on the Java > interface, > http://www.jezuk.demon.co.uk/SAX/ > http://www.cgocable.net/~mlepage/minion/doc/ > I note that Parser gets its input from InputSource or SystemId. > It looks to me that Parser and InputSource are meant for the Parser to > request data from. This is a little wrong from a network point of > view, where you'd like to parse data as they arrive. > Is there support within SAX (the Java one) for a request/response > model, similar to the one used by libwww, where a file is requested, > and the data is pushed onto a "stream" object as they arrive? The best abstraction would maybe be to make the SAX Parser class inherit from ostream? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Fri Oct 22 11:05:56 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: C++ SAX Parser objects and a push InputSource In-Reply-To: Steinar Bang's message of "22 Oct 1999 10:39:36 +0200" References: Message-ID: >>>>> Steinar Bang : >> Is there support within SAX (the Java one) for a request/response >> model, similar to the one used by libwww, where a file is requested, >> and the data is pushed onto a "stream" object as they arrive? Ah! Requesting an HTTP URI, and getting the result back as a stream you can read from, is built-in functionality in Java it looks like. Presumably you would delegate a thread to listen to the connection, and wake the thread every time it has data...? Since no such standard functionality exists in C++, I still think the best option is to have Parser derive from ostream, that an request/response mechanism can use. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sb at metis.no Fri Oct 22 12:48:52 1999 From: sb at metis.no (Steinar Bang) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: The SAX interface of the xml4c2 parser Message-ID: I've taken a look at the SAX interface of the IBM xml4c2 parser http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/xml4c In short, I don't like it. I don't like returning "const XMLCh*" instead of "const wstring&" or "const string&" (even though an approach like this would be more efficient for an expat wrapper). I don't need the index out of range warning capability, because I iterate through the AttributeList entries anyway. I don't like giving an AttributeList& argument to DocumentHandler::startElement(), instead of an AttributeList*, because this rules out the possibility of passing a null-pointer on for the cases that don't have an attribute list. Hm... so far there is AFAIK 4 incompatible C++ SAX implementations around. The IBM one, and: http://www.jezuk.demon.co.uk/SAX/ http://www.cgocable.net/~mlepage/minion/doc/ http://www.vivid-creations.com/free/sax.h I also have an expat-wrapper-based C++ SAX implementation, similar to Jez Higgins' one (I use a "sax_" prefix instead of namespaces, since it has to run on compilers without namespace support). No time to create a web page for it yet. My reasons for going SAX, was: 1. it seemed silly to invent my own abstraction when lots of work had already gone into the SAX design 2. make it possible to drop-in replace the parser But #2 can only be achieved if the different SAX implementations have the same API, and this is not currently the case. I'll go whatever way the majority goes, unless it leads towards the IBM implementation. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Fri Oct 22 13:15:47 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: The SAX interface of the xml4c2 parser References: Message-ID: <00c101bf1c7e$baf09810$4a5eedc1@arp01> > http://www.vivid-creations.com/free/sax.h The page for the C++ variant is : http://www.vivid-creations.com/xtl.htm The COM variant for Delphi, VB and most other langauges is : http://www.vivid-creations.com/sax/index/htm It is currently being revamped with new features (mainly for the DOM) so any requests for changes should be sent to : requests@vivid-creations.com The SAX interface has been expanded with a cdata() method to enables DOMs to be built with CDATA sections, and if there is any real benefit SAX2 will be supported. ----- Original Message ----- From: Steinar Bang To: Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 11:48 AM Subject: The SAX interface of the xml4c2 parser > I've taken a look at the SAX interface of the IBM xml4c2 parser > http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/xml4c > > In short, I don't like it. > > I don't like returning "const XMLCh*" instead of "const wstring&" or > "const string&" (even though an approach like this would be more > efficient for an expat wrapper). I don't need the index out of range > warning capability, because I iterate through the AttributeList > entries anyway. > > I don't like giving an AttributeList& argument to > DocumentHandler::startElement(), instead of an AttributeList*, because > this rules out the possibility of passing a null-pointer on for the > cases that don't have an attribute list. > > Hm... so far there is AFAIK 4 incompatible C++ SAX implementations > around. The IBM one, and: > http://www.jezuk.demon.co.uk/SAX/ > http://www.cgocable.net/~mlepage/minion/doc/ > http://www.vivid-creations.com/free/sax.h > > I also have an expat-wrapper-based C++ SAX implementation, similar to > Jez Higgins' one (I use a "sax_" prefix instead of namespaces, since > it has to run on compilers without namespace support). No time to > create a web page for it yet. > > My reasons for going SAX, was: > 1. it seemed silly to invent my own abstraction when lots of work had > already gone into the SAX design > 2. make it possible to drop-in replace the parser > > But #2 can only be achieved if the different SAX implementations have > the same API, and this is not currently the case. > > I'll go whatever way the majority goes, unless it leads towards the > IBM implementation. > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tpassin at idsonline.com Fri Oct 22 14:02:18 1999 From: tpassin at idsonline.com (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: Oracle SQL - XML Builder [ was : Is this Impossible !!] References: <010e01bf1c51$95d70a50$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Message-ID: <001101bf1c85$b01ecd60$3715b0cf@tomshp> Here's two ways: 1) Transform the Oracle output using and xslt stylesheet and one of the xslt processors like XT. 2) Write a script for a text- processing program like awk, perl, or python to change the tag names to the ones you want and delete the ones you don't. This approach would be fast and easy. Thomas Passin From: Abhishek Srivastava I tried the Oracle's SQL - XML utility and it does what i want. Except a few things. I generated the following XML file as a result to a query to my oracle database. Huntington services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond The ROWSET and the ROW tags were introduced by the builder itself. I would like the document to look like : My Own Business Services Company 123456789123456 jamesb james Bond This is very important because this xml file will be sent to the client who will "validate" it. Since ROWSET and ROW are not a part of standard message format we use... an exception will be thrown. Is there any way to customize the output from the builder so that it conforms to a predefined DTD ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991022/7deed0c3/attachment.htm From martin.kuhn at valuerisk.com Fri Oct 22 14:49:55 1999 From: martin.kuhn at valuerisk.com (Martin Kuhn) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: dtd documentation Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19991022143746.006ed1c0@mail.omnilink.net> Hello, I am interested in a tool to document dtd-files. It should have the same functionality as javadoc for java-files or doc++ for c++. Where can I get such a tool ? Thanks, Martin Kuhn Value and Risk AG, Bad Homburg, Germany xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sdemuth at artemisalliance.com Fri Oct 22 15:34:30 1999 From: sdemuth at artemisalliance.com (Steve Demuth) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: Oracle SQL - XML Builder [ was : Is this Impossible !!] Message-ID: <4.1.19991022084026.00d37270@smtp.salamander.com> At 08:05 AM 10/22/99 -0400, you wrote: > > Here's two ways: > > 1) Transform the Oracle output using and xslt stylesheet and one of the xslt > processors like XT. I believe the Oracle package already includes this capability internally, as well as atributes on the input markup for defining one's own rowset and row wrapper tags. > > 2) Write a script for a text- processing program like awk, perl, or python to > change the tag names to the ones you want and delete the ones you don't. > This approach would be fast and easy. > > Thomas Passin > Steve Demuth Director of Technology Research Artemis Alliance, Inc. An Inprise Premier Partner 2750 Lannon Hill Road Decorah, Iowa 52101 651-227-7172 (Typically Mon-Tue) or 319-382-0593 (Wed-Fri) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 16:51:41 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) Message-ID: Check out http://www.poet.com -----Original Message----- From: Steinar Bang [mailto:sb@metis.no] Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 2:42 AM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: XML DTD (schema) as database schema (DDL) >>>>> "Chen, Weijing" : > No. In my idea, one does not store the original XML document as > regular flat file in a system. Instead stored as a parsed DOM tree > or its like in a OO database or relational database. The query > engine will do the search work on the tree based on XML-QL from > user. Isn't that how Object Design's eXcelon http://www.odi.com/excelon/main.htm is supposed to work? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Fri Oct 22 17:43:01 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: dtd documentation Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F8B@MDYNYCMSX1> >I am interested in a tool to document dtd-files. >It should have the same functionality as javadoc for java-files or >doc++ for c++. Where can I get such a tool ? It's currently a bit ironic that XML doesn't offer built-in markup for description of its structures the way Java does (the "@" fielded values that javadoc looks for) since markup to automate documentation generation is part of the point of XML and especially its parent SGML. The W3C Schema Working Group has formally stated that fixing this is one of their goals, although they hadn't addressed it yet in the September Schema Working Draft (see http://www.w3.org/TR/xmlschema-1/#doc). That being said, check out the dtd2html script that is part of Earl Hood's perlSGML utilities at http://www.oac.uci.edu/indiv/ehood/perlSGML.html. It generates a series of HTML files to document the relationships within a DTD, and in my quick tests it works fine for XML as well as SGML. It also has its own notation for adding DTD comments that will show up in the generated documentation. (perlSGML also offers a very handy dtddiff program. I used it to generate the xml-dev posting showing the differences between the May and September drafts of Part 1 of the Schema Working Draft. See http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Sep-1999/1241.html for some sample dtddiff output.) Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jrgardn at emory.edu Fri Oct 22 18:08:53 1999 From: jrgardn at emory.edu (John Robert Gardner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:10 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greetings: One of the goals of our project--so kindly written up by Robin at http://www.oasis-open.org/cover/atlas.html--is to allow the searching of our records (which will be linked to XML instances of the articles in gif, then later in keyed/tagged text) from a variety of existing search interfaces, as transparently as possible. In other words, someone using DC can search for articles where Creator is Tillich, while someone using GILS can search for Originator as Tillich, and so on. This grand vision hinges on a what's proving a rather thorny wicket: do we have to have complete instances of each kind of tagged 600mb record set for each chosen DTD? I.E., a DC set, a GILS set, etc.? While my new-found joy with xslt makes _creating_ them kind of fun, the logistics of duplication seems the long way 'round something which sounds sort of like a namespaces kind of issue. I ask this b/c some pretty knowledgeable folk thought multiple namespaces would be a solution, but it seems that can't be done--except through architectural forms which we don't want to use--(cf. http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Feb-1999/0153.html from Megginson): It's a well-proven technique for working with architectural forms in SGML (except that architectural forms allow 0-n while namespaces allow exactly 1). I read this, as does those with whom I've spoken, as a sort of truncation of the idea of multiple namesapces--at least for XML sans architectural forms. What would be swell is if we couldhave a tag for the example above which is like: Tillich I know that's a behemoth of a tag, but at least it's ONE tag in ONE instance, and my math indicates it's still less space than 3 document instances of the records to accomplish the same thing otherwise. Considering that this first phase with MARC records in these various formats of XML will be stored in and delivered via Oracle 8i, can anyone recommend something which will address this issue (preferably a non-proprietary solution, as our grant requires our output to be standards-based/archivable, _not_ proprietary)? I've scanned the xml-dev archives and have not found any other alternatives--though they could be there only buried in a non-namespaces-subject-line reply. thanks, jr =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-= John Robert Gardner XML Engineer ATLA-CERTR ------------------------------------------------------------ http://vedavid.org/ http://www.purl.org/CERTR/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 18:03:26 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Is this Impossible !! Message-ID: But also see the messages about Oracle's building of XML from the data set returned from an SQL query... ? From: Abhishek Srivastava ? I tried the Oracle's SQL - XML utility and it does what i want.??Except a few things. ? I generated the following XML file as a result to a query to my oracle database. ? ? ? Huntington services Company???????????? ? 123456789123456???? ? jamesb????????????? ? james? ? Bond? ? ? ? The ROWSET?and the ROW tags were introduced by the builder itself. I would like the document to look like : ? My Own Business? Services Company? ? 123456789123456???? ? jamesb????????????? ? james?????????????? ? Bond??????????????? ? This is very important because this xml file will be sent to the client who will "validate" it. Since ROWSET and ROW are not a part of standard message format we use... an exception will be thrown. Is there any way to customize the output from the builder so that it conforms to a predefined DTD ? -----Original Message----- From: Goyal, Sanjeev [mailto:Sanjeev.Goyal@usa.xerox.com] Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 9:49 AM To: 'Abhishek Srivastava' Cc: xml dev mailing list Subject: RE: Is this Impossible !! Abhishek, ? Most of the XML Parser implementations provides mechanism to generate well formed XML documents from the DOM Tree. I have used sun's XML parser, it provides APIs to generate well-formed XML from your Document Node. ? Hope it helps. Sanjeev ? ?-----Original Message----- From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 1:29 AM To: xml dev mailing list Subject: Is this Immpossible !! Hi All, ? I have the following requirement. A client wants to query a database. It sends out an SQL Query to the Database server. At the server side, instead of returning a recordset, it returns an XML File. ? The client on receiving the XML file, parsers it for "Validity" (to be sure that all elements it had asked for are there). ? Problem is that at the server side, How to build the xml document. Presently, I am doing something like this ? String("") + rs.getField("auName") + String("") ? However, this is a very inelegant approach as the code is full of such string concatenations. ? Is there a more elegant solution to this ?? All the material on XML talks about parsing and reading XML. What about writing them ? Are there DOM / SAX Api extensions available that would create "VALID" XML documents without clutter in the code ? ? Any help would be greatly appreciated. ? Thanks & Best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ??? _/?????????????? Abhishek Srivastava ?? _/??????????????? Hewlett Packard ISO?????? ? _/_/_/?? _/_/_/??? -------------------?? ?_/?? /?? _/? _/???? (Work)?? +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/? _/?? _/_/_/????? (Ip)???? 15.10.47.37??????????? ??????? _/?????????? (Url)??? http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage ??????????????????????? ?????? _/??????????? You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. ???????????????????? You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die ???????????????????? - SUN MICROSYSTEMS? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991022/6d47be6a/attachment.htm From Srinivas.Nittala at pdb1.sbs.de Fri Oct 22 18:20:51 1999 From: Srinivas.Nittala at pdb1.sbs.de (Srinivas.Nittala@pdb1.sbs.de) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Expat for SUN SOLARIS Message-ID: Hello All, I have no idea whether Expat work on Sun M/c or not. I have written programs to parse my XML usin expat on NT. It works one. I want to move the same code to a SUN m/c. Are there any Library files specific to SUN? If not do I have to recompile all the C Sources on SUN m/c? I have tried recompiling. But I get lots of errors in the xmltok.h Header File. Can someone please help me. I am really stuck. regards, Sri xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 18:54:51 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) Message-ID: Use attributes. Pick a master dtd element nomenclature ... DC, say ... or use your own and then Tillich Vane -----Original Message----- From: John Robert Gardner [mailto:jrgardn@emory.edu] Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 12:08 PM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Cc: John Robert Gardner Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) Greetings: One of the goals of our project--so kindly written up by Robin at http://www.oasis-open.org/cover/atlas.html--is to allow the searching of our records (which will be linked to XML instances of the articles in gif, then later in keyed/tagged text) from a variety of existing search interfaces, as transparently as possible. In other words, someone using DC can search for articles where Creator is Tillich, while someone using GILS can search for Originator as Tillich, and so on. This grand vision hinges on a what's proving a rather thorny wicket: do we have to have complete instances of each kind of tagged 600mb record set for each chosen DTD? I.E., a DC set, a GILS set, etc.? While my new-found joy with xslt makes _creating_ them kind of fun, the logistics of duplication seems the long way 'round something which sounds sort of like a namespaces kind of issue. I ask this b/c some pretty knowledgeable folk thought multiple namespaces would be a solution, but it seems that can't be done--except through architectural forms which we don't want to use--(cf. http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Feb-1999/0153.html from Megginson): It's a well-proven technique for working with architectural forms in SGML (except that architectural forms allow 0-n while namespaces allow exactly 1). I read this, as does those with whom I've spoken, as a sort of truncation of the idea of multiple namesapces--at least for XML sans architectural forms. What would be swell is if we couldhave a tag for the example above which is like: Tillich I know that's a behemoth of a tag, but at least it's ONE tag in ONE instance, and my math indicates it's still less space than 3 document instances of the records to accomplish the same thing otherwise. Considering that this first phase with MARC records in these various formats of XML will be stored in and delivered via Oracle 8i, can anyone recommend something which will address this issue (preferably a non-proprietary solution, as our grant requires our output to be standards-based/archivable, _not_ proprietary)? I've scanned the xml-dev archives and have not found any other alternatives--though they could be there only buried in a non-namespaces-subject-line reply. thanks, jr =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-= John Robert Gardner XML Engineer ATLA-CERTR ------------------------------------------------------------ http://vedavid.org/ http://www.purl.org/CERTR/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 18:57:26 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Expat for SUN SOLARIS Message-ID: use perl everywhere. Vane -----Original Message----- From: Srinivas.Nittala@pdb1.sbs.de [mailto:Srinivas.Nittala@pdb1.sbs.de] Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 1:24 PM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Expat for SUN SOLARIS Hello All, I have no idea whether Expat work on Sun M/c or not. I have written programs to parse my XML usin expat on NT. It works one. I want to move the same code to a SUN m/c. Are there any Library files specific to SUN? If not do I have to recompile all the C Sources on SUN m/c? I have tried recompiling. But I get lots of errors in the xmltok.h Header File. Can someone please help me. I am really stuck. regards, Sri xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jrgardn at emory.edu Fri Oct 22 19:27:12 1999 From: jrgardn at emory.edu (John Robert Gardner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 1999, Vane Lashua wrote: > Use attributes. > Pick a master dtd element nomenclature ... DC, say ... or use your own and > then > > TEI="docAuthor">Tillich > Thanks, but to clarify in case it wasn't clear in my first post, the search needs to be transparent. Under your solution, how is a DC engine to recognize "ONEWHOCREATES"? We could of course use attributes, but then everyone would have to readjust. The key point here is _transparent_ --otherwise we're just proliferating _yet another_ DTD, NOT transparently interfacing with well-established archival standards. jr xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 20:02:49 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: dtd documentation Message-ID: 1. The Earl Hood program is very consistent and widely used. You do maintain an external file for comments. 2. In XML the ability to embed comments (with -- ... -- in dtd declarations ) was not included (as in SGML) but you can devised enterprise-standard ways of embedding the documentation by using a. plain old comments ( ) between declarations b. or CDATA sections c. or processing instructions d. or an entity set e. or a small set of documentation elements defined at the head of the dtd and used in the remainder. None of which is standards-based. Vane -----Original Message----- From: DuCharme, Robert [mailto:DuCharmR@moodys.com] Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 11:44 AM To: 'Martin Kuhn'; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: RE: dtd documentation >I am interested in a tool to document dtd-files. >It should have the same functionality as javadoc for java-files or >doc++ for c++. Where can I get such a tool ? It's currently a bit ironic that XML doesn't offer built-in markup for description of its structures the way Java does (the "@" fielded values that javadoc looks for) since markup to automate documentation generation is part of the point of XML and especially its parent SGML. The W3C Schema Working Group has formally stated that fixing this is one of their goals, although they hadn't addressed it yet in the September Schema Working Draft (see http://www.w3.org/TR/xmlschema-1/#doc). That being said, check out the dtd2html script that is part of Earl Hood's perlSGML utilities at http://www.oac.uci.edu/indiv/ehood/perlSGML.html. It generates a series of HTML files to document the relationships within a DTD, and in my quick tests it works fine for XML as well as SGML. It also has its own notation for adding DTD comments that will show up in the generated documentation. (perlSGML also offers a very handy dtddiff program. I used it to generate the xml-dev posting showing the differences between the May and September drafts of Part 1 of the Schema Working Draft. See http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/xml-dev-Sep-1999/1241.html for some sample dtddiff output.) Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vlashua at RSGsystems.com Fri Oct 22 20:08:57 1999 From: vlashua at RSGsystems.com (Vane Lashua) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) Message-ID: Aren't you doing the same thing with the namespace tag idea (except that it won't work with an XML parser)? It seems like you _create_ the need for new tagging. If these data tags were all derived from MARC(?) and they strictly point to the same MARC "elements" (ha ha ha ....!), then one dtd will fit the bill with a common definition, If you're going to keep the source tags, then you could use multiple copies of the data, but use "dynamically generated" entities from a master dataset. In each copy, use entity references (with unique ids) to point to entity definitions in the same way. There are probably definitions in one database/dtd that do not occur in others. More than likely you will have to create an esperanto dtd and more than likely if you have to process the data at all, you may as well process the tags. Vane -----Original Message----- From: John Robert Gardner [mailto:jrgardn@emory.edu] Sent: Friday, October 22, 1999 1:27 PM To: Vane Lashua Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: RE: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) On Fri, 22 Oct 1999, Vane Lashua wrote: > Use attributes. > Pick a master dtd element nomenclature ... DC, say ... or use your own and > then > > TEI="docAuthor">Tillich > Thanks, but to clarify in case it wasn't clear in my first post, the search needs to be transparent. Under your solution, how is a DC engine to recognize "ONEWHOCREATES"? We could of course use attributes, but then everyone would have to readjust. The key point here is _transparent_ --otherwise we're just proliferating _yet another_ DTD, NOT transparently interfacing with well-established archival standards. jr xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com Fri Oct 22 20:16:05 1999 From: ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com (Yogita Patil) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: page size Message-ID: <014001bf1cb9$7acdfa30$1a02060a@andyne.com> Is it possible to represent page size in pixels in CSS2? Thanks. Yogita Patil Software Developer Hummingbird Comm. Ltd. Kingston. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991022/d63b5e8a/attachment.htm From j.kenneth.gentle at acm.org Fri Oct 22 20:25:36 1999 From: j.kenneth.gentle at acm.org (Ken Gentle) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Versioning DTDs? Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991022142736.00967cd0@inet.net> Hi ya'll! In developing an e-commerce dialog (using XML, of course), we've determined that the messages need to be versioned. Specifically, we'll need to have some way of versioning a DTD such that the XML parser can "figure out" which version of the DTD to use. As the XCatalog stuff (for PUBLIC entities) is not widely supported yet (based on my rather naive perspective), simply mapping the PUBLIC ids to different DTDs won't work. Additionally, there is the "change-over period": what if I have messages/documents to process in my "queue" when the publicly available DTD changes? If the structure of the two versions of the DTD are incompatible, I've introduced a problem... Any ideas? References? Pointers? Am I missing something fundamental by even considering versioning DTDs? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mrossi at crusher.jcals.csc.com Fri Oct 22 20:55:33 1999 From: mrossi at crusher.jcals.csc.com (Michael Rossi) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Developer's Books Message-ID: <472EF0A38796D21185810000F807DD1E5E4773@crusher.jcals.csc.com> Hi All, I'm trying to recommend some reading material for a colleague who's relatively new to XML and will need to devlop some XML-based applications soon. I know there are several people on this list who've written some books to that end and I'd like some pointers to material focused on this subject. We're currently looking at Simon's "Building XML Applications" and "Applied XML" from Alex Ceponkus and Faraz Hoodbhoy. These seem to be on target and up-to-date. Let me know what you think. Thanks. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From niko at cmsplatform.com Fri Oct 22 22:47:52 1999 From: niko at cmsplatform.com (Nik O) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Help needed in Microsoft for XML & XSL developers Message-ID: <013001bf1cce$ac52a000$1a5e360a@tetondata.com> Jean Paoli wrote: ======= begin ======= Jobs descriptions are posted on the Microsoft site: http://www.microsoft.com/jobs/search/jobDetail.asp?fromPage=viewJobs&jobNumb er=233394&page=2&msid1=-642851600&msid2=-1252569129&msid3=-1902726021&msid4= -427201348 http://www.microsoft.com/jobs/search/jobDetail.asp?fromPage=viewJobs&jobNumb er=233395&page=3&msid1=-642851600&msid2=-1252569129&msid3=-1902726021&msid4= -427201348 ======= end ======= Of course the e-mail software chopped the URL into pieces, but when i put them back together i got bounced to another page that displayed the first 10 "GROUP ASSISTANT" ("clerk/secretary"?) job openings, out of a total of "..1961 jobs matching all of your criteria."!! I wouldn't even have bothered looking at this, but for the author of the original posting... Still, given that i reading these e-mails in Outlook Express, and use IE5 as my web browser (for its XML support, of course), you'd think i'd be able to get to those good software secretary job listings with just a single click, eh? Regards and apologies, Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Fri Oct 22 23:27:04 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Developer's Books Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F97@MDYNYCMSX1> A good place to start is www.xmlbooks.com. Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From liamquin at interlog.com Sat Oct 23 03:40:32 1999 From: liamquin at interlog.com (Liam R. E. Quin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:11 2004 Subject: Developer's Books In-Reply-To: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F97@MDYNYCMSX1> Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 1999, DuCharme, Robert wrote: > A good place to start is www.xmlbooks.com. It seems,. however, more than a little partisan, no? > Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob snee.com> see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: > The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. Lee, co-author, The XML Specification :-) -- Liam Quin, Barefoot Computing, Toronto; The barefoot agitator l i a m q u i n at i n t e r l o g dot c o m Ankh on irc.sorcery.net xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ricko at allette.com.au Sat Oct 23 14:04:35 1999 From: ricko at allette.com.au (Rick Jelliffe) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: Schematron error browser now available Message-ID: <00e301bf1d52$211066b0$47f96d8c@NT.JELLIFFE.COM.AU> The Schematron is a Open Source tree-pattern language for representing schemas for XML documents. It is a radically different approach from grammar-based schemas. It is based on XPath, and can be *trivially* implemented over an XSL system. I think it has the potential to largely supercede grammar-based schema languages such as DTDs, etc. for XML validation. David Carlisle has produced an implementation with an error browser: Schematron Report. You can see an example at http://www.ascc.net/xml/resource/schematron/DavidCarlisle/schematron-fra me.html The top frame are the error messages produced by the Schematron itself. Click on the error messages and source code in the lower frame goes to the apporpriate place in the source document. This example uses a partial schema for the WAI guidelines. You can see the schema at http://www.ascc.net/xml/resource/schematron/wai.xml The Schematron home page is http://www.ascc.net/xml/resource/schematron/schematron.html Rick Jelliffe Computing Centre Academia Sinica xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken_north at compuserve.com Sun Oct 24 00:22:55 1999 From: ken_north at compuserve.com (Ken North) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: XML expert panel (Santa Clara, Nov. 11, FREE) Message-ID: <011501bf1da5$4fd79100$0b00a8c0@grissom> "XML's Role in Enterprise Computing and E-Commerce" At XML One (Santa Clara, Nov. 11), the closing keynote panel will discuss XML as an enabling technology for e-commerce and enterprise applications. The panel includes experts from W3C XML working groups, OASIS, the XML/EDI Group, IBM, Sun, Oracle, Microsoft, Bluestone, and eProcess Solutions. Admission to the panel session is free. The panel will discuss business to business (B2B) integration, Web commerce, BizTalk, XML/EDI, XML servers, and XML-enabled databases. Panelists will also discuss Enterprise Java and messaging middleware. Panel members include: Bob Bickel Vice-President, Development Bluestone Software David Fallside Member, W3C XML-Schema Working Group XML Technology and Strategy team IBM Steve Muench XML Evangelist Architect, BC4J Oracle Corporation Bruce Peat Co-founder, XML/EDI Group President, eProcess Solutions Dan Rogers BizTalk Architect Microsoft Bill Smith OASIS President Co-chair, W3C XML Linking XML Architect, Sun Microsystems The moderator is Ken North, database columnist for Web Techniques and author of Database Magic with Ken North (Prentice Hall). When: November 11, 1999 4:15 - 5: 30 p.m. Where: XML One (November 8-11, 1999) Venue: Westin Santa Clara hotel Santa Clara, California USA Registration for the conference exhibits is FREE and admits you to the expert panel presentation. For more information: http://www.xmlconference.com/xmlusa/ http://www.xmlconference.com/xmlusa/registration/index.shtml xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Sun Oct 24 18:28:52 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations References: Message-ID: <002b01bf1e3c$8cfe99b0$c5010180@p197> Hi, Come and join "DEV-XML" a general purpose XML developers mailing list hosted on one list. Unlike other mailing lists this is specially designed for programmers. The main focus is for developers using _WINDOWS_ based XML tools such as Microsofts MSXML. The list is language neutral so everybody is welcome. Experts in MSXML C++/VB will be on the list. To join send an email to: http://www.onelist.com/community/dev-xml Or you can just go to this URL: http://www.onelist.com/community/dev-xml The supporting web site should be up and ready sometime next month. Thanks. Richard. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tbray at textuality.com Sun Oct 24 20:14:57 1999 From: tbray at textuality.com (Tim Bray) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991024111302.00c9fd80@pop.intergate.bc.ca> At 05:26 PM 10/24/99 +0100, Richard Anderson wrote: >Come and join "DEV-XML" a general purpose XML developers mailing list hosted >on one list. ... and whose organizers don't know how to use subject lines ... xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk Sun Oct 24 20:38:57 1999 From: rja at arpsolutions.demon.co.uk (Richard Anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: ANN:XML Mailing List was - Re: URNs in SYSTEM declarations References: <3.0.32.19991024111302.00c9fd80@pop.intergate.bc.ca> Message-ID: <013101bf1e4e$680bf640$c5010180@p197> > ... and whose organizers don't know how to use subject lines ... And whose organizers are developers who do make mistakes, but are down to earth, very easy going and helpful rather than unhelpful ... So, if you want to join a Windows based XML list that is related to developer issues, you may or may not like to join us if you can live with the occasional mizzstakeee: To join send an email to: dev-xml-subscribe@onelist.com Or you can just go to this URL: http://www.onelist.com/community/dev-xml Thanks Richard. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at qub.com Mon Oct 25 00:13:39 1999 From: paul at qub.com (Paul Tchistopolskii) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: Fw: [xml-server] Re: Tools. JPython. SAXON Message-ID: <00a401bf1e6d$4909a2a0$5df5c13f@PaulTchistopolskii> To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, October 24, 1999 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [xml-server] Re: Tools. JPython. SAXON > > > My personal interest is to implement the > > > prototype. > > > > Fine. > > > > > I think I'l use JPython ( the letter in archive > > > with the Subj: 'JPython' explains why ). > > > > > > Now I started searching for existing XSLT > > > implementation which could work on top of DOM, > > > but not a text file. > > > > > > The XML-server prototype colud read plain XML > > > files into in-memory DOM and then invoke > > > 'strored XSLT tranformantions'. > > > > > > JPython means that I am actualy looking > > > for Java stuff. > > > > > > I think - SAXON is a good choice, it is > > > XSLT on DOM ( and also much more ;-) > > > > > > http://users.iclway.co.uk/mhkay/saxon/index.html > > > > > > If you know some other Java libs of this kind, > > > please let me know. > > > > > > > What about XSL:P (http://www.clc-marketing.com/xslp/) ? > > XSL:P is widely used by Cocoon users, and its author, Keith is porting > > it to C++ to be used by next Netscape's navigator release ? > > Thank you for this one. It looks promizing. > > Like SAXON., it supports multiple DOM implementations > ( at the moment I think that plugging the new DOM into > SAXON may be a bit easier. I need to check ) > > Ability to plug diferent components is one of the > requirments. I like SAX because it allows me > to change the parsers when I find that some parser > is weaker than I need. > > Is there any effort to get a "SAX for DOM" ? I mean > that it appears that at the moment SAXON and and XSL:P > are using different ways for plugin the DOM components, > or maybe I'm wrong? > > > XT (http://www.jclark.com/xml/xt.html) is fast and in sync with the > > latest recommendations, but isn't implementing a standard DOM. > > Yes. I don't think I could use it, even I realy like XT ;-)... > It appears that we need XSLT on top of DOM, but not the > XSLT on file *and* it would be nice to have a DOM as a separate > pluggable compoment, because nodoby knows what DOM vendor > will be better ;-) ... I think that as many standart components > we'l we get - as better. > > > The Oracle XMLParser 2.0.2.4 implements an integrated > > XML Parsing engine with built-in XPath support as well > > as XSLT Proposed Recommendation compliance. > > > All in Java. Good to go at http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml > > Thank you. Unfortunately I failed to find anything about > pluggable DOM support. > > All I have is: > > Features in Oracle's XML Parser for Java v2 > Integrated support for W3C XSLT Final Working Draft > Intergrated Document Object Model (DOM) Level 1.0 API > Integrated SAX 1.0 API > > From this information I don't understand if there is > even any support for XSLT on top of DOM in Oracle > XML parser. > > Will check. > > Rgds.Paul. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mrc at allette.com.au Mon Oct 25 01:09:44 1999 From: mrc at allette.com.au (Marcus Carr) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: Versioning DTDs? References: <3.0.5.32.19991022142736.00967cd0@inet.net> Message-ID: <3813919F.93B30245@allette.com.au> Ken Gentle wrote: > In developing an e-commerce dialog (using XML, of course), we've determined > that the messages need to be versioned. Specifically, we'll need to have > some way of versioning a DTD such that the XML parser can "figure out" > which version of the DTD to use. > > As the XCatalog stuff (for PUBLIC entities) is not widely supported yet > (based on my rather naive perspective), simply mapping the PUBLIC ids to > different DTDs won't work. Additionally, there is the "change-over > period": what if I have messages/documents to process in my "queue" when > the publicly available DTD changes? If the structure of the two versions > of the DTD are incompatible, I've introduced a problem... I have used OmniMark to manage the dependancies for an SGML dataset by putting APPINFO in the declaration, fixed attributes in the DTD and attributes representing the current DTD in the document. I was able to ensure that everything matched before anything was processed except for the start tag of the DOCTYPE element. Although it was written for an older version of OmniMark and contains a superset of what you need, if you want it, send me offlist mail. -- Regards, Marcus Carr email: mrc@allette.com.au ___________________________________________________________________ Allette Systems (Australia) www: http://www.allette.com.au ___________________________________________________________________ "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." - Einstein xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Mon Oct 25 02:09:34 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: Versioning DTDs? Message-ID: I think Stephen Mohr referred to this recently on the list. Anyway, even if he didn't, one possible solution to this is discussed in his book "Designing Distributed Applications". He addresses the need to send data to different versions of client software - which is more sophisticated than just have different versions of DTDs. Regards, Mark Birbeck x-port.net Ltd. > -----Original Message----- > From: Marcus Carr [mailto:mrc@allette.com.au] > Sent: Monday, October 25, 1999 12:09 AM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Versioning DTDs? > > > > Ken Gentle wrote: > > > In developing an e-commerce dialog (using XML, of course), > we've determined > > that the messages need to be versioned. Specifically, > we'll need to have > > some way of versioning a DTD such that the XML parser can > "figure out" > > which version of the DTD to use. > > > > As the XCatalog stuff (for PUBLIC entities) is not widely > supported yet > > (based on my rather naive perspective), simply mapping the > PUBLIC ids to > > different DTDs won't work. Additionally, there is the "change-over > > period": what if I have messages/documents to process in > my "queue" when > > the publicly available DTD changes? If the structure of > the two versions > > of the DTD are incompatible, I've introduced a problem... > > I have used OmniMark to manage the dependancies for an SGML > dataset by putting APPINFO in the > declaration, fixed attributes in the DTD and attributes > representing the current DTD in the > document. I was able to ensure that everything matched before > anything was processed except > for the start tag of the DOCTYPE element. Although it was > written for an older version of > OmniMark and contains a superset of what you need, if you > want it, send me offlist mail. > > > -- > Regards, > > Marcus Carr email: mrc@allette.com.au > ___________________________________________________________________ > Allette Systems (Australia) www: http://www.allette.com.au > ___________________________________________________________________ > "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." > - Einstein > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From liamquin at interlog.com Mon Oct 25 04:15:07 1999 From: liamquin at interlog.com (Liam R. E. Quin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: Versioning DTDs? In-Reply-To: <3813919F.93B30245@allette.com.au> Message-ID: > Ken Gentle wrote: > > In developing an e-commerce dialog (using XML, of course), we've determined > > that the messages need to be versioned. Specifically, we'll need to have > > some way of versioning a DTD such that the XML parser can "figure out" > > which version of the DTD to use. Yes, this is a common need, both for XML and for SGML. > > As the XCatalog stuff (for PUBLIC entities) is not widely supported yet > > (based on my rather naive perspective), simply mapping the PUBLIC ids to > > different DTDs won't work. Furthermore, XML requires a working SYSTEM ID, so if you use PUBLIC, it's essentially a comment. I don't want to start flame wars about whether PUBLIC is useful or not (***please!!!!****),but yuo are correct in thinking it is not handled the same way everywhere. If you used a catalog file, yuo would want to map SYSTEM IDs and not PUBLIC ones in XML. > > Additionally, there is the "change-over > > period": what if I have messages/documents to process in my "queue" when > > the publicly available DTD changes? If the structure of the two versions > > of the DTD are incompatible, I've introduced a problem... In SGML (not XML), a PUBLIC identifier always returns the same set of declarations -- it can't change just because yuo changed your DTD. This means that many people put the version number. On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Marcus Carr wrote: > I have used OmniMark to manage the dependancies for an SGML dataset by > putting APPINFO in the declaration, fixed attributes in the DTD and > attributes representing the current DTD in the document. Another(similar) aproach involves using CVS or RCS, if you are in the open source world :-) Put the major revision number in a #FIXED attribute in the DTD; for example and every time you check the DTD into the main DTD repository, the attribute will be updated automatically. Same with the System identifier of the DTD, although you may need to put the right thing there with perl or omnimark or Python (hi Paul!) or whatever. You can then write a servlet or CGI script or mod_perl thing or whatever to retrieve the right DTD automatically, using "rcs -p" for example, perhaps with a cache of recently used files. For a non-web appilication, it depends on the software, though , so including the major version number of the DTD in the filename is a good bet for both cases. Lee -- Liam Quin, Barefoot Computing, Toronto; The barefoot programmer l i a m q u i n at i n t e r l o g dot c o m, irc.sorcery.net:Ankh co-author, The XML Specification Guide, Wiley, 1999 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From sebastian.rahtz at computing-services.oxford.ac.uk Mon Oct 25 10:02:13 1999 From: sebastian.rahtz at computing-services.oxford.ac.uk (Sebastian Rahtz) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: URNs in SYSTEM declarations In-Reply-To: <002b01bf1e3c$8cfe99b0$c5010180@p197> References: <002b01bf1e3c$8cfe99b0$c5010180@p197> Message-ID: <14356.3713.751517.355728@spqr.oucs.ox.ac.uk> Richard Anderson writes: > Come and join "DEV-XML" a general purpose XML developers mailing list hosted > on one list. > > Unlike other mailing lists this is specially designed for programmers. The > main focus is for developers using _WINDOWS_ based XML tools such as so why not reflect the Windows bias in the list title, so as not to confuse the unwary? sebastian xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From d.d.barnes at ic.ac.uk Mon Oct 25 11:13:54 1999 From: d.d.barnes at ic.ac.uk (David DS Barnes) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: novice/virgin/ignorance Message-ID: <38141F83.66ABE1B4@ic.ac.uk> Hi, Asking the question: "how can I create html from xml and with what?" will probably get the answer: "rtfm" I would be _very_ grateful if someone could tell me which fm to read ;) Thank you in advance . . . David PS or just tell me what I need? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From obecker at informatik.hu-berlin.de Mon Oct 25 12:20:33 1999 From: obecker at informatik.hu-berlin.de (Oliver Becker) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: novice/virgin/ignorance Message-ID: <199910251020.MAA28565@mail.informatik.hu-berlin.de> Hi David, > Asking the question: > "how can I create html from xml and with what?" > will probably get the answer: > "rtfm" > > I would be _very_ grateful if someone could tell me which fm to read ;) The key-abbreviation is XSLT. Have a look at http://www.xslinfo.com/ Here you'll find specs, tutorials, software etc. Good luck, Oliver /-------------------------------------------------------------------\ | ob|do Dipl.Inf. Oliver Becker | | --+-- E-Mail: obecker@informatik.hu-berlin.de | | op|qo WWW: http://www.informatik.hu-berlin.de/~obecker | \-------------------------------------------------------------------/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rgl at decisionsoft.com Mon Oct 25 12:47:07 1999 From: rgl at decisionsoft.com (Richard Lanyon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:12 2004 Subject: novice/virgin/ignorance In-Reply-To: <199910251020.MAA28565@mail.informatik.hu-berlin.de> Message-ID: On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Oliver Becker wrote: > > Asking the question: > > "how can I create html from xml and with what?" > > will probably get the answer: > > "rtfm" > > > > I would be _very_ grateful if someone could tell me which fm to read ;) > The key-abbreviation is XSLT. XSLT is the W3C's work-in-progress towards a standard. However, it is not the only method for converting from XML to HTML, and may or may not be the most appropriate for what you're doing. Check out XML Script as well, for one alternative: http://www.xmlscript.org/ -- Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan DecisionSoft Ltd. | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From costello at mitre.org Mon Oct 25 13:08:47 1999 From: costello at mitre.org (Roger L. Costello) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: XML Schema + {e-catalog}* --> GUI (automatically!) Message-ID: <38143A62.BCFCC07B@mitre.org> Hi Folks, Over the past few months I have been spending my weekends creating a technology to automatically generate GUIs from XML schemas and e-catalogues. With this technology it is possible to take the manual, human effort out of building and maintaining Electronic Commerce Web sites. This technology enables the automatic generation of self-maintaining Web sites, for any domain. Below is the announcement of this tool. I welcome your thoughts and suggestions. /Roger *** ANNOUNCEMENT *** Electronic Commerce ... Achieving Aggregate Market Awareness at Internet Speed using XML technology Announcing an Open Source tool which automatically generates Web pages based upon an XML schema and conforming XML instance documents (e-catalogs). Namely, XML Schema + e-catalogs ---> AGUI tool --> Web page AGUI = Automatic Graphical User Interface The purpose of this tool is to provide automatic, continually up-to-date (self-maintaining), aggregate market awareness, across all domains. Background Many Web sites today gather data from other Web sites and present an aggregate view of the data. Of course the Internet is changing very fast. Consequently, it is very difficult (and expensive) to maintain an up-to-date aggregate view. The purpose of the technology being presented here is to provide a tool which automatically generates an aggregate view of the data and is constantly up-to-date. Further, this tool works for any domain. Thus, this tool provides the capability to have an automatically generated, self-maintaining search capability, regardless of the domain. Demo and further description, including GUI generation algorithms, located at: xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Bruce.Stephens at MessagingDirect.com Mon Oct 25 13:18:52 1999 From: Bruce.Stephens at MessagingDirect.com (Bruce Stephens) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: novice/virgin/ignorance In-Reply-To: Richard Lanyon's message of "Mon, 25 Oct 1999 11:46:03 +0100 (BST)" References: Message-ID: Richard Lanyon writes: [...] > XSLT is the W3C's work-in-progress towards a standard. However, it is not > the only method for converting from XML to HTML, and may or may not be the > most appropriate for what you're doing. Check out XML Script as well, for > one alternative: > http://www.xmlscript.org/ Of course, if the XML is of some existing DTD, there may already be prepackaged solutions. For example, if it's DocBk, then has stylesheets, and there are free tools for using them. -- Bruce Stephens Bruce.Stephens@MessagingDirect.com MessagingDirect(UK) Ltd xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From varun at chennai.tcs.co.in Mon Oct 25 14:01:03 1999 From: varun at chennai.tcs.co.in (V Arun Kumar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: unable to display xml file Message-ID: <65256815.0041E2C8.00@MAILSERVER2.chennai.tcs.co.in> hi all, i hav got an xml file for which a corresponding xsl file is associated with. When i view the xml file ,i am just gettinga blank page . could anyone clarify this. cheers, arun xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Mon Oct 25 14:39:08 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: IBM4C parser on HP-UX Message-ID: <000a01bf1ee5$cb2cacf0$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi All, I have installed the IBM for C++ XML parser. If I write a simple program like # include # include int main(int argc,char* args[]) { try { XMLPlatformUtils::Initialize(); } catch(const XMLException& toCatch) { cout << "error in initializing "; } } I get the following error messages : Warning 552: "/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 37 # Ambiguous overloaded function declaration; default arguments make this function indistinguishable from previous one. Clashing function "XMLException::XMLException(const unsigned short *,const unsigned short *)" was previously declared at ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 35]. XMLException(const XMLCh* const msg, const char* const type = 0) ^^^^^^^^^^^^ Warning 552: "/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 38 # Ambiguous overloaded function declaration; default arguments make this function indistinguishable from previous one. Clashing function "XMLException::XMLException(const char *,const char *)" was previously declared at ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 36]. XMLException(const char* const msg, const XMLCh* const type = 0) ^^^^^^^^^^^^ Error 399: "test.cpp", line 13 # Cannot use the :: operator with incomplete class XMLPlatformUtils ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/String.hpp", line 295]. XMLPlatformUtils::Initialize(); ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ *** Error exit code 2 Stop. I am on HP UX 11.0 and using the aCC compiler. What's wrong ?? I have changed the environment variables as mentioned in the installation procedure. Thanks & best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991025/032c29cd/attachment.htm From francis at redrice.com Mon Oct 25 15:01:34 1999 From: francis at redrice.com (Francis Norton) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: XML Schema + {e-catalog}* --> GUI (automatically!) References: <38143A62.BCFCC07B@mitre.org> Message-ID: <38145487.6DBBFA9B@redrice.com> James, Looks like we need a new problem ... Alternatively I'm thinking at writing a smallish book on how to write good XSLT - I have a friend who's expanding from legal publishing into internet-related stuff. Many thanks for the chat on Friday - a thought-inspiring session. Francis. "Roger L. Costello" wrote: > > Hi Folks, > > Over the past few months I have been spending my weekends creating a > technology to automatically generate GUIs from XML schemas and > e-catalogues. With this technology it is possible to take the manual, > human effort out of building and maintaining Electronic Commerce Web > sites. This technology enables the automatic generation of > self-maintaining Web sites, for any domain. > > Below is the announcement of this tool. I welcome your thoughts and > suggestions. /Roger > > *** ANNOUNCEMENT *** > > Electronic Commerce > ... > Achieving Aggregate Market Awareness > at Internet Speed > using XML technology > > Announcing an Open Source tool which automatically generates Web pages > based upon an XML schema and conforming XML instance documents > (e-catalogs). > > Namely, > > XML Schema + e-catalogs ---> AGUI tool --> Web page > > AGUI = Automatic Graphical User Interface > > The purpose of this tool is to provide automatic, continually up-to-date > (self-maintaining), aggregate market awareness, across all domains. > > Background > > Many Web sites today gather data from other Web sites and present an > aggregate view of the data. Of course the Internet is changing very > fast. Consequently, it is very difficult (and expensive) to maintain an > up-to-date aggregate view. The purpose of the technology being > presented here is to provide a tool which automatically generates an > aggregate view of the data and is constantly up-to-date. Further, this > tool works for any domain. Thus, this tool provides the capability to > have an automatically generated, self-maintaining search capability, > regardless of the domain. > > Demo and further description, including GUI generation algorithms, > located at: > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net Mon Oct 25 15:01:52 1999 From: AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net (AlanM) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: unable to display xml file Message-ID: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE689792E083@MAIL> Hi Arun, You are probably not using a XML enabled browser. Try the same file on IE5 browser or if you are using IE 4.01 you can download the free download to make it XML enabled. Thanks Alan > -----Original Message----- > From: V Arun Kumar [SMTP:varun@chennai.tcs.co.in] > Sent: Monday, October 25, 1999 5:34 PM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: unable to display xml file > > > > hi all, > i hav got an xml file for which a corresponding xsl file is > associated > with. > When i view the xml file ,i am just gettinga blank page . > could anyone clarify this. > > cheers, > arun > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following > message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From anandram at wipsys.soft.net Mon Oct 25 15:16:13 1999 From: anandram at wipsys.soft.net (Anand Raman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: Minimum skills for XML Message-ID: <3814569F.B02618A@wipsys.soft.net> hi guys Just a passing question.. What are the essential skills a person should possess in the present day to claim he knows XML.I know this largely depends on the nature of job but then there should be a common subset too. I am interested in knowing this minimum subset Thanx a lot Bye Anand -- You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com Mon Oct 25 15:49:04 1999 From: ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com (Yogita Patil) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: IBM4C parser on HP-UX References: <000a01bf1ee5$cb2cacf0$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Message-ID: <025201bf1eef$92cda170$1a02060a@andyne.com> Hi All, I'm using the same IBM for C++ XML parser and it doen't seem to work for me either. Goes past the initialize so am assuming the initialize works as it doesn't enter the catch block , but as soon as i try to create an element after that it crashes with an Unhandled Exception in IXXML4C2.dll. Thanx, Yogita ----- Original Message ----- From: Abhishek Srivastava To: xml dev mailing list Sent: Monday, October 25, 1999 8:38 AM Subject: IBM4C parser on HP-UX Hi All, I have installed the IBM for C++ XML parser. If I write a simple program like # include # include int main(int argc,char* args[]) { try { XMLPlatformUtils::Initialize(); } catch(const XMLException& toCatch) { cout << "error in initializing "; } } I get the following error messages : Warning 552: "/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 37 # Ambiguous overloaded function declaration; default arguments make this function indistinguishable from previous one. Clashing function "XMLException::XMLException(const unsigned short *,const unsigned short *)" was previously declared at ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 35]. XMLException(const XMLCh* const msg, const char* const type = 0) ^^^^^^^^^^^^ Warning 552: "/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 38 # Ambiguous overloaded function declaration; default arguments make this function indistinguishable from previous one. Clashing function "XMLException::XMLException(const char *,const char *)" was previously declared at ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/Exception.hpp", line 36]. XMLException(const char* const msg, const XMLCh* const type = 0) ^^^^^^^^^^^^ Error 399: "test.cpp", line 13 # Cannot use the :: operator with incomplete class XMLPlatformUtils ["/home/abisheks/xml4c2_3_1/include/util/String.hpp", line 295]. XMLPlatformUtils::Initialize(); ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ *** Error exit code 2 Stop. I am on HP UX 11.0 and using the aCC compiler. What's wrong ?? I have changed the environment variables as mentioned in the installation procedure. Thanks & best Regards, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991025/b5f3dd72/attachment.htm From ian at imolesworth.demon.co.uk Mon Oct 25 15:55:16 1999 From: ian at imolesworth.demon.co.uk (Ian Molesworth) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: XML Courses Message-ID: <002701bf1eef$70b09160$86e1dec2@demon.co.uk> Hi all I have seen courses advertised at around ?300 for a one day introduction, in London. Anybody know of any other courses and their prices in the South/ SouthEast of the UK? Ian Molesworth Tango4 Consulting intnl +44 411 378 562 UK 0411 378 562 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991025/0732d73e/attachment.htm From tpassin at mitretek.org Mon Oct 25 16:22:18 1999 From: tpassin at mitretek.org (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:13 2004 Subject: unable to display xml file Message-ID: <00fb01bf1ef4$32ee6140$38a3f1ce@ls-.mitretek.org> You have to explain how you are trying to display it - what programs and versions you are using. There are many possibilities and each one might have a different reason for failing. Also, did you create the stylesheet or did you acquire one that presumably works? Thomas Passin From: V Arun Kumar > > >hi all, > i hav got an xml file for which a corresponding xsl file is associated >with. > When i view the xml file ,i am just gettinga blank page . > could anyone clarify this. > >cheers, >arun > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Mon Oct 25 17:22:17 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: Developer's Books Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277F9F@MDYNYCMSX1> >>www.xmlbooks.com Liam R. E. Quin writes: >It seems,. however, more than a little partisan, no? The page divides books into three categories: "Books I can personally recommend" ("I" being Charles, who tech reviewed all the books before putting his name on them. Full disclosure: this includes one of my books, as well as works by several other xml-dev regulars); "Books whose authors I know" (as he introduces them "I either know the authors of these personally or know of their reputations as expert practitioners of XML and SGML"--this includes your book), and "Other books on XML," which he introduces as "I don't know these books or their authors, but don't let that stop you." When people ask about XML books, if I knew of a more extensive list, I'd recommend it. Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob "The elements be kind to thee, and make thy spirits all of comfort!" Anthony and Cleopatra, III ii xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From twleung at us.ibm.com Mon Oct 25 19:37:28 1999 From: twleung at us.ibm.com (twleung@us.ibm.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: Java Parser Message-ID: <85256815.0060B61F.00@d54mta01.raleigh.ibm.com> Take a look at XML4J EA2. Conformance has improved in this version. >Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:46:01 -0700 >From: David Brownell >Subject: Re: Java Parser >Sajid Rehman wrote: >> >> > > I'd like some advice on which Java parser to use ( Sun TR2 or >> > > XML4J ). Primarily, it would involve using SAX & it's use would be server >> > > side ! >> > >> > Do you need validation? If not, and you are interested in just SAX and not >> > DOM, then add James Clark's XP to your parsers under consideration. >> >> Ummmm...I need validation ! So, which one should it be ? TR2 or >> XML4J ? Performance is an issue here ! >Correctness should be too -- see my XML.com review. > >- - Dave ----- Ted Leung IBM Center for Java Technology/Silicon Valley (408) 777-5825 10275 North DeAnza Boulevard (408) 777-5892 (fax) Cupertino, CA 95014 twleung@us.ibm.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mallikarjuna_s at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 21:41:55 1999 From: mallikarjuna_s at yahoo.com (Mallikarjuna Sangappa) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: DTD Parsers Message-ID: <19991025194629.5754.rocketmail@web2101.mail.yahoo.com> Hello, The requirement is to create a tree structure using DTD as input. Are there any DTD Parsers? If so let me know. Thanks in advance. Mallik ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com Mon Oct 25 22:35:15 1999 From: ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com (Yogita Patil) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: Output to text file Message-ID: <001a01bf1f28$6220c190$1a02060a@andyne.com> Hi All, I'm using the IBM C++ Parser for XML. Any thoughts on how i can spit out the contents of my Domtree to a text file? Thanks. Yogita Patil Software Developer Hummingbird Comm. Ltd. Kingston. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991025/087976d1/attachment.htm From roddey at us.ibm.com Tue Oct 26 00:37:26 1999 From: roddey at us.ibm.com (roddey@us.ibm.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: The SAX interface of the xml4c2 parser Message-ID: <87256815.007C3CE4.00@d53mta03h.boulder.ibm.com> >I don't like returning "const XMLCh*" instead of "const wstring&" or >"const string&" (even though an approach like this would be more >efficient for an expat wrapper). I don't need the index out of range >warning capability, because I iterate through the AttributeList >entries anyway. > wstring is not available on all the platforms. We have to support lots of platforms and a plain character array pointer is the universal format that everyone can understand. >I don't like giving an AttributeList& argument to >DocumentHandler::startElement(), instead of an >AttributeList*, because this rules out the possibility >of passing a null-pointer on for the cases that don't >have an attribute list. > That's what the length method of the attribute list is for. Just query it for the number of elements. A reference to an attribute list is more consistent with the Java interface and is more convenient for the end user. For performance reasons, most practical parsers would keep around one list object per parser instance which is just passed out over and over again (as apposed to constructing one on every start element callout), so there would be no performance overhead concerns. And it means that the code that handles it can be simpler. It doesn't have to test first for null then do the loop. It just does the loop. If there are zero elements, the loop is never entered. ---------------------------------------- Dean Roddey Software Weenie IBM Center for Java Technology - Silicon Valley roddey@us.ibm.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From varun at chennai.tcs.co.in Tue Oct 26 06:53:16 1999 From: varun at chennai.tcs.co.in (V Arun Kumar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: unable to display xml files(my xml and xsl files attached) Message-ID: <65256816.001AB2CE.00@MAILSERVER2.chennai.tcs.co.in> hi all, i am herewith attaching my xml and xsl file which i am using . i use IE 5 browser.i am able to display the same xml file if i use a CSS . so please let me know why its not getting displayed using a xsl . cheers, arun (See attached file: hai.xml)(See attached file: hai.xsl) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: hai.xml Type: application/octet-stream Size: 112 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991026/89b84195/hai.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: hai.xsl Type: application/octet-stream Size: 305 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991026/89b84195/hai-0001.obj From Jon.Bosak at eng.sun.com Tue Oct 26 08:13:13 1999 From: Jon.Bosak at eng.sun.com (Jon Bosak) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: World Wide Web Conference: Amsterdam May 15-19 Message-ID: <199910260613.XAA03430@boethius.eng.sun.com> As a member of the International World Wide Web Conference Committee, I would like to draw your collective attention to the following message. Best regards, Jon ================================================= The Ninth International World Wide Web Conference The Web: The Next Generation ================================================= The Ninth International World Wide Web Conference (WWW9) will be held on May 15-19, 2000 at the RAI International Exhibition & Congress Centre, Amsterdam, The Netherlands. Leaders from industry, academia, and government will present the latest developments in Web technology and discuss the issues and challenges facing the Web community as it moves into the 21st Century. For more information about this conference, please visit the WWW9 Web Site at http://www9.org. To be included on the WWW9 Announcements mailing list, please send an e-mail message to info@www9.org or complete the form provided on the Web Site. ====================================== Future WWW Conferences ====================================== Expressions of interest in hosting a future conference (i.e., WWW10, 11, or 12) are currently being sought. Details on how to apply can be found at: http://www.iw3c2.org/Hosting/Welcome.html A decision regarding the host and location for WWW10 will be made in December, 1999. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rgl at decisionsoft.com Tue Oct 26 10:59:26 1999 From: rgl at decisionsoft.com (Richard Lanyon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:14 2004 Subject: Output to text file In-Reply-To: <001a01bf1f28$6220c190$1a02060a@andyne.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Yogita Patil wrote: > Hi All, > I'm using the IBM C++ Parser for XML. Any thoughts on how i can spit > out the contents of my Domtree to a text file? Conventional wisdom has it that XML is /the/ serialisation of a DOM tree, so why would you want to export your DOM to anything other than XML? -- Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan DecisionSoft Ltd. | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Tue Oct 26 11:48:44 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Output to text file References: Message-ID: <013701bf1f97$26a9acc0$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> The question here is that how to create an XML file "back" from a DOM Tree. >From a discussion i had sometime back on this mailing list I learnt that SUN's JAVA XML parser has an API to write back a DOM tree in an XML file. Does XML4C also has such an API. Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Lanyon To: Yogita Patil Cc: xml dev mailing list Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 2:28 PM Subject: Re: Output to text file > On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Yogita Patil wrote: > > > Hi All, > > > I'm using the IBM C++ Parser for XML. Any thoughts on how i can spit > > out the contents of my Domtree to a text file? > > Conventional wisdom has it that XML is /the/ serialisation of a DOM tree, > so why would you want to export your DOM to anything other than XML? > > -- > Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" > XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan > DecisionSoft Ltd. | > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From reschke at medicaldataservice.de Tue Oct 26 12:21:19 1999 From: reschke at medicaldataservice.de (Julian Reschke) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: unable to display xml files(my xml and xsl files attached) In-Reply-To: <65256816.001AB2CE.00@MAILSERVER2.chennai.tcs.co.in> Message-ID: MSXML doesn't support the XSL you are using -- it's currently stuck at an earlier draft of XSL. -- Julian F. Reschke (mailto:reschke@medicaldataservice.de) MedicalData Service GmbH M?nster, Germany > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > V Arun Kumar > Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 6:56 AM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: unable to display xml files(my xml and xsl files attached) > > > > > hi all, > i am herewith attaching my xml and xsl file which i am using . > i use IE 5 browser.i am able to display the same xml file if > i use a CSS . > so please let me know why its not getting displayed using a xsl . > > cheers, > arun > > (See attached file: hai.xml)(See attached file: hai.xsl) > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 1791 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991026/23c233ce/smime.bin From skshirsa at nortelnetworks.com Tue Oct 26 18:40:39 1999 From: skshirsa at nortelnetworks.com (Shekhar Kshirsagar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Output to text file Message-ID: <3.0.32.19991026114602.00a57e40@zbl6c002.corpeast.baynetworks.com> I had the same requirement. I couldn't find a direct API for this purpose, but there is some sample code for printing the DOM Tree in XML (/xml4csrc2_3_1/samples/DOMPrint/DOMPrint.cpp). I could build an API using this code to achieve the purpose. But I will still like to know, if there is any direct API to achieve this. Regards, Shekhar Nortel Networks At 03:17 PM 10/26/99 +0530, you wrote: > >The question here is that how to create an XML file "back" from a DOM Tree. >From a discussion i had sometime back on this mailing list I learnt that >SUN's JAVA XML parser >has an API to write back a DOM tree in an XML file. > > >Does XML4C also has such an API. > >Abhishek. >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > _/ Abhishek Srivastava > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 >_/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 > _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage > _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. > You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Richard Lanyon >To: Yogita Patil >Cc: xml dev mailing list >Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 2:28 PM >Subject: Re: Output to text file > > >> On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Yogita Patil wrote: >> >> > Hi All, >> >> > I'm using the IBM C++ Parser for XML. Any thoughts on how i can spit >> > out the contents of my Domtree to a text file? >> >> Conventional wisdom has it that XML is /the/ serialisation of a DOM tree, >> so why would you want to export your DOM to anything other than XML? >> >> -- >> Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" >> XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan >> DecisionSoft Ltd. | >> >> >> xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >> Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on >CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >> To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >> unsubscribe xml-dev >> To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following >message; >> subscribe xml-dev-digest >> List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) >> >> > > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ssahuc at imediation.com Tue Oct 26 20:56:16 1999 From: ssahuc at imediation.com (Sebastien Sahuc) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Declaring element more than once in a DTD with namespace ?!? Message-ID: Hello there, The XML spec says that elements with same name cannot be declared more than once in DTD. Fine, now, I believe Namespace can help me to proviude a workaround. Suppose i wanna have the following XML : The main point is the 'operations' element : affiliate can have the operations 'get'; 'set'; 'update'; etc... while merchant has it owns one (different from affiliate's list). As there is no way to declare the operations element twice in a DTD, I was thinking that maybe namespace will allow me to do it, is it right ? For example : ]> Mayt somebody helps me ? Sebastien xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abcoates at TheOffice.net Tue Oct 26 22:06:20 1999 From: abcoates at TheOffice.net (Anthony B. Coates) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Parser in Lingo? Message-ID: <199910262007.GAA27100@mail.internetezy.com.au> ** Reply to message from hpyle@agora.co.uk on Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:25:48 +0100 > Does anyone have a (minimal) XML parser written in Macromind Director's Lingo? Interesting thought. I haven't used Director 7, but the idea was supposed to be that you could embed Java into Lingo, and use that to call out to Java libraries. If that has been implemented, I would recommend it as your best choice. You could use AElfred if size is the main issue (~50K), or otherwise IBM's XML Parser for Java works well for me. You could also write an Xtra (plug-in) that calls out to a C/C++ XML parser, but having written Xtras myself, I wouldn't recommend it unless you already have a couple under your belt. Calling out to Java should be easier, if D7 has the Java support that was being promoted a year ago when I switched from multimedia. Cheers, Tony. ** Anthony B. Coates >> mailto:abcoates@TheOffice.net << ** Software Engineer (Java). This is a 100% Pure Java e-mail. ** AJUG National Secretary (see http://www.ajug.org.au/) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jdowdell at macromedia.com Tue Oct 26 22:31:16 1999 From: jdowdell at macromedia.com (John Dowdell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Parser in Lingo? Message-ID: >> Does anyone have a (minimal) XML parser written in >> Macromind Director's Lingo? Sorry I missed the original post, but Director 7 (and the Shockwave Player) includes expat, along with Lingo wrapper routines. There's only basic support here, but it's available. jd John Dowdell, Macromedia Tech Support, San Francisco CA US Search technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/search/ Offlist email risks capture by the spam filters. I may not see your email if it's not on the list. Private one-on-one email options are available via Priority Access: http://www.macromedia.com/support/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DKGunter at lbl.gov Tue Oct 26 22:41:31 1999 From: DKGunter at lbl.gov (Dan Gunter) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Declaring element more than once in a DTD with namespace ?!? References: Message-ID: <381611B7.AC1CD22D@lbl.gov> Sebastien Sahuc wrote: > > Hello there, > > The XML spec says that elements with same name cannot be declared more > than once in DTD. Fine, now, I believe Namespace can help me to > proviude a workaround. >snip< > The main point is the 'operations' element : affiliate can have the > operations 'get'; 'set'; 'update'; etc... while merchant has it owns > one (different from affiliate's list). > I am new to XML, but it seems to me that a mere "workaround" could be done with more descriptive names, for example 'merchant-operations' and 'affiliate-operations'. They are, after all, different things, right? The reason I'm bothering the list with this rather trivial response is that I'm wondering if naming conventions are normal XML practice, or if there is a better way, short of specifying external files like namespaces seem to require. -- [............. Dan Gunter - LBNL ....................] [One Cyclotron Road, MS:50B-2239, Berkeley, CA 94720 ] [(510)495-2504 / DKGunter@lbl.gov ] xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Lilly_Obina at hc-sc.gc.ca Tue Oct 26 22:57:46 1999 From: Lilly_Obina at hc-sc.gc.ca (Lilly_Obina@hc-sc.gc.ca) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <85256816.0072BCF1.00@smta00.hc-sc.gc.ca> unsubscribe xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ebohlman at netcom.com Wed Oct 27 04:39:39 1999 From: ebohlman at netcom.com (Eric Bohlman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Declaring element more than once in a DTD with namespace ?!? In-Reply-To: <381611B7.AC1CD22D@lbl.gov> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 1999, Dan Gunter wrote: > The reason I'm bothering the list with this rather trivial response is > that I'm wondering if naming conventions are normal XML practice, or if > there is a better way, short of specifying external files like > namespaces seem to require. This is a common misconception about namespaces. The URI associated with a namespace serves *only* as a unique identifier. Period. The namespace is identified by the *text* of the URI *itself*, not by the content of the resource (if it exists at all) pointed to by the URI. It is *not* necessary for an XML processor to fetch that resource in order to process a document that includes elements or attributes in the namespace labelled with that URI. One source of confusion is that many of the schema proposals *do* use a namespace-associated URI as the identifier of a resource that contains the actual schema information. But this is a facility built on top of the namespace mechanism, not an inherent part of the namespace mechanism itself. All the XML processor is required to do is make the text of the URI available to the application. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From andrewl at microsoft.com Wed Oct 27 07:23:05 1999 From: andrewl at microsoft.com (Andrew Layman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:15 2004 Subject: Declaring element more than once in a DTD with namespace ?!? Message-ID: <33D189919E89D311814C00805F1991F7F4A72E@RED-MSG-08> Eric Bohlman wrote, "[A] namespace is identified by the *text* of the URI *itself*, not by the content of the resource (if it exists at all) pointed to by the URI." He is right. You will understand namespaces much better if you give up thinking that the URI identifies any web-retrievable resource. It is just a universally-unique identification system. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From James.Anderson at mecomnet.de Wed Oct 27 11:55:54 1999 From: James.Anderson at mecomnet.de (james anderson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: Declaring element more than once in a DTD with namespace ?!? References: Message-ID: <3816CC89.1330768D@mecomnet.de> The question posed below suggests scoping rules for implicit attribute bindings within a DTD. While the suggestion is plausible, no commonly available processor will infer the necessary bindings. In order for it to "work" one needs to be explicit about prefixes. It's important to keep in mand, that it's not "the same element" even though the encoding in the document may look similar. Sebastien Sahuc wrote: > > Hello there, > > The main point is the 'operations' element : affiliate can have the > operations 'get'; 'set'; 'update'; etc... while merchant has it owns > one (different from affiliate's list). > > As there is no way to declare the operations element twice in a DTD, I > was thinking that maybe namespace will allow me to do it, is it right > ? > > For example : > > > > > "http://www.example.com/affiliate.xml"> > > > "http://www.example.com/merchant.xml"> > > > ]> as an alternative, consider: ]> nb. i've simply duplicated the content of the respective uri. the actual value is unimportant, so long as they differ. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Wed Oct 27 13:02:34 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: vendor support for various parsers Message-ID: <000c01bf206a$91cdf780$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi , Is it possible to purchase a support agreement on various XML parsers available in the market ? We plan to use IBM's XML4C parser on HP UX. Does IBM give customer support for it ? What about Oracle and SUN. Also what will be the cost. Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991027/9d3a85f9/attachment.htm From lucio.piccoli at one2one.co.uk Wed Oct 27 13:32:04 1999 From: lucio.piccoli at one2one.co.uk (LUCIO PICOLLI) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance Message-ID: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> Hi all, I am investigating a project requirement of handling inter-business transactions at the rate of 5000/min with processing time of < 2 secs. The process time would involve XML parsing and some local database select. I would like to use XML over some type of transport ( HTTP i guess ) with Java. My question is what can i do to ensure that the XML parsing is as fast as possible? I guess that some of the areas to be addressed are: 1) Using SAX 2) Using attribute's instead of nodes. What other areas should i investigate? Any help is appreciated. adios -lucio --------------------------------------------------------------------- One2One LUCIO.PICCOLI@one2one.co.uk Elstree Tower tel : +44 181 214 3847 Elstree Way Borehamwood fax :+44 181 214 2325 LONDON WD6 1DT __________ http://www.one2one.co.uk _____________ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Papiani at wdr.com Wed Oct 27 13:55:17 1999 From: Mark.Papiani at wdr.com (Mark.Papiani@wdr.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: vendor support for various parsers Message-ID: As far as I am aware, all the parsers from Oracle, IBM, SUN are provided "as is" with no support. They are all part of developer programmes, alphaworks, early adopter programmes etc. IBM and SUN parsers are freely distributable in binary form as part of other products, subject to certain caveats. The standard license with Oracle's parsers prohibits commercial or production use - single developer use only. I tried to get some Y2K compliance statements from the vendors at one stage - IBM responded as follows: "The only official Y2K-certified version of the XML parser available through the IBM Websphere at this time is for XML4J". So you *might* get support for IBM's Java parser if it is purchased as part of Websphere (I don't think this applies to the XML4C C++ parser though). Mark Papiani Development Environment Engineer Warburg Dillon Read 1 Finsburry Avenue London EC2M 2PP Email: mark.papiani@wdr.com Tel: +44 0171 568 81434 -----Original Message----- From: abisheks Sent: 27 October 1999 12:01 To: xml-dev Subject: FW: vendor support for various parsers Hi , Is it possible to purchase a support agreement on various XML parsers available in the market ? We plan to use IBM's XML4C parser on HP UX. Does IBM give customer support for it ? What about Oracle and SUN. Also what will be the cost. Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From vilya at nag.co.uk Wed Oct 27 14:08:22 1999 From: vilya at nag.co.uk (Vilya Harvey) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> Message-ID: <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> LUCIO PICOLLI wrote: > My question is what can i do to ensure that the XML parsing is as fast as > possible? I guess that some of the areas to be addressed are: > 1) Using SAX You mean, as opposed to using the DOM? This will depend on the structure of the incoming documents and the way you intend to use it. Generally speaking, if you can process the data as it arrives then SAX is probably the more efficient choice; if, on the other hand, you need to be able to perform queries on the data you may get more mileage out of the DOM. You may not need all of the capabilities and checking of the DOM though, so you might be able to get more efficiency out of a custom data representation. > 2) Using attribute's instead of nodes. This is probably a bit of a red herring, although it may have some (fairly negligible) impact depending on the parser you use. > What other areas should i investigate? Any help is appreciated. - Which XML parser to use, on what platform. - Whether you need to validate documents that you receive. I'm sure there's plenty of other things I'm forgetting, too. Hope that helps, Vil. -- Vilya Harvey Wilkinson House Mob: +44 961 106 505 Computational Mathematics Group Jordan Hill Road Wk: +44 1865 511 245 NAG Limited Oxford UK OX2 8DR Fax: +44 1865 311 205 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From nicmila at vscht.cz Wed Oct 27 14:33:49 1999 From: nicmila at vscht.cz (Miloslav Nic) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: Schematron tutorial at Zvon Message-ID: <3816F0F8.DBB6E40C@vscht.cz> I have just published the first version of Schematron tutorial at: http://zvon.vscht.cz/HTMLonly/SchematronTutorial/General/contents.html There is a lot of work to be done to make it really useful but it demonstrates some strength of Schematron. If I can speak for myself with Schematron a dream come true. This was precisely the tool I was looking for. And I actually missed it for the first time I have seen the announcement some time ago. Then, on this Friday, I have seen it mentioned in a message at comp.text.xml, peeped in and was trapped. This week I have started to play with it and I have realized that it solves many problems I had so far with XML validation. It is superbly simple, elegant, XPath based and already implemented! There actually arises a question a friend of mine asked when I was raving about Schematron today: XML must be well-formed. If it conforms to DTD, then it is valid. So what if it conforms to Schematron, is it schematronic? -- *************************************************************** Dr. Miloslav Nic e-mail: nicmila@vscht.cz Department of Organic Chemistry TEL: +420 2 2435 5012 ICT Prague (VSCHT Praha) +420 2 2435 4118 FAX: +420 2 2435 4288 **************************************************************** Support free information exchange: http://zvon.vscht.cz **************************************************************** xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 27 14:44:01 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: vendor support for various parsers In-Reply-To: "Abhishek Srivastava"'s message of "Wed, 27 Oct 1999 16:31:07 +0530" References: <000c01bf206a$91cdf780$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Message-ID: "Abhishek Srivastava" writes: > Is it possible to purchase a support agreement on various XML parsers = > available in the market ? > > We plan to use IBM's XML4C parser on HP UX. Does IBM give customer = > support for it ? > What about Oracle and SUN. Also what will be the cost. I'd recommend a different approach -- I'm sure that many smaller firms or individual contractors will be happy to sell support contracts for open-source parsers, and you'll get a much better and faster response than you will from a bigger company (even if they were interested in tiny support contracts like that). When you use open source, you don't have to buy support from the original producer of the software, so you're dealing with a more free and competitive market. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smohr at voicenet.com Wed Oct 27 15:17:49 1999 From: smohr at voicenet.com (Stephen T. Mohr) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> Message-ID: <005d01bf207d$95f9cc40$e9d9f2cc@omicron.com> If you look at SAX vs. DOM, be sure to include the time to build/navigate any data structures you build in using SAX. As others have noted, SAX really shines if you can use the information as it comes in, i.e., with minimal state information. > LUCIO PICOLLI wrote: > > My question is what can i do to ensure that the XML parsing is as fast as > > possible? I guess that some of the areas to be addressed are: > > 1) Using SAX > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Wed Oct 27 16:00:42 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:16 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance In-Reply-To: "Stephen T. Mohr"'s message of "Wed, 27 Oct 1999 09:17:14 -0400" References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> <005d01bf207d$95f9cc40$e9d9f2cc@omicron.com> Message-ID: "Stephen T. Mohr" writes: > If you look at SAX vs. DOM, be sure to include the time to > build/navigate any data structures you build in using SAX. As > others have noted, SAX really shines if you can use the information > as it comes in, i.e., with minimal state information. Right, except that many (most?) object models are navigable in their own way. Basically, if your object model *is* the DOM (i.e. if you're using the document as a document), then use the DOM; if your object model is something else (i.e. you're using the document as data serialization), then it is extremely wasteful to build a DOM first, since you'll still have to build your own structures in the end. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Wed Oct 27 16:27:14 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: HP-UX IBM4C Parser Message-ID: <00e101bf2087$3e4fbc70$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi, On trying to build a small program on HP-UX 11.0, I get the following error message /Development//cupert/rahul/icu/lib/libicu-uc.sl No such file or directory I have put both the library ( libIXXML4C2_3.sl & libicu-uc.sl ) in the directory /xml4c2_3_1/lib and added it to the SHLIB_PATH environment variable. Why is the path "/Development//cupert/rahul/icu" being assumed ? from where is it coming from ? Is this a bug where a path has been left hard coded in the library. Has anyone encountered this problem before ? I'll appritiate if someone can recommend another C++ parser that runs on HP-UX 11.0. Thanks, Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991027/c22cba31/attachment.htm From Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com Wed Oct 27 18:13:50 1999 From: Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com (Gordon, Simon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: CDATA Section Message-ID: Thanks for the info. I guess I was trying to mix the ATTLIST and ELEMENT syntax. The !ATTLIST declaration allows CDATA but then doesn't seem to use it in the same way as when you specify then use in the XML. Most confusing. Now for the next question; binary data and CDATA sections. According to Tim Bray's annotated XML spec., I can use a CDATA section to send binary data yet I can't get it to work. [The annotation link is the last in the first paragraph of section 2.7 CDATA Sections]. This (IMHO) seems to contradict the XML Spec. where it defines the CDATA data to consist of chars which is further defined as consisting of TAB, CR, LF and 0x20-..etc. That is, not all possible binary values. I've checked this using the RXP parser (good, very good) and it does reject any values outside the defined ranges. Big disappointment. Now I'll have to look at using base64 to exchange binary data with our vendors; we'll all have to implement an encoding/decoding scheme, probably involving attributes and NOTATIONs and a load more work. Unless anyone has a better idea? Regards, Simon Gordon -----Original Message----- From: John Cowan [mailto:cowan@locke.ccil.org] Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 13:23 To: Simon.Gordon@swi.galileo.com Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: CDATA Section Gordon, Simon scripsit: > > > > > The problem is with this line, which says that TEST elements must contain a single *element* whose name is "CDATA". This has nothing to do with CDATA sections. > > Warning: CDATA section not allowed here > > in unnamed entity at line 5 char 16 of file:test.xml Quite right; your document is invalid because your TEST element contains character data instead of an element named CDATA. > > PS. Just tried and removing the DOCTYPE section > > altogether. The former passes the validation test and the latter passes > > the well-formedness test (rxp -xs test.xml)! And rightly so. You cannot *compel* the content of an element to be a CDATA section or not by using DTD-based validation. Elements declared with #PCDATA content may express that content with or without CDATA sections. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From niko at cmsplatform.com Wed Oct 27 19:34:36 1999 From: niko at cmsplatform.com (Nik O) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] Message-ID: <00c701bf20a1$74cbccc0$1a5e360a@tetondata.com> Remember the XML 1.0 definition: CDATA sections are "used to escape blocks of text containing characters which would otherwise be recognized as markup". Nothing about this implies including XML-illegal characters. Re Tim Bray's "CDATA Sections and Binary Data" note: http://www.xml.com/axml/notes/CDprob.html I've never read this to state that you can put _raw_ binary data in a CDATA section. The phrase "When you look at CDATA, you might get the impression that you could maybe jam your binary data in a CDATA section. You'd be right, but..." may be a little misleading, but do remember that these are just explanatory notes that can never be taken to contradict the XML 1.0 spec itself! Yes, base64 is a good method of cramming binary data into a CDATA section, just be certain that a "]]" can't appear in the encoded data. Regards, Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From RSridhar at CBSINC.COM Wed Oct 27 19:52:58 1999 From: RSridhar at CBSINC.COM (RANGANATHAN Sridhar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: Creating XML Documents from text files Message-ID: Is there any tool out there to convert a flat file to XML document given the DTD of the document ? Here's what I want to do : The input file contains contains four record types : Record Type1 : Field11, Field12 ......, Field1n . . Record Type4 : Field41, Field42 ......, Field4n I have the DTD of target XML document. Is there any tool allows the definition of mapping rules between fields in the file to XML document and automatically convert the text file to an XML document. Thanks. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From j.kenneth.gentle at acm.org Wed Oct 27 20:01:09 1999 From: j.kenneth.gentle at acm.org (Ken Gentle) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] In-Reply-To: <00c701bf20a1$74cbccc0$1a5e360a@tetondata.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991027140345.009ab100@inet.net> At 11:33 AM 10/27/99 -0600, you wrote: >Remember the XML 1.0 definition: CDATA sections are "used to escape blocks >of text containing characters which would otherwise be recognized as >markup". Nothing about this implies including XML-illegal characters. > >Re Tim Bray's "CDATA Sections and Binary Data" note: > http://www.xml.com/axml/notes/CDprob.html >I've never read this to state that you can put _raw_ binary data in a CDATA >section. The phrase "When you look at CDATA, you might get the impression >that you could maybe jam your binary data in a CDATA section. You'd be >right, but..." may be a little misleading, but do remember that these are >just explanatory notes that can never be taken to contradict the XML 1.0 >spec itself! > >Yes, base64 is a good method of cramming binary data into a CDATA section, >just be certain that a "]]" can't appear in the encoded data. Can't happen in base64 -- neither "]" nor ">" are legal characters. This is precisely how our application is embedding "binary" data in XML documents: Base64 transfer encoding in a CDATA section. Ken > >Regards, > Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. > > > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david-b at pacbell.net Wed Oct 27 20:01:53 1999 From: david-b at pacbell.net (David Brownell) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> Message-ID: <38173DF0.626D2FDB@pacbell.net> Vilya Harvey wrote: > > > 2) Using attribute's instead of nodes. > > This is probably a bit of a red herring, although it may have some (fairly > negligible) impact depending on the parser you use. Depends on the DTD you use, actually. I think attributes are more expensive to parse; they certainly need normalization and defaulting, which elements don't use. Parsers fill out an auxiliary data structure and then scan it ... Don't get me wrong, this shouldn't be a design consideration, but I do believe that there's a minor price to pay in _all_ parsers. - Dave xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From amathur at cas.org Wed Oct 27 20:23:17 1999 From: amathur at cas.org (Atul Mathur) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: Creating XML Documents from text files References: Message-ID: <3817426E.82FC32D1@cas.org> Try using Omnimark. It is an elegant way of converting flat files into tagged data (XML) which conforms to a DTD. For more info on Omnimark, point your web-browser to www.omnimark.com - Atul RANGANATHAN Sridhar wrote: > Is there any tool out there to convert a flat file to XML document given the > DTD of > the document ? Here's what I want to do : > > The input file contains contains four record types : > > Record Type1 : Field11, Field12 ......, Field1n > . > . > Record Type4 : Field41, Field42 ......, Field4n > > I have the DTD of target XML document. Is there any tool allows the > definition of mapping rules > between fields in the file to XML document and automatically convert the > text file to an > XML document. > > Thanks. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From boblyons at unidex.com Wed Oct 27 20:26:07 1999 From: boblyons at unidex.com (Robert C. Lyons) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: Creating XML Documents from text files Message-ID: <01BF2087.0DA78760@cc398234-a.etntwn1.nj.home.com> Ranganathan asks: "Is there any tool out there to convert a flat file to XML document given the DTD of the document ? Is there any tool allows the definition of mapping rules between fields in the file to XML document and automatically convert the text file to an XML document?" Ranganathan, XML Convert 1.1 is a Java application that uses XFlat schemas to convert flat files into XML. XFlat is an XML language for defining flat file schemas. XML Convert uses an XFlat schema to parse and validate the flat file, and to produce the XML output. XML Convert 1.1 supports a wide variety of flat file formats, including CSV, semi-structured data (e.g., human readable reports), fixed length records and fields, multiple record types, groups of records, nested groups, etc. For more information about XML Convert 1.1 and XFlat, please see http://www.unidex.com/xflat.htm. You can download XML Convert 1.1 for free at: http://www.unidex.com/download.htm Best regards, Bob ------ Bob Lyons EC Consultant Unidex Inc. 1-732-975-9877 boblyons@unidex.com http://www.unidex.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From mrossi at crusher.jcals.csc.com Wed Oct 27 21:06:53 1999 From: mrossi at crusher.jcals.csc.com (Michael Rossi) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: Developer's Books Message-ID: <472EF0A38796D21185810000F807DD1E5E4776@crusher.jcals.csc.com> Thanks to all for your guidance. We'll continue to shop around a bit, but it looks like we may wait for some upcoming releases. In particular, "Professional XML" from WROX Press looks very promising, as well as the potential second edition of "Building XML Applications". xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jes at kuantech.com Wed Oct 27 21:26:18 1999 From: jes at kuantech.com (Jeffrey E. Sussna) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance In-Reply-To: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> Message-ID: <000c01bf20b0$4279ba70$0f36a8c0@quokka.com> Your performance issues may be less with the XML parsing code than with the Java runtime and the web server itself. I recommend you look into optimizing them first. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of > LUCIO PICOLLI > Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 4:26 AM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: XML parsing performance > > > > Hi all, > I am investigating a project requirement of handling inter-business > transactions at the rate of 5000/min with processing time of > < 2 secs. > The process time would involve XML parsing and some local database > select. I would like to use XML over some type of transport > HTTP i > guess ) with Java. > > My question is what can i do to ensure that the XML parsing > is as fast as > possible? I guess that some of the areas to be addressed are: > 1) Using SAX > 2) Using attribute's instead of nodes. > > What other areas should i investigate? Any help is appreciated. > > adios > > -lucio > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > One2One LUCIO.PICCOLI@one2one.co.uk > Elstree Tower tel : +44 181 214 3847 > Elstree Way > Borehamwood fax :+44 181 214 2325 > LONDON WD6 1DT > __________ http://www.one2one.co.uk _____________ > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From deckert at head-cfa.harvard.edu Thu Oct 28 01:49:37 1999 From: deckert at head-cfa.harvard.edu (Thomas Deckert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:17 2004 Subject: XLL, Anything Happening? Message-ID: <199910272349.TAA08057@head-cfa.harvard.edu> Hi Everyone, I've been quietly watching the mail list to see if any information on the X Link Language (XLL) would pop up, but I've seen nothing. The ability to link into remote web pages where one does not have write permissions is extremely interesting, so if anyone has information about any development efforts going on, or beta implementations or anything, please let me know! Thanks, --Tom xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lisal at microsoft.com Thu Oct 28 03:37:00 1999 From: lisal at microsoft.com (Lisa Lippert (Dusseault) (Platinum)) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Xml Techniques Message-ID: Not sure what you're talking about... - If you're talking about traditional email messaging type features, the next version of Exchange will expose some email properties in XML over DAV. - If you're talking about document markup, Office 10 already supports document metadata in XML, and the next version of Exchange will expose that over DAV. - If you're talking about some combination of the two, then I don't understand what the question is :) I'll be discussing the Exchange XML functionality at the upcoming XMLOne conference in Santa Clara on November 11. Lisa -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of Steven Livingstone Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 5:08 PM To: 'XML Dev' Subject: Xml Techniques I am interested in how popular XML has become for messaging type features (eg XMLRPC and SOAP etc...) relative to traditional document markup? - I see two distinct, but (possibly) similar markets. Any exciting project undergo? Thanks, Steven -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991028/8ae7363f/attachment.htm From mclee at oblix.com Thu Oct 28 03:56:28 1999 From: mclee at oblix.com (Michele Lee) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: XML transport question Message-ID: <3817AE38.970EA6B4@oblix.com> Hi, I have a two-part question on XML transport. 1. If two application vendor want to transfer XML documents to each other, is there a standard transport that is used? When I say transport, I mean web server communication using http protocol, etc. 2. If web server is the transport, how do most vendors handle the authentication with the web server? Do they write their own client to authenticate with the web server or are there software available for that? thanks, --Michele xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From kamiya at rp.open.cs.fujitsu.co.jp Thu Oct 28 06:41:51 1999 From: kamiya at rp.open.cs.fujitsu.co.jp (Takuki Kamiya) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: XML parsing performance References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> <38173DF0.626D2FDB@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <045601bf20fe$b0e76540$866e230a@sysrap.cs.fujitsu.co.jp> David Brownell wrote: > > Vilya Harvey wrote: > > > > > 2) Using attribute's instead of nodes. > > > > This is probably a bit of a red herring, although it may have some (fairly > > negligible) impact depending on the parser you use. > > Depends on the DTD you use, actually. I think attributes are more > expensive to parse; they certainly need normalization and defaulting, > which elements don't use. Parsers fill out an auxiliary data structure > and then scan it ... > > Don't get me wrong, this shouldn't be a design consideration, but I > do believe that there's a minor price to pay in _all_ parsers. > Many parsers process "attribute XML without DTD" files in about 10 percent less time compared to the time for "element XML without DTD" in my experience. (On the other hand, file size ratio was about 1 : 1.3) I found that there are a few parsers inclusing Microsoft's whose performance improves significantly (about as half the time) for attribute XML files. I do not believe it is coincidence that those parsers appear not to normalize attribute values at all. Another caveat is that some parsers' performance degrades a lot for attribute XML files. I guess those parsers have not been tuned for the heavy use of attributes. = Takuki Kamiya Phone: (045)476-4586 Fax: (045)476-4749 = = FUJITSU LIMITED (COINS:7128-4217 NIFTY:HHA01731) = xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at prescod.net Thu Oct 28 07:53:35 1999 From: paul at prescod.net (Paul Prescod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) References: Message-ID: <38179FBF.2399F9A4@prescod.net> It seems that most of the "usual suspects" did not get around to discussing your problem which is a pity because I think that it is one of the most fundamental in the XML world. When I win the lottery, I will spend a year or two studying it. Like other problems you've brought up, it is at (er, probably past) the boundary of what we know how to do scalably with modern technology. Sorry. I claim that your problem is, in fact, intimately related not only to the multiple HTML namespaces problem but also to the representation of XLinks. Let me first suggest that the solution to your problem is probably not to put various element type names in one tag. I could be wrong on this point so I'll trust you to set me straight if that's the case. > Tillich GILS:Originator TEI:docAuthor> Now you've said explicitly that your goal is to avoid duplicating the data in your documents in multiple documents. But is duplicating the semantic "author" better? I'm guessing that DC:Creator is *always* going to be a synonym for TEI:docAuthor which means that saying so explicitly in the document is redundant. It causes all of the usual problems of database redundancy: * It increases the size of your database: it will quadruple (at least) your indexes. * It increases the possibility for error: authors or data generators could "forget" to insert a TEI:docAuthor alongside a DC:Creator. * It reduces optimization opportunities because the database won't cache "synonyms" properly. Old fashioned SGML smelly-ness aside, architectural forms were designed to solve exactly this problem. Proponents claim that one of their great virtues is that they allow you to do the mapping in EITHER the document (duplicating data) OR the DTD (centralizing it). I'm not really happy with the fact that it allows the "inline" mode, but the "centralized" mode is just what you need. If you can convince me that you really need multiple element type names *in each and every tag* then you will be the first to do so. As far as your "standards based" requirement: you can't beat an "International Standard". Architectural forms are expressed as attributes but they are supposed to be INTERPRETED by an architectural processor (like nsgmls and jade) as if they were element type names (generic identifiers). The syntax is, IMHO, a hack to avoid violating XML's (and SGML's) rules. Note that XLink borrows heavily from the hack. I claim then, that what you need is a database that understands either architectural forms or some similar technology. It would index in terms of synonyms and recognize that asking for one synonym is as easy as asking for another. As far as I know, architectural form indexing and caching has never been implemented in a large-scale (multi-gigabyte) XML database system but I could be wrong. There is hope, however. "Out of line" architectural forms are about to be reinvented as "archetypes." Once they are reinvented in a syntax that is OO-friendly and W3C approved, it will become obvious that people will need to do XPath-like queries based not only on element types, but also on archetypes. Finally, search engine vendors are likely to "get it." Whether they will be able to develop scalable algorithms to do it in the general case is another question... Paul Prescod xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From paul at prescod.net Thu Oct 28 07:53:46 1999 From: paul at prescod.net (Paul Prescod) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] References: Message-ID: <3817BEA4.89D3F7E4@prescod.net> Mark Birbeck wrote: > > I don't think you need to wait - there's plenty of stuff around that > gives indications of how this is going to pan out. The obvious > commitment to XPath is worth starting with - and to parse that into SQL > queries is not that difficult. It seems difficult to me! Perhaps you could elaborate. Paul Prescod xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From varun at chennai.tcs.co.in Thu Oct 28 07:54:18 1999 From: varun at chennai.tcs.co.in (V Arun Kumar) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: xml and servlets Message-ID: <65256818.0020503C.00@MAILSERVER2.chennai.tcs.co.in> i hav a htm page on the client side which triggers a servlet when posted . the servlet gets the information from the client and queries the database and in turn generates a xml file . this xml file is then returned back to the browser and is rendered using a css . here the problem arises i.e it says "servlet not found : *.css" and displays the xml file in an abnormal way could anyone explain it . thanx arun xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rgl at decisionsoft.com Thu Oct 28 10:22:11 1999 From: rgl at decisionsoft.com (Richard Lanyon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Creating XML Documents from text files In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Oct 1999, RANGANATHAN Sridhar wrote: > Is there any tool out there to convert a flat file to XML document > given the DTD of the document ? As well as the suggestions you've already received, you can also use XML Script (www.xmlscript.org) for this. In fact, XML Script doesn't need you to specify a DTD for the document, you can just parse the text into its components and then use the components as your attribute values, element content or whatever else you want. -- Richard Lanyon (Software Engineer) | "The medium is the message" XML Script development, | - Marshall McLuhan DecisionSoft Ltd. | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Thu Oct 28 13:11:43 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: XLL, Anything Happening? In-Reply-To: <199910272349.TAA08057@head-cfa.harvard.edu> Message-ID: <4.0.1.19991027205348.011646a0@216.27.10.33> At 07:49 PM 10/27/99 -0400, Thomas Deckert wrote: >I've been quietly watching the mail list to see if any information >on the X Link Language (XLL) would pop up, but I've seen nothing. The spec's taken some time developing, apparently, and the current version has lots of open questions. >The ability to link into remote web pages where one does not have >write permissions is extremely interesting, so if anyone has information >about any development efforts going on, or beta implementations or >anything, please let me know! You might check Steve DeRose's implementation list at: http://www.stg.brown.edu/~sjd/XML-Linking/xptr-implementations.html I've got a resources page (for my own XLinkFilter, which has slowed along with the spec) at: http://www.simonstl.com/projects/xlinkfilter/resources.html The xlxp-dev mailing list (devoted to XLink and XPointer) has archives at: http://www.fsc.fujitsu.com/hybrick/xlxp-dev/maillist.html Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From david at megginson.com Thu Oct 28 13:45:06 1999 From: david at megginson.com (David Megginson) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Attribute parsing time (was Re: XML parsing performance) In-Reply-To: "Takuki Kamiya"'s message of "Thu, 28 Oct 1999 13:41:23 +0900" References: <360818b5.270999@smtpgate1.ONE2ONE.CO.UK> <3816EB21.82105AFF@nag.co.uk> <38173DF0.626D2FDB@pacbell.net> <045601bf20fe$b0e76540$866e230a@sysrap.cs.fujitsu.co.jp> Message-ID: "Takuki Kamiya" writes: > Many parsers process "attribute XML without DTD" files in about 10 percent > less time compared to the time for "element XML without DTD" in my experience. That might be misleading. In SAX-based parsers, for example, elements and their character-data content are active -- that is, every element and every chunk of characters is reported to the client DocumentHandler automatically. Attributes, on the other hand, are passive -- the client explicitly has to iterate through the AttributeList to see them -- and they might even be implemented in a lazy fashion (the values might not be unescaped, for example). If you're timing parsers with the SAX interface (or something similar) and an empty DocumentHandler, all of that could easily account for the 10% difference. For a more fair comparison, try something like this in your DocumentHandler: public void startElement (String name, AttributeList atts) { int nAtts = atts.getLength(); for (int i = 0; i < nAtts; i++) { String name = atts.getName(i); String value = atts.getValue(i); } } Now the application has touched every attribute, just like it touches every element. All the best, David -- David Megginson david@megginson.com http://www.megginson.com/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From DuCharmR at moodys.com Thu Oct 28 16:05:30 1999 From: DuCharmR at moodys.com (DuCharme, Robert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: XLL, Anything Happening? Message-ID: <01BA10F0CD20D3119B2400805FD40F9F277FFA@MDYNYCMSX1> >You might check Steve DeRose's implementation list at: >http://www.stg.brown.edu/~sjd/XML-Linking/xptr-implementations.html I've also recently discovered Steve's "XML Linking: An Introduction" (http://www.stg.brown.edu/~sjd/xlinkintro.html) which was just updated last month. Bob DuCharme www.snee.com/bob see www.snee.com/bob/xmlann for "XML: The Annotated Specification" from Prentice Hall. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dhunter at Mobility.com Thu Oct 28 16:27:11 1999 From: dhunter at Mobility.com (Hunter, David) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Developer's Books Message-ID: <805C62F55FFAD1118D0800805FBB428D02BC004C@cc20exch2.mobility.com> There will also be a "Beginning XML" title coming from Wrox Press, but I don't have any idea as to the timeline. -----Original Message----- From: Michael Rossi [mailto:mrossi@crusher.jcals.csc.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 3:03 PM To: 'xml-dev@ic.ac.uk' Subject: RE: Developer's Books Thanks to all for your guidance. We'll continue to shop around a bit, but it looks like we may wait for some upcoming releases. In particular, "Professional XML" from WROX Press looks very promising, as well as the potential second edition of "Building XML Applications". xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wunder at infoseek.com Thu Oct 28 18:42:44 1999 From: wunder at infoseek.com (Walter Underwood) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991028094118.00b84af0@corp.infoseek.com> At 12:08 PM 10/22/99 -0400, John Robert Gardner wrote: >Greetings: > >One of the goals of our project--so kindly written up by Robin at >http://www.oasis-open.org/cover/atlas.html--is to allow the searching of >our records (which will be linked to XML instances of the articles in gif, >then later in keyed/tagged text) from a variety of existing search >interfaces, as transparently as possible. In other words, someone using >DC can search for articles where Creator is Tillich, while someone using >GILS can search for Originator as Tillich, and so on. It may be that markup is not the right hammer for this problem. Our search engine handles multiple DTDs by mapping the elements into common search meta data elements. DC:Creator -> author GILS:Originator -> author TEI:docAuthor -> author and so on. So the documents can remain legal and "pure" with respect to TEI or GILS, but users can search them with a common model. In a sense, this is the same as having separate style sheets for each format, but making them all look the same. You could even consider making a search-specific style sheet (XSLT-only) which transformed each DTD into the common search form. Whether it is implemented with a literal style sheet or not, that is a useful model for thinking about it. If there are separate sets of meta data elements (Dublin Core, GILS, US-MARC), then you'd need a separate transformation for each. Ultraseek Server doesn't implement it that way, partly because XSLT didn't yet exist at the time, and mostly because the indexer has no other use for a DOM, and SAX-style stream/event parsing is more efficient for our purposes. At first glance, it sounds like Ultraseek Server might already implement what you want, so it is at least worth checking it out. If you want more details about our XML support, I wrote it, so you can ask me. And I like the idea of "Creator is Tillich". Shouldn't that be "Ground of Creator is Tillich"? wunder -- Walter R. Underwood Staff Engineer, Infoseek Corp. wunder@infoseek.com http://software.infoseek.com/cce/ (my product) http://www.best.com/~wunder/ 1-408-543-6946 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Thu Oct 28 20:01:15 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:18 2004 Subject: Xml Techniques Message-ID: Lisa, I assume Steven?is actually referring to the difference between using XML for document mark-up and using XML for other applications, and is asking whether most work is still being?done with the former, or the latter. (Although thanks for the update on your products!) ? For my two-penneth worth, I think the areas?Steven mentions - XML-RPC and SOAP - and the one that Lisa refers to, WebDAV, are going to be more significant than even the XML revolution itself. Is this possible, I hear you ask? Bigger? Surely not? ? Well, yes, because although a standardised document mark-up is a great step forward, the issue of exchanging that information is still posed. Systems have to understand each other, and even if the documents that they communicate are standardised, the manner of their communication must be too.?Steven asked for examples. We recently did another recruitment site, and decided as an experiment to see how far we could integrate the client's existing systems with our web server's database, with as little disruption as possible to their existing processes. Now the document mark-up?standpoint would?emphasise that we should use a standard format for the vacancies and CVs - although finding a good one is difficult.?But surely more interesting is finding a?means of conveying that information that?can be used time and again. In the end we used SOAP; we placed a?SOAP client?and server?on their intranet so it could see their database, and then allowed it to talk to our?server. No ODBC connections, DCOM problems or firewall gotchas. And we can use the whole technique again, regardless of whether the next client has a relational, object or ferret database. As I've said before, I think SOAP is a real step forward on XML-RPC, so if you're about to look at XML-RPC, go straight for SOAP. It's a little extra work, but worth it. But both of them are a real leap ahead of the many other distributed techniques that end up being quite proprietary. ? Another technique that I think will really take off is WebDAV. Lisa referred to it in relation to Exchange. For a site we recently got going, we have to deal with five publications three of which are weekly. These come out of PageMaker, but get stored as XML for the usual reasons. Now again, it is easy to get distracted by what seems to be the issue - what standard should we use to structure the articles? Well, we went for XMLNews, but we can change it at any time by updating our schema, so who cares? The really tricky bit is how to give geographically separate journalists the ability to import articles to the system in a quick and reliable fashion. Well, we wrote a WebDAV layer that sits on top of the XML store. For now, users navigate through the store with Microsoft's Web Folders because it's a readily available WebDAV client, but now we've proved the concept we will replace that. They drag the article in HTML (exported from PageMaker) into the Web Folder, which sends it to our WebDAV server, which then converts it to XHTML (tacking on one of the three namespaces - told you you needed three ...) applies the stylesheet applicable to the folder imported into and then imports the resulting structure into the store. ? Now, any WebDAV client could be used here - and obviously someone will come up with the ultimate publishing client, someone else will come up with the ultimate e-commerce client. But also we now have a standard way of controlling data in remote systems. So if we decided to write the ultimate publishing client, but later decided to move all of the profiles on politicians into the upcoming Exchanged server -?which Lisa pointed out will be WebDAV-enabled - all we would have to change is a URL. The application would stay the same. Imagine doing that with your ODBC connections! ? [The site is at http://www.parlicom.com?but please treat this as a preview. There'll be no fanfare till January. Note that the URLs?for articles and contents pages use nearly-XPath - a world where strings have no quotation marks and attributes think they're elements. Also note that if you take the URL for an article and drop the filename bit, you will get the XML for that article wrapped up as a fragment. I wouldn't bother querying for other stuff because the store is in version -9.8 at the moment, and unless the document is in our cache, retrieval will be very, very, very, slow.] ? Anyway, my point is simply that the communication of this information is the next 'big thing' for developers to get stuck into. Document mark-up is pretty obvious - you gotta have it. But to build an information-based internet, we need to get the servers talking to each other! ? Regards, ? Mark ? Mark Birbeck x-port.net Ltd. ? ? ? -----Original Message----- From: Lisa Lippert (Dusseault) (Platinum) [mailto:lisal@microsoft.com] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 2:39 AM To: Steven Livingstone; XML Dev Subject: RE: Xml Techniques Not sure what you're talking about... ?- If you're talking about traditional email messaging type features, the next version of Exchange will expose some email properties in XML over DAV. ?- If you're talking about document markup, Office 10 already supports document metadata in XML, and the next version of Exchange will expose that over DAV. ?- If you're talking about some combination of the two, then I don't understand what the question is :) ? I'll be discussing the?Exchange XML functionality at the upcoming XMLOne conference in Santa Clara on November 11.? ? Lisa -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of Steven Livingstone Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 5:08 PM To: 'XML Dev' Subject: Xml Techniques I am interested in how popular XML has become for messaging type features (eg XMLRPC and SOAP etc...) relative to traditional document markup? - I see two distinct, but (possibly) similar markets. ? Any exciting project undergo? ? Thanks, Steven ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991028/4cd995e9/attachment.htm From wxie at gmswireless.com Thu Oct 28 20:42:59 1999 From: wxie at gmswireless.com (Weihong Xie) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: how the parser locate dtd files Message-ID: <001101bf2172$c0b3a410$89fcd8d0@gmswireless.com> hi, I am new to xml and need to do a quick prototype of how to retrieve information from other web site using xml format. I got a parsing error of ** Parsing error, line 2, uri null Relative URI "my.dtd"; cannot be resolved without a document URI. I am using Sun's xml parser, and the code looks like URL source = new URL(url); URLConnection conn = source.openConnection(); conn.setDoInput(true); InputStream is = conn.getInputStream(); input = Resolver.createInputSource("text/xml;charset=UTF-8", is, false, "http"); parser = ParserFactory.makeParser(); parser.setDocumentHandler(this); parser.setErrorHandler(this); parser.parse(input); The document that I am retrieving from the url looks like ..... The my.dtd is at the same location as the document, but obviously the parser doesn't know how to resolve it. What I need to do for configuring the parser? I am kind of lost by reading the document, any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Weihong. xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jevdemon at acm.org Thu Oct 28 21:36:55 1999 From: jevdemon at acm.org (John Evdemon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: XML transport question Message-ID: <37F28C1F002E02B7@isocor6.visto.com> (added by postmaster@isocor6.visto.com) Michele, Here is some info that might help you: 1. If two application vendor want to transfer XML documents to each other, is there a standard transport that is used? When I say transport, I mean web server communication using http protocol, etc. The systems I have worked on use HTTP or HTTPS. XML is really nothing more than a specially formatted file. It could theoretically be transported using any networking protocol (e.g. IP, IPX, etc.). 2. If web server is the transport, how do most vendors handle the authentication with the web server? Do they write their own client to authenticate with the web server or are there software available for that? Use digital certificates on both the server (to authenticate the server to the client) and the client (to enable client authentication/non-repudiation). This is by far, the easiest and most secure (although it significantly increases the processing load on the server). There are alternatives (such as Basic Authentication - userid/password), but they tend to be less secure. Hope this helps! John Evdemon XML Solutions http://www.xmls.com ______________________________________________________________________ Get Visto.com! Private groups, event calendars, email, and much more. Visto.com. Life on the Dot. Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wxie at gmswireless.com Thu Oct 28 22:00:25 1999 From: wxie at gmswireless.com (Weihong Xie) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: how the parser locate dtd files In-Reply-To: <3818A2BB.ACAFE9B5@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <001201bf217d$8aa43870$89fcd8d0@gmswireless.com> Thanks for your reply, I've try to create the InputSource directly by input = new InputSource(url) but the sun's xml tr2 parser doesn't like it, it gives me java.io.IOException: Push back buffer is full at java.io.PushbackInputStream.unread(PushbackInputStream.java:211) at com.sun.xml.parser.XmlReader.useEncodingDecl(Compiled Code) at com.sun.xml.parser.XmlReader.(XmlReader.java:240) at com.sun.xml.parser.XmlReader.createReader(XmlReader.java:86) ... I think it's because it's not using http protocal although the url is an http url string. One thing that I may not make it clear is the xml page/content is dynamically generated at the web server. Thanks for any help. Weihong. > -----Original Message----- > From: David Brownell [mailto:david-b@pacbell.net] > Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 12:24 PM > To: Weihong Xie > Subject: Re: how the parser locate dtd files > > > Weihong Xie wrote: > > > > hi, > > > > I am new to xml and need to do a quick prototype of how to retrieve > > information from other web site using xml format. I got a > parsing error of > > > > ** Parsing error, line 2, uri null > > Relative URI "my.dtd"; cannot be resolved without a document URI. > > Clearly you're not providing the document URI ... > > > > I am using Sun's xml parser, and the code looks like > > ... why don't you just do "input = new InputSource (url)"? > > That provides the base URI to the parser, and is a _lot_ simpler. > > - Dave > > > > > > > URL source = new URL(url); > > URLConnection conn = source.openConnection(); > > conn.setDoInput(true); > > InputStream is = conn.getInputStream(); > > > > input = > Resolver.createInputSource("text/xml;charset=UTF-8", is, > > false, "http"); > > parser = ParserFactory.makeParser(); > > parser.setDocumentHandler(this); > > parser.setErrorHandler(this); > > parser.parse(input); > > > > The document that I am retrieving from the url looks like > > > > > > > > ..... > > > > The my.dtd is at the same location as the document, but > obviously the parser > > doesn't know how to resolve it. What I need to do for configuring the > > parser? I am kind of lost by reading the document, any help > will be greatly > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Weihong. > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and > on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > > unsubscribe xml-dev > > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > > subscribe xml-dev-digest > > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Thu Oct 28 22:51:12 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] Message-ID: Now that's worrying. When someone like Paul says something might not be easy, it's time to check the code. I'll get back to you - but initial reports are ... it's still easy! Mark > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Prescod [mailto:paul@prescod.net] > Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 4:10 AM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Coca-Cola Data [Was RE: Is this Impossible !!] > > > Mark Birbeck wrote: > > > > I don't think you need to wait - there's plenty of stuff around that > > gives indications of how this is going to pan out. The obvious > > commitment to XPath is worth starting with - and to parse > that into SQL > > queries is not that difficult. > > It seems difficult to me! Perhaps you could elaborate. > > Paul Prescod > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, > mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and > on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com Thu Oct 28 23:07:34 1999 From: Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com (Gordon, Simon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: CDATA Section Message-ID: Any ideas? Well, sort of... We have two or perhaps three problems when trying to transfer binary data within XML elements; 1) Transfer should not break XML's character set restrictions 2) Transfer should be economic of bandwidth 3) The encoding/decoding should be cognisant of the character encoding in use 1 is a given; it's why this discussion got started. 2 and 3 are less so and more of a desire on my part to see an elegant and economic solution that lies within XML itself. For instance, BASE64 is _OK_ when encoding binary data into 8-bit characters but what happens when we have 16-bit Unicode characters? The (in)efficiency goes from 133% to 266%. If the encoder knew the character set in use, it could send data more efficiently without relying on a compression algorithm. In fact, XML declares only 29 of the 256 8-bit characters to be illegal so we could pass the 227 legal ones straight through and only escape the remaining 29. Under Unicode we have 63457 legal and 2079 illegal characters. Burying this inside of the XML parser (which does have full knowledge of the character encoding) would make it invisible to end-users. Attributes in the XML namespace could control the encode/decode behavior. In fact, this corresponds with the concept outlined in the latest XML Schemas specification (Part 2, Section 3.2.9) where they talk about an encoding facet**. Assuming a totally random input stream, the inefficiencies drop to 111% for 8-bit characters and only 109% for 16-bit characters, ignoring any overhead in Controlling XML attributes and assuming a 1 : 2 expansion ratio for illegal characters. With this sort of overhead, it now makes economic sense to compress large files, then apply this sort of encoding without worrying too much about the gain of the compression being lost in the encoding. Seen XMLZIP? I'd put in more but I don't want to post too much in one go and besides, I'm sure this sort of thing must've been proposed before (but then, why are we still stuck with using base64 or &#xx; to send binary data?) ** Couldn't this be the URL of a translation service? Just send it the stream to en/decode or request the applet - A Web-centric application as proposed by Tim O'Reilly recently? Regards, Simon Gordon Systems Engineer, Systems Integration, Galileo International, Denver, USA. -----Original Message----- From: John Evdemon [mailto:JohnE01@xmls.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 11:15 To: Gordon, Simon; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: RE: CDATA Section I've run into a similar issue with CDATA, although we were transferring mainframe reports within XML, not binary data. The suggested workaround was base64 -- I would love to see something more elegant. Any ideas? John Evdemon Architect XML Solutions http://www.xmls.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of Gordon, Simon Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 11:48 AM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: RE: CDATA Section Thanks for the info. I guess I was trying to mix the ATTLIST and ELEMENT syntax. The !ATTLIST declaration allows CDATA but then doesn't seem to use it in the same way as when you specify then use in the XML. Most confusing. Now for the next question; binary data and CDATA sections. According to Tim Bray's annotated XML spec., I can use a CDATA section to send binary data yet I can't get it to work. [The annotation link is the last in the first paragraph of section 2.7 CDATA Sections]. This (IMHO) seems to contradict the XML Spec. where it defines the CDATA data to consist of chars which is further defined as consisting of TAB, CR, LF and 0x20-..etc. That is, not all possible binary values. I've checked this using the RXP parser (good, very good) and it does reject any values outside the defined ranges. Big disappointment. Now I'll have to look at using base64 to exchange binary data with our vendors; we'll all have to implement an encoding/decoding scheme, probably involving attributes and NOTATIONs and a load more work. Unless anyone has a better idea? Regards, Simon Gordon -----Original Message----- From: John Cowan [mailto:cowan@locke.ccil.org] Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 13:23 To: Simon.Gordon@swi.galileo.com Cc: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: CDATA Section Gordon, Simon scripsit: > > > > > The problem is with this line, which says that TEST elements must contain a single *element* whose name is "CDATA". This has nothing to do with CDATA sections. > > Warning: CDATA section not allowed here > > in unnamed entity at line 5 char 16 of file:test.xml Quite right; your document is invalid because your TEST element contains character data instead of an element named CDATA. > > PS. Just tried and removing the DOCTYPE section > > altogether. The former passes the validation test and the latter passes > > the well-formedness test (rxp -xs test.xml)! And rightly so. You cannot *compel* the content of an element to be a CDATA section or not by using DTD-based validation. Elements declared with #PCDATA content may express that content with or without CDATA sections. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org I am a member of a civilization. --David Brin xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lgeorge at gmx.net Thu Oct 28 23:06:11 1999 From: lgeorge at gmx.net (Lars George) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: XML/XSL problems Message-ID: <002201bf2185$3a9e8ee0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Hi, I just tried to transform some XML files into HTML using different XSL stylesheets. I tried Oracles XML/XSL classes and XT/XP (even the XT standalone Windows executable). The problem I have that whatever I try all I get as an output to the transformation is just the plain XSL file, with just minor changes in it. All that happened is that tags like are transformed into pairs like . But no trace of reading in the XML data, all processing instructions are still the ones from the XSL file. At the end of my efforts I even tried to transform samples from the book "XML Bible". They used XT and also showed what you have to type in to get the results. BUT in my case that did not work either. I still get the plain XSL file instead of a parsed HTML with the data from XML file in it. BTW: The same XSL work if I include them into the XML using a link and then display it with IE5. The result is correct, but only with IE5 not when I use the same samples and the pure Java parsers/processors. Question: What am I doing wrong here? TIA, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jrgardn at emory.edu Thu Oct 28 23:31:28 1999 From: jrgardn at emory.edu (John Robert Gardner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) In-Reply-To: <38179FBF.2399F9A4@prescod.net> Message-ID: Many thanks for resuscitating this topic, and for the reassurance that the relative paucity of responses was not indicative of it's overall relevance to this list. I'm glad to have the chance to flesh this out further, so the reply below will address the matter along three lines: 1. to clarify, per the request, "why" multiple namespaces 2. to address/question the applicability of architectural forms 3. to present the possible solution we're considering viz. our initial investment in Oracle, and corresponding prescription to work with open standards. 4. offer a response to W. Underwood's reply On Wed, 27 Oct 1999, Paul Prescod wrote: > Let me first suggest that the solution to your problem is probably not > to put various element type names in one tag. I could be wrong on this > point so I'll trust you to set me straight if that's the case. > > > Tillich > GILS:Originator TEI:docAuthor> > > Now you've said explicitly that your goal is to avoid duplicating the > data in your documents in multiple documents. But is duplicating the > semantic "author" better? Here it is likely I've not clarified the rationale. I'll try metaphor since my generalization also ran aground on TEI-L in this relation. At the same time, this is the best case I can make for Paul's point: > If you can convince me that you really need > multiple element type names *in each and every tag* then you will be the > first to do so. Heinrich at Humboldt U. in Berlin is dilligently searching the world's various library resources with his Dublin-Core-Based engine for Tillich and we want his DC system to transparently find the wealth of Tillich articles we'd have online. Simultaneously, Alicia is using a TEI-based search over in Ireland, and wants to find Tillich, with the same transparency, and Lu in HongKong has GILS, so Tillich is the formula for the query. With our multiple namespaces/ArchForms/tagbag (see below) or whatever, everybody is able to use their native search engine which, in turn, is able to find the gems of wisdom sought without any additional tweaking on the user--or library administrators'--end. "Multiple Namespaces" was a suggestion I had in offline discussions, which, of course, "can't" be done, so I'm hoping, at least, that the reason for it makes better sense now. > I'm guessing that DC:Creator is *always* going > to be a synonym for TEI:docAuthor which means that saying so explicitly yes, it is, so Arch FOrms does make sense, but cf. below . . . . > in the document is redundant. It causes all of the usual problems of > database redundancy: > > * It increases the size of your database: it will quadruple (at least) > your indexes. Granted, but this would be an acceptable caveat if the goal noted just above is met. > * It increases the possibility for error: authors or data generators > could "forget" to insert a TEI:docAuthor alongside a DC:Creator. Yes and no, since most of our input is one-time only, rather than respeatedly updated or nuanced. THe finished article and record entry is a one-time keying (or XSLT transformed) deal. > * It reduces optimization opportunities because the database won't > cache "synonyms" properly. Exactly our worry. Our initial implementation for demo is with our existing Oracle 8.1.5 (soon-to-be .6, we hope) wizard's work. We've been given the idea of architectural forms in the context of the same discussion wherein mult namespaces was raised. Here I am willing to learn that my ignorance of Arch Forms has caused me to to sell the solution short, esp. cf. Paul's comment in his closing para: > There is hope, however. "Out of line" architectural forms are about to > be reinvented as "archetypes." Once they are reinvented in a syntax that > is OO-friendly and W3C approved, it will become obvious that people will > need to do XPath-like queries based not only on element types, but also > on archetypes. Finally, search engine vendors are likely to "get it." My responses/questions/concerns on Arch forms were as follows- 1. as it is an SGML subset standard, our "standards" caveat is ostensibly met, but-- per the above-- it seems not necessarily "happy" with XML -- or I'm misreading you? At any rate as ISO 10744:1997, AAnnex A.3 it seems very viable . .. . except-- cf. caveats 2 and 3 below: 2. Will Arch forms work with our Oracle investment to date (we're considering SIM and related technology for our next Phase)? 3. Re: > Old fashioned SGML smelly-ness aside, architectural forms were designed > to solve exactly this problem. Proponents claim that one of their great > virtues is that they allow you to do the mapping in EITHER the document > (duplicating data) OR the DTD (centralizing it). I'm not really happy > with the fact that it allows the "inline" mode, but the "centralized" > mode is just what you need. Will this mechanism achieve the transparency for our users in diaspora referred to above--and hopefully I made better sense this time--in the section? Because we discussed using attributes for teh different synonymous--or largely so-- tags like docAuthor/Creator/Originator, etc., but we were under the impression that, per below as well, attributes wouldn't achieve our implementation of transparent accessibility. The obvious bottom line is the transparency, in the end, the software required, legacy investment or none-- is secondary to this requirement, given that we are implementing an open/int'l standard. If we must write some "in between" script or program gizmo to make it transparent with arch forms, then we're good to go, and are subsequently seeking suggestions along these lines, and want to be sure that we are working with the right database software to do so (proprietary solutions which Oracle--or anyone else--may provide are obviated by the charge of our grant). ------One suggestion we're considering--------- Put our initial stash of MARC records, via my XSLT work and such, into --say-- Dublin Core for the Oracle database to store, and then construct an XML document which is a tagbag of empty elements with attributes which equivocate that the Dublin Core Creator is the same as TEI docAuthor, etc. This sounds like Arch. Forms, in a way, but--as noted--I'm not convinced I fully grok arch forms anyway. How does htis figure into your points above, and following below? > Architectural forms are expressed as attributes but they are supposed to > be INTERPRETED by an architectural processor (like nsgmls and jade) as > if they were element type names (generic identifiers). The syntax is, This, then, if true for transparency, would then still need to pass the question in #2 just above, will it work with Oracle? Corresponding, then, to Paul's summation below: > I claim then, that what you need is a database that understands either > architectural forms or some similar technology. It would index in terms > of synonyms and recognize that asking for one synonym is as easy as > asking for another. As far as I know, architectural form indexing and > caching has never been implemented in a large-scale (multi-gigabyte) XML > database system but I could be wrong. We're more than willing--and are largely bound as well--to trudge forth and do so in uncharted waters, but hence my many questions, and also considerations of SIM, etc., etc. On Thu, 28 Oct 1999, Walter Underwood wrote: > Our search engine handles multiple DTDs by mapping the elements > into common search meta data elements. > > DC:Creator -> author > GILS:Originator -> author > TEI:docAuthor -> author > > and so on. So the documents can remain legal and "pure" with > respect to TEI or GILS, but users can search them with a > common model. This is also not unlike what we're considering, but it sounds from your post like it enables folks to come to your search engine and do these multiple search types via the common mapping you've set up, wherein, per the above, we want folks to be able to do this with their existing native search system. > > And I like the idea of "Creator is Tillich". Shouldn't that > be "Ground of Creator is Tillich"? . .. . . only, of course, if it has the _courage to be_ the Ground of the Creator . . . ;-) thanks both of you!, jr =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-= John Robert Gardner XML Engineer ATLA-CERTR ------------------------------------------------------------ http://vedavid.org/ http://www.purl.org/CERTR/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From barton.stanley at innovision.com Fri Oct 29 00:06:54 1999 From: barton.stanley at innovision.com (Barton Stanley) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:19 2004 Subject: XML/XSL problems In-Reply-To: <002201bf2185$3a9e8ee0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Message-ID: <4.1.19991028164029.00ae1ac0@mail> Lars, If you are using the *printed* XML Bible, the problem may be that some of its examples have drifted out of date. If you are using the most up-to-date versions of XT, etc, the stylesheets in the printed book may no longer work as advertised. This is an educated guess on my part. I have not used the printed XML Bible. I have however seen the behavior that you describe and I was able to fix it. The most important thing to check is the value of the 'xmlns:xsl' attribute in the 'xsl:stylesheet element'. This attribute should have a value of "http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform" if your stylesheet is to work with the most up-to-date XSLT processors. If it has any other value, you will likely get the behavior that you describe. Try changing the value of this attribute and running the processor again. You should not get the same behavior. You may get errors, however. This is because other things in XSLT may have changed as well. You might try checking the on-line version of Chapter 14 of the XML Bible at: http://metalab.unc.edu/xml/books/bible/updates/14.html This is up-to-date with the October 8 draft. This may help you sort out other errors you might get. IE5's XSLT implementation is *very* out of date, so it (paradoxically) works with your stylesheets. One more thing: I suggest that you post subsequent queries about XSL to xsl-list. You can subscribe to it at http://www.mulberrytech.com/xsl/xsl-list/ There are lots of folks there who can help. Plus, you will generally get a quicker response to XSL queries there because it is a list dedicated to XSL. Cheers, Barton xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From lgeorge at gmx.net Fri Oct 29 01:18:25 1999 From: lgeorge at gmx.net (Lars George) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: XML/XSL problems In-Reply-To: <4.1.19991028164029.00ae1ac0@mail> Message-ID: <002501bf2198$4ed598f0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Thanks Barton, That was it, 100% hit! I had the old URI pointing to the working draft. Boy this can get really complicated. Thanks for pointing me towards the XSL list. I will check it out right now. Regards, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia > -----Original Message----- > From: Barton Stanley [mailto:barton.stanley@innovision.com] > Sent: Friday, 29 October 1999 8:06 > To: Xml-Dev > Cc: Lars George > Subject: Re: XML/XSL problems > > > Lars, > > If you are using the *printed* XML Bible, the problem may be that > some of its examples have drifted out of date. If you are using > the most up-to-date versions of XT, etc, the stylesheets in the > printed book may no longer work as advertised. This is an > educated guess on my part. I have not used the printed XML > Bible. I have however seen the behavior that you describe and I > was able to fix it. > > The most important thing to check is the value of the 'xmlns:xsl' > attribute in the 'xsl:stylesheet element'. This attribute should > have a value of "http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform" if your > stylesheet is to work with the most up-to-date XSLT processors. > If it has any other value, you will likely get the behavior that > you describe. > > Try changing the value of this attribute and running the > processor again. You should not get the same behavior. > > You may get errors, however. This is because other things in > XSLT may have changed as well. You might try checking the > on-line version of Chapter 14 of the XML Bible at: > http://metalab.unc.edu/xml/books/bible/updates/14.html This is up-to-date with the October 8 draft. This may help you sort out other errors you might get. IE5's XSLT implementation is *very* out of date, so it (paradoxically) works with your stylesheets. One more thing: I suggest that you post subsequent queries about XSL to xsl-list. You can subscribe to it at http://www.mulberrytech.com/xsl/xsl-list/ There are lots of folks there who can help. Plus, you will generally get a quicker response to XSL queries there because it is a list dedicated to XSL. Cheers, Barton xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Fri Oct 29 02:08:35 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: XML transport question Message-ID: SOAP and its precursor XML-RPC allow for methods to be executed on remote servers and data to be passed in both directions. XML is used to encode data of any type. SOAP is pretty easy to implement, and uses HTTP so you don't have firewall problems, etc. Although it's very general purpose, I found that for document transfer specifically, you still ended up trying to address issues like locking and versioning. I would therefore suggest you look at WebDAV, although implementing that is a whole different ball-game. For a start, you need to add new methods to your web server, so it depends on what expertise you have access to, whether that's possible. We have just implemented a WebDAV layer in C++, and we may turn the whole thing into an SDK. But that's not likely to be anytime soon. I believe that WebDAV will find it's way into many Microsoft products over the coming period, too. So, to sum up: if you have full control over the two end-points, and know what the traffic volume will be like, then SOAP should cover it. If there could be issues of contention, such as using two or three servers to send data at anytime to a central server, then look at WebDAV. The latter scenario could be handled with SOAP - UserLand are using XML-RPC, for example to cope with their discussion board - but you may want to consider putting a layer just underneath, such as Microsoft Message Queue, to make sure you cope with volume, and the remote requests don't end up timing out. As to security, just use whatever you would normally. Just ensure that the server software passes the password and user name it has been assigned. The socket software you use to initiate the connections should handle that. Regards, Mark Mark Birbeck Managing Director x-port.net Ltd. 220 Bon March? Centre 241-251 Ferndale Road London SW9 8BJ w: http://www.iedigital.net/ t: +44 (171) 501 9502 e: Mark.Birbeck@iedigital.net > -----Original Message----- > From: Michele Lee [mailto:mclee@oblix.com] > Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 3:00 AM > To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Subject: XML transport question > > > > Hi, > > I have a two-part question on XML transport. > > 1. If two application vendor want to transfer XML documents > to each other, is > there a standard transport that is used? When I say > transport, I mean web > server communication using http protocol, etc. > > 2. If web server is the transport, how do most vendors handle the > authentication with the web server? Do they write their own client to > authenticate with the web server or are there software > available for that? > > thanks, > > --Michele > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, > mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and > on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the > following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 29 03:45:45 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: XML/XSL problems References: <4.1.19991028164029.00ae1ac0@mail> Message-ID: <001101bf21af$eeec9a20$54561990@us.oracle.com> The Oracle XML Parser v2.0.2.4 implements the October 8, 1999 XSLT Proposed Recommendation, so the XSL URI is likely the culprit here. The reason your stylesheet gets returned is that, since the processor doesn't recognize your element as being from the namespace with namespace URI http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform , it has to assume that you just picked the three letters "xsl" as a prefix for your non-XSL namespace and it needs to treat those as a "Literal Result Element" which is a legal way to start a simple, one-template stylesheet. ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Barton Stanley To: Xml-Dev Cc: Lars George Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 3:06 PM Subject: Re: XML/XSL problems | Lars, | | If you are using the *printed* XML Bible, the problem may be that some of its examples have drifted out of date. If you are using the most up-to-date versions of XT, etc, the stylesheets in the printed book may no longer work as advertised. This is an educated guess on my part. I have not used the printed XML Bible. I have however seen the behavior that you describe and I was able to fix it. | | The most important thing to check is the value of the 'xmlns:xsl' attribute in the 'xsl:stylesheet element'. This attribute should have a value of "http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform" if your stylesheet is to work with the most up-to-date XSLT processors. If it has any other value, you will likely get the behavior that you describe. | | Try changing the value of this attribute and running the processor again. You should not get the same behavior. | | You may get errors, however. This is because other things in XSLT may have changed as well. You might try checking the on-line version of Chapter 14 of the XML Bible at: | | http://metalab.unc.edu/xml/books/bible/updates/14.html | | This is up-to-date with the October 8 draft. This may help you sort out other errors you might get. | | IE5's XSLT implementation is *very* out of date, so it (paradoxically) works with your stylesheets. | | One more thing: I suggest that you post subsequent queries about XSL to xsl-list. You can subscribe to it at | | http://www.mulberrytech.com/xsl/xsl-list/ | | There are lots of folks there who can help. Plus, you will generally get a quicker response to XSL queries there because it is a list dedicated to XSL. | | Cheers, | | Barton | | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From anandram at wipsys.soft.net Fri Oct 29 07:47:17 1999 From: anandram at wipsys.soft.net (Anand Raman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace Message-ID: <3819335F.F773CE42@wipsys.soft.net> HI guys I am getting a Reference to undeclared namespace "exp:" error for the following code snippet when i try to view the document in IE 5. I have successfully validated the documents using the XML4J parser and XMLPRO . Also the problem doesnt occur when i dont associate the dtd in the XML file . Why is this error appearing and what can be done to solve it ** DTD ** ** XML ** Management Information Systems Infotech ESD Finance Department till date .......... Thanx a lot Anand Raman -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/4fa0bbe0/attachment.htm From antons at epos.co.za Fri Oct 29 09:52:08 1999 From: antons at epos.co.za (Anton Schoultz - ePOS) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: Multiple documents in one 'wrapper' Message-ID: Hi all, I am new to the marvels of XML which I am using in an E.D.I. context. In UN-EDIFACT an interchange can built up from a 'mixed bag' of EDIFACT Messages, which are then wrapped inside the interchange UNB/UNZ while each message is bounded by it's own UNH/UNZ. I have two questions here Q1-Does XML support multiple document types in a file? iow could I wrap several invoice docs, a couple of statement docs, and a report into one file? Q2-I'd like to use some common fragments in several different documents, preferably without replicating the definition in each DTD. Can I set up a DTD fragment and then refer to it from within my document DTD, if so how? Many Thanks Anton Schoultz e-mail: mailto:antons@ePOS.co.za Office: +27 11 807-9400 Ext. 205 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 2028 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/6388acdf/winmail.bin From matthew at praxis.cz Fri Oct 29 10:57:44 1999 From: matthew at praxis.cz (Matthew Gertner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: A Plea for Schemas Message-ID: <38196183.8B669A0A@praxis.cz> I have written a short "XML Rant" arguing essentially that the most vital missing piece of the XML puzzle is the existence of a standard schema language and schema repository (or discovery mechanism). Among other things I claim that something like "archetypes" (it didn't occur to me to use this exact term) could make RDF irrelevant, mainly due to usability considerations. As it is a rant, it should hopefully drive at least some readers into a frothing rage (I even included a completely gratuitous swipe at the HyTime community just to make sure). The document can be found at: http://www.praxisxml.com/praxis_xml.html I would be very interested in any comments or opinions. Regards, Matthew xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Fri Oct 29 12:23:35 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: Multiple documents in one 'wrapper' Message-ID: > Anton Schoultz wrote: > Q1-Does XML support multiple document types in a file? iow could I > wrap several invoice docs, a couple of statement docs, and a report > into one file? [Mark Birbeck] Take a look at the fragment interchange spec, at W3C. It's very simple but quite good. For an example doc, look at: http://www.parlicom.com/X-Port/Publications/publication[ID=The%20House%2 0Magazine]/issue[ID=October%2018%20%201999]/articles/nitf[ID=8] > Q2-I'd like to use some common fragments in several different > documents, preferably without replicating the definition in each DTD. > Can I set up a DTD fragment and then refer to it from within my > document DTD, if so how? [Mark Birbeck] I think XLink may be better. Use an XPath to refer to the nodes you want to include, and then get you server to 'include' the data before it writes out the containing document. Regards, Mark xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From obecker at informatik.hu-berlin.de Fri Oct 29 12:34:48 1999 From: obecker at informatik.hu-berlin.de (Oliver Becker) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: A Plea for Schemas Message-ID: <199910291034.MAA02484@mail.informatik.hu-berlin.de> > http://www.praxisxml.com/praxis_xml.html just a foolish note of mine ... ;-) You're talking about lots of invalid HTML documents on the web. Try http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.praxisxml.com%2Fpraxis_xml.ht ml Don't worry, Oliver /-------------------------------------------------------------------\ | ob|do Dipl.Inf. Oliver Becker | | --+-- E-Mail: obecker@informatik.hu-berlin.de | | op|qo WWW: http://www.informatik.hu-berlin.de/~obecker | \-------------------------------------------------------------------/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From nicmila at vscht.cz Fri Oct 29 13:26:14 1999 From: nicmila at vscht.cz (Miloslav Nic) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: Schematron tutorial Message-ID: <381983FF.316C3484@vscht.cz> I have added three examples (http://zvon.vscht.cz/HTMLonly/SchematronTutorial/General/contents.html): Example 11 If the element has one attribute then it must have the second one as well. Example 12 Value of the attribute is two or three character abbreviation. Example 13 The sum of values of all relevant elements equals 100. Schematron is just unbelievable flexible. I just cannot figure out how to persuade it to produce some beer :-( , but otherwise it is a really nice beast. And the tutorial is now available for download: http://zvon.vscht.cz/ZvonHTML/Downloads/listOfPrograms_en.html -- *************************************************************** Dr. Miloslav Nic e-mail: nicmila@vscht.cz Department of Organic Chemistry TEL: +420 2 2435 5012 ICT Prague (VSCHT Praha) +420 2 2435 4118 FAX: +420 2 2435 4288 **************************************************************** Support free information exchange: http://zvon.vscht.cz **************************************************************** xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From matthew at praxis.cz Fri Oct 29 13:42:00 1999 From: matthew at praxis.cz (Matthew Gertner) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: A Plea for Schemas References: <199910291034.MAA02484@mail.informatik.hu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <381987FB.8AC832B7@praxis.cz> Ouch... I never should have let those graphic designers near my document! ;-) Seriously, I don't see much benefit in publishing valid HTML documents at this point. There's too much junk out there for this to reduce the burden on processing software to deal with faulty HTML. My point was that we need to be vigilant that the same does not happen as people move over to XML-based sites (as we will in the near future -- what was that about the cobbler's children?). Cheers, Matthew Oliver Becker wrote: > > > http://www.praxisxml.com/praxis_xml.html > > just a foolish note of mine ... ;-) > You're talking about lots of invalid HTML documents on the web. > > Try > http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.praxisxml.com%2Fpraxis_xml.ht > ml > > Don't worry, > Oliver xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jon.payne at integral.com Fri Oct 29 13:47:45 1999 From: jon.payne at integral.com (Jon Payne) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:20 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance Message-ID: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF8033829@UKMAIL> Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? ------------------------------------------------------- Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From J.F.D.Hadden at lboro.ac.uk Fri Oct 29 14:01:33 1999 From: J.F.D.Hadden at lboro.ac.uk (Jeremy Hadden) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance References: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF8033829@UKMAIL> Message-ID: <004701bf2205$4dee7fc0$03877d9e@lboro.ac.uk> What exactly do you mean by trade finance? ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Payne To: 'xml-dev@ic.ac.uk' Sent: 29 October 1999 12:46 Subject: XML for trade finance Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? ------------------------------------------------------- Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/837b30ca/attachment.htm From abisheks at india.hp.com Fri Oct 29 14:20:34 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance References: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF8033829@UKMAIL> Message-ID: <01ae01bf2207$d8c30c40$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> A new standard called IFX ( " Interactive Financial Exchange " ) is being developed which specifies a standard format for many finance related messages. check out at http://www.ifxforum.org The XML implementation of this standard is being developed my Microsoft and other companies of this forum. Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Payne To: Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 5:16 PM Subject: XML for trade finance > Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? > > ------------------------------------------------------- > Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 > INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 > http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jon.payne at integral.com Fri Oct 29 14:34:45 1999 From: jon.payne at integral.com (Jon Payne) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance Message-ID: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF803382C@UKMAIL> Unfortunately, it does not cover trade finance -----Original Message----- From: Abhishek Srivastava [mailto:abisheks@india.hp.com] Sent: 29 October 1999 13:19 To: Jon Payne Cc: xml dev mailing list Subject: Re: XML for trade finance A new standard called IFX ( " Interactive Financial Exchange " ) is being developed which specifies a standard format for many finance related messages. check out at http://www.ifxforum.org The XML implementation of this standard is being developed my Microsoft and other companies of this forum. Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Payne To: Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 5:16 PM Subject: XML for trade finance > Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? > > ------------------------------------------------------- > Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 > INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 > http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From J.F.D.Hadden at lboro.ac.uk Fri Oct 29 14:42:18 1999 From: J.F.D.Hadden at lboro.ac.uk (Jeremy Hadden) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance References: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF803382B@UKMAIL> Message-ID: <005a01bf220a$ff98e210$03877d9e@lboro.ac.uk> Do FpML (Financial Products Markup Language) and FinXML (Financial XML) fall into this category ?(sort of?). But I guess that you are aware of these as it was Integral who released the latter. Jeremy Hadden. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/1aa967d2/attachment.htm From clark.evans at manhattanproject.com Fri Oct 29 14:44:18 1999 From: clark.evans at manhattanproject.com (Clark C. Evans) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance In-Reply-To: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF8033829@UKMAIL> Message-ID: XFRML.ORG On Fri, 29 Oct 1999, Jon Payne wrote: > Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From selim.cesic at synes.com Fri Oct 29 14:53:27 1999 From: selim.cesic at synes.com (SeJo) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML tables References: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF8033829@UKMAIL> <004701bf2205$4dee7fc0$03877d9e@lboro.ac.uk> Message-ID: <017901bf220c$8aa62740$1402a8c0@fast.local> Hello, I need to work with (dynamically generated) tables in a very flexible way and am looking for a good starting point. The idea is to keep the table information in XML file while various XSL files (on the server) can influence a final (HTML) output in the Internet Explorer 5 (for now). The main question is how to influence the structure of the table "on the fly" by structuring the XSL file. If someone has experience with that stuff, please contact me or send me some useful links. Thanks. __________________________________ Selim Cesic Synes N.V. Email: Selim.Cesic@synes.com Home: http://www.synes.com __________________________________ ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeremy Hadden To: Jon Payne ; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 2:01 PM Subject: Re: XML for trade finance What exactly do you mean by trade finance? ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Payne To: 'xml-dev@ic.ac.uk' Sent: 29 October 1999 12:46 Subject: XML for trade finance Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? ------------------------------------------------------- Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/b35724f1/attachment.htm From AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net Fri Oct 29 15:18:00 1999 From: AlanM at SYNECTICS.Soft.net (Alan Menezes) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance Message-ID: <1F4436D26763D2119B8800A0C9DE6897954704@MAIL> And are there any standards for XML implementation in Banking ? > -----Original Message----- > From: Abhishek Srivastava [SMTP:abisheks@india.hp.com] > Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 5:49 PM > To: Jon Payne > Cc: xml dev mailing list > Subject: Re: XML for trade finance > > A new standard called IFX ( " Interactive Financial Exchange " ) is being > developed > which specifies a standard format for many finance related messages. > check out at http://www.ifxforum.org > > The XML implementation of this standard is being developed my Microsoft > and > other companies > of this forum. > > Abhishek. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > _/ Abhishek Srivastava > _/ Hewlett Packard ISO > _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- > _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 > _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 > _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage > _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. > You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or > die > - SUN MICROSYSTEMS > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jon Payne > To: > Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 5:16 PM > Subject: XML for trade finance > > > > Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade > finance? > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 > > INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 > > http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 > > > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > > unsubscribe xml-dev > > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following > message; > > subscribe xml-dev-digest > > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > > > > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on > CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following > message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jimson at india.dharma.com Fri Oct 29 15:39:07 1999 From: jimson at india.dharma.com (Jimson K John) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML Loader tools for DBMS Message-ID: Hi, Data Base users will be familiar with Import/Loader tools provided by different DBMS vendors for Loading data into a DBMS from a text file. Is there any tool available from any data base vendors to load the data from XML files ? Does anyone of you know any work towards this direction ? - jimson xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From smuench at us.oracle.com Fri Oct 29 16:10:26 1999 From: smuench at us.oracle.com (Steve Muench) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: XML Loader tools for DBMS References: Message-ID: <014201bf2217$e6f1ed30$4aed1990@us.oracle.com> Jimson, Oracle's XML SQL Utility for Java offers a command-line utility that leverages our XML Save service for doing this. It is not as performant as our bulk-load utility called SQL*Loader, but it may do what you need. More info on the XML SQL Utility at: http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ________________________________________________________ Steve Muench, BC4J Development Team & XML Evangelist http://technet.oracle.com/tech/java http://technet.oracle.com/tech/xml ----- Original Message ----- From: Jimson K John To: Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 5:58 AM Subject: XML Loader tools for DBMS | | Hi, | | Data Base users will be familiar with Import/Loader tools | provided by different DBMS vendors for Loading data into | a DBMS from a text file. Is there any tool available from | any data base vendors to load the data from XML files ? | | Does anyone of you know any work towards this direction ? | | - jimson | | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk | Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 | To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | unsubscribe xml-dev | To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; | subscribe xml-dev-digest | List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) | | xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com Fri Oct 29 16:27:14 1999 From: ypatil at kingston.hummingbird.com (Yogita Patil) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: DOM tree Message-ID: <04f401bf2219$94c41b30$1a02060a@andyne.com> Does anybody know where i can find an example of building a DOM tree or rules to build a DOM tree using the IBM XML4C API ? Thanks, Yogita. Yogita Patil Software Developer Hummingbird Comm. Ltd. Kingston. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/e969f7a8/attachment.htm From clhubert at ttech.org Fri Oct 29 16:47:28 1999 From: clhubert at ttech.org (Cory L Hubert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:21 2004 Subject: xml and servlets In-Reply-To: <65256818.0020503C.00@MAILSERVER2.chennai.tcs.co.in> Message-ID: Any source code? -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of V Arun Kumar Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 10:57 PM To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: xml and servlets i hav a htm page on the client side which triggers a servlet when posted . the servlet gets the information from the client and queries the database and in turn generates a xml file . this xml file is then returned back to the browser and is rendered using a css . here the problem arises i.e it says "servlet not found : *.css" and displays the xml file in an abnormal way could anyone explain it . thanx arun xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From clhubert at ttech.org Fri Oct 29 16:47:17 1999 From: clhubert at ttech.org (Cory L Hubert) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: XML/XSL problems In-Reply-To: <002201bf2185$3a9e8ee0$0900000a@larsgeorge01> Message-ID: Try using the SAXON api http://users.iclway.co.uk/mhkay/saxon/index.html. It's pretty straight forward. If you go to the site you could even download a saxon executable. This way you don't have to do any java programming. All you need to do is supply the xml & xsl documents. -----Original Message----- From: owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk [mailto:owner-xml-dev@ic.ac.uk]On Behalf Of Lars George Sent: Thursday, October 28, 1999 1:44 PM To: Xml-Dev Subject: XML/XSL problems Hi, I just tried to transform some XML files into HTML using different XSL stylesheets. I tried Oracles XML/XSL classes and XT/XP (even the XT standalone Windows executable). The problem I have that whatever I try all I get as an output to the transformation is just the plain XSL file, with just minor changes in it. All that happened is that tags like are transformed into pairs like . But no trace of reading in the XML data, all processing instructions are still the ones from the XSL file. At the end of my efforts I even tried to transform samples from the book "XML Bible". They used XT and also showed what you have to type in to get the results. BUT in my case that did not work either. I still get the plain XSL file instead of a parsed HTML with the data from XML file in it. BTW: The same XSL work if I include them into the XML using a link and then display it with IE5. The result is correct, but only with IE5 not when I use the same samples and the pure Java parsers/processors. Question: What am I doing wrong here? TIA, Lars George Woodgate Research Pty Ltd Brisbane, Australia xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From abisheks at india.hp.com Fri Oct 29 17:27:30 1999 From: abisheks at india.hp.com (Abhishek Srivastava) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: Looking for the valuse of a specific element Message-ID: <003401bf2221$fbfc8a00$252f0a0f@india.hp.com> Hi All, I am searching a document for the value of a specific element. In DOM this may be feasible because we can search the object tree for the element-name and find it's value. how is this done using SAX ? Abhishek. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _/ Abhishek Srivastava _/ Hewlett Packard ISO _/_/_/ _/_/_/ ------------------- _/ / _/ _/ (Work) +91-80-2251554 x1190 _/ _/ _/_/_/ (Ip) 15.10.47.37 _/ (Url) http://sites.netscape.net/abhishes/homepage _/ You've heard it all by now. Get wired or get whacked. You're networking or you're not working. Dot-com or die - SUN MICROSYSTEMS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991029/fdd56031/attachment.htm From jon.payne at integral.com Fri Oct 29 18:09:13 1999 From: jon.payne at integral.com (Jon Payne) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance Message-ID: <3280671C108AD311AA3600A0C9E11AF803382B@UKMAIL> Trade Finance is a generic term, used for denoting the activity associated with defining, controlling and settling the transfer of funds, usually on an international basis, against the delivery of goods. It tends to be extremely 'heavy' in terms of onerous and detailed contractual/documentary requirements, which require review and update, at each stage of potentially a long series of individual steps involved in delivering goods against payment on an international basis. There have been several attempts to standardise the documentation and processes associated with trade finance, some of which I believe are still ongoing, however I am currently unaware of any attempt to use XML as a descriptive mechanism, hence the question.... -----Original Message----- From: Jeremy Hadden [mailto:J.F.D.Hadden@lboro.ac.uk] Sent: 29 October 1999 13:01 To: Jon Payne; xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: XML for trade finance What exactly do you mean by trade finance? ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Payne To: 'xml-dev@ic.ac.uk' Sent: 29 October 1999 12:46 Subject: XML for trade finance Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? ------------------------------------------------------- Jon Payne tel +44-171-330-1132 INTEGRAL DEVELOPMENT CORP. fax +44-171-374-2370 http://www.integral.com mobile +44-7973-393486 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa ( mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk ) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu Fri Oct 29 18:15:17 1999 From: jmcdonou at library.berkeley.edu (Jerome McDonough) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: A Plea for Schemas In-Reply-To: <381987FB.8AC832B7@praxis.cz> References: <199910291034.MAA02484@mail.informatik.hu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <199910291614.MAA27642@westnet.com> For what it's worth (and my opinion and $2.50 will buy you a latte at Starbucks), I agree pretty much completely with your rant (except for the gratuitous dig at the HyTime guys, who History Will Prove Were On The Side of Right). XML doesn't address the problems of interoperability at the level you're talking about, and neither does RDF. What you're talking about, unfortunately, is establishing standardized controlled vocabularies, and those are a ton of work. They're hellish enough to develop in a relatively small, cohesive community like librarians. There's no way in hell you're going to get competing companies to sit down at a table long enough to do this. I suspect what this will probably mean is a variety of grass-roots efforts where people in particular communities who care enough will establish their own schemas with controlled vocabularies, and if they see enough use, software companies that deal with those communities will start altering their software to make use of that fact. I see a possible danger here in that this might start reifying intellectual boundaries between communities and make it harder to search for information outside your common field of intellectual practice. Schema repositories will help this problem somewhat by making schemas for intellectual domains you're not familiar with more generally available, but getting those up and running will also involve a lot of hard work. TANSTAAFL still holds as a universal principle. But for those who really care about trying to achieve interoperability and more open exchange of information, XML will still be used. Jerome McDonough -- jmcdonou@library.Berkeley.EDU | (......) Library Systems Office, 386 Doe, U.C. Berkeley | \ * * / Berkeley, CA 94720-6000 (510) 642-5168 | \ <> / "Well, it looks easy enough...." | \ -- / SGNORMPF!!! -- From the Famous Last Words file | |||| xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From wunder at infoseek.com Fri Oct 29 18:17:58 1999 From: wunder at infoseek.com (Walter Underwood) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19991028094118.00b84af0@corp.infoseek.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991029091555.00be1910@corp.infoseek.com> At 08:14 AM 10/29/99 -0500, Paul wrote: >On Thu, 28 Oct 1999, Walter Underwood wrote: >> It may be that markup is not the right hammer for this problem. >> Our search engine handles multiple DTDs by mapping the elements >> into common search meta data elements. >> >> DC:Creator -> author >> GILS:Originator -> author >> TEI:docAuthor -> author > >That's relatively easy for a flat model, but what about a deeply >hierarchical one? Can you do a search for "address 1" vs. "Street" but >only in "Publisher"? Even more sophisticated, can you recognize that >"name in publisher" is "publisher name"? Nope. To do that, you need an XQL-like engine or a repository. We're aimed at the other 99% of the market. Also, when I was researching published DTDs, nearly all of them qualified the sub-elements or used entirely different names, so that context wasn't necessary: , , , whatever. The only tag that was occasionally reused in different contexts was . There is a heuristic (hack?) to use the first occurance as the title for the results page. A better solution than expecting customers to know XPath, then trying to teach them over the phone. Our house style is to err on the side of simplicity and ease of use, because it almost impossible to remove features, even if they confuse almost everyone and benefit almost no one. I actually spent more time making sure that sentences were extracted properly from things like this (with multiple mappings possible): <title>The <hi type="italic">Ghastly</hi> Happenings at <event><trademark>Infoseek</trademark>'s Halloween Party</event> I've got nothing against complex searches, but they don't benefit our users. In the internet search world, people who type two-word queries are power users. Really. wunder -- Walter R. Underwood wunder@infoseek.com wunder@best.com (home) http://software.infoseek.com/cce/ (my product) http://www.best.com/~wunder/ 1-408-543-6946 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com Fri Oct 29 18:39:32 1999 From: Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com (Gordon, Simon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] Message-ID: -----Original Message----- From: Ken Gentle [mailto:j.kenneth.gentle@acm.org] Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 12:04 To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Subject: Re: CDATA Section [binary data in...] >>At 11:33 AM 10/27/99 -0600, you wrote: >>Remember the XML 1.0 definition: CDATA sections are "used to escape blocks >>of text containing characters which would otherwise be recognized as >>markup". Nothing about this implies including XML-illegal characters. >> >>Re Tim Bray's "CDATA Sections and Binary Data" note: >> http://www.xml.com/axml/notes/CDprob.html >>I've never read this to state that you can put _raw_ binary data in a CDATA >>section. The phrase "When you look at CDATA, you might get the impression >>that you could maybe jam your binary data in a CDATA section. You'd be >>right, but..." may be a little misleading, but do remember that these are >>just explanatory notes that can never be taken to contradict the XML 1.0 >>spec itself! >> >>Yes, base64 is a good method of cramming binary data into a CDATA section, >>just be certain that a "]]" can't appear in the encoded data. > >Can't happen in base64 -- neither "]" nor ">" are legal characters. > >This is precisely how our application is embedding "binary" data in XML >documents: Base64 transfer encoding in a CDATA section. > As Tim says in his annotation, if you use Base64 then you don't need the CDATA section as _none_ of the XML reserved chars appear in the Base64 character set (A-Za-z0-9/+). > > > Ken > >> >>Regards, >> Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. >> Regards, Simon Gordon Systems Engineer, Systems Integration, x5472 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com Fri Oct 29 19:43:41 1999 From: uche.ogbuji at fourthought.com (uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: XML for trade finance Message-ID: <199910291753.LAA01738@localhost.localdomain> >Does anyone know of any initiatives using XML in the field of trade finance? I'd suggest you ask on the XML-EDI group. From the mailing list message footer: ========================================== XML/EDI Group members-only discussion list Homepage = http://www.xmledi.com Brought to you by: Online Technologies Corporation Home of BizServe - www.bizserve.com TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send email to Leave the subject blank, and In the body of the message, enter ONLY: unsubscribe Questions/requests should be sent to: owner-xmledi-list@bizserve.com To join the XML/EDI Group complete the form located at: http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/Floor/5815/mail1.htm -- Uche Ogbuji FourThought LLC, IT Consultants uche.ogbuji@fourthought.com (970)481-0805 Software engineering, project management, Intranets and Extranets http://FourThought.com http://OpenTechnology.org xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From dvint at slip.net Fri Oct 29 20:43:49 1999 From: dvint at slip.net (Dan Vint) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4.1.19991029143935.0099b9e0@pop.slip.net> I've seen reference to base64 many times now, where can I find a spec for this? ..dan At 10:24 AM 10/29/99 -0600, Gordon, Simon wrote: >-----Original Message----- >From: Ken Gentle [mailto:j.kenneth.gentle@acm.org] >Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 12:04 >To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Subject: Re: CDATA Section [binary data in...] > > >>>At 11:33 AM 10/27/99 -0600, you wrote: >>>Remember the XML 1.0 definition: CDATA sections are "used to escape blocks >>>of text containing characters which would otherwise be recognized as >>>markup". Nothing about this implies including XML-illegal characters. >>> >>>Re Tim Bray's "CDATA Sections and Binary Data" note: >>> http://www.xml.com/axml/notes/CDprob.html >>>I've never read this to state that you can put _raw_ binary data in a >CDATA >>>section. The phrase "When you look at CDATA, you might get the impression >>>that you could maybe jam your binary data in a CDATA section. You'd be >>>right, but..." may be a little misleading, but do remember that these are >>>just explanatory notes that can never be taken to contradict the XML 1.0 >>>spec itself! >>> >>>Yes, base64 is a good method of cramming binary data into a CDATA section, >>>just be certain that a "]]" can't appear in the encoded data. >> >>Can't happen in base64 -- neither "]" nor ">" are legal characters. >> >>This is precisely how our application is embedding "binary" data in XML >>documents: Base64 transfer encoding in a CDATA section. >> > >As Tim says in his annotation, if you use Base64 then you don't need the >CDATA section as _none_ of the XML reserved chars appear in the Base64 >character set (A-Za-z0-9/+). >> >> >> Ken >> >>> >>>Regards, >>> Nik O, Teton Data Systems, Jackson, Wyo. >>> > >Regards, > >Simon Gordon >Systems Engineer, >Systems Integration, >x5472 > >xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk >Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN >981-02-3594-1 >To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >unsubscribe xml-dev >To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; >subscribe xml-dev-digest >List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Danny Vint http://www.dvint.com Author: SGML at Work http://www.slip.net/~dvint/pubs/sgmlatwork.shtml mailto:dvint@slip.net Calian Voice:804-975-3482 mailto:d.vint@calian.com Charlottesville, VA Office http://www.calian.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From rhelton at rhythms.net Fri Oct 29 21:07:18 1999 From: rhelton at rhythms.net (rhelton@rhythms.net) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: Are there any IDL to XML parsers and XML to IDL parsers? Message-ID: <916BA3451A99D2118FCC0090272ABD2F01FD3494@caxixi.den.rhythms.net> Rich H. EAI Rhythms App Arch. ext 2913 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From simonstl at simonstl.com Fri Oct 29 21:22:40 1999 From: simonstl at simonstl.com (Simon St.Laurent) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] In-Reply-To: <4.1.19991029143935.0099b9e0@pop.slip.net> References: Message-ID: <199910291922.PAA19332@hesketh.net> At 02:40 PM 10/29/99 -0400, Dan Vint wrote: >I've seen reference to base64 many times now, where can I find a spec for this? Base64 is described in section 6.8 of RFC 2045, normally available at http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2045.txt. (I can't get the URL to open today, though.) Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com Fri Oct 29 22:26:03 1999 From: Simon.Gordon at swi.galileo.com (Gordon, Simon) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: CDATA Section [binary data in...] Message-ID: I found it at : http://www.normos.org/ietf/rfc/rfc2045.txt . Check out pages 23 - 25 Basically the encoder works like this: Base64Table[] = "ABC...abc...1234567890+/" ForEach 24 bits in input stream ForEach 6 bits in 24 bits OutputChar Base64Table[6 bit value] NextFor 6 bits NextFor 24 bits There are special cases when the input stream is not a multiple of 24 bits long (the decoder has to know when to stop so the encoder outputs one or two pad characters "="). The decoder takes the input stream and outputs the corresponding 6 bit values. When it encounters an equals, it commits what bits it has left into a byte, clears the other bits, outputs the resulting byte and stops. Regards, Simon Gordon -----Original Message----- From: Simon St.Laurent [mailto:simonstl@simonstl.com] Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 13:22 To: XML-Dev Mailing list Subject: RE: CDATA Section [binary data in...] At 02:40 PM 10/29/99 -0400, Dan Vint wrote: >I've seen reference to base64 many times now, where can I find a spec for this? Base64 is described in section 6.8 of RFC 2045, normally available at http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2045.txt. (I can't get the URL to open today, though.) Simon St.Laurent XML: A Primer, 2nd Ed. Building XML Applications Inside XML DTDs: Scientific and Technical Sharing Bandwidth / Cookies http://www.simonstl.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From ken_north at compuserve.com Fri Oct 29 22:31:08 1999 From: ken_north at compuserve.com (Ken North) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: XML Loader tools for DBMS References: Message-ID: <001901bf224c$c026f260$0b00a8c0@grissom> Subject: XML Loader tools for DBMS Jimson K John wrote: > Is there any tool available from > any data base vendors to load the data from XML files ? > > Does anyone of you know any work towards this direction ? If feel comfortable programming in Java, watch for the premier issue of XML magazine (www.xmlmag.com). My article includes some Java code for reading an XML file and storing a document as an Oracle column, and vice versa. ================== Ken North ============================= XML One Europe, London, England October 6-8, 1999, http://www.xmlconference.com/xmleuro/index.shtml Java Developer's Conference, San Jose, California October 17-21, 1999 http://www.javadevcon.com XML One Fall, Santa Clara, CA November 8-11, 1999 http://www.xmlconference.com/xmlusa xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From anandram at wipsys.soft.net Sat Oct 30 13:06:30 1999 From: anandram at wipsys.soft.net (Anand Raman) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:22 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace References: <3819335F.F773CE42@wipsys.soft.net> <3819937E.9F1D4610@goon.stg.brown.edu> Message-ID: <381ACFF8.3C574509@wipsys.soft.net> Thanx Richard I ran the file thru the parser and everything worked out just fine .. But still i have the same error message cropping up .. Are there any known bugs with regards to namespaces in IE5. Below is the exact copy of the error message .. Can any one make sense out of it The XML page cannot be displayed Cannot view XML input using style sheet. Please correct the error and then click the Refresh button, or try again later. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Reference to undeclared namespace prefix: 'exp'. Line 56, Position 1 ^ Thanx Bye Anand Raman "Richard L. Goerwitz" wrote: > Anand Raman wrote: > > > > HI guys > > > > I am getting a Reference to undeclared namespace "exp:" error for the > > following code snippet when i try to view the document in IE 5. > > If you want independent confirmation of the files' validity, please > feel free to run your files through out validator - > > http://mama.stg.brown.edu/service/xmlvalid/ > > -- > > Richard Goerwitz > PGP key fingerprint: C1 3E F4 23 7C 33 51 8D 3B 88 53 57 56 0D 38 A0 > For more info (mail, phone, fax no.): finger richard@goon.stg.brown.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991030/b7e12f1f/attachment.htm From tpassin at idsonline.com Sun Oct 31 02:56:34 1999 From: tpassin at idsonline.com (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace References: <3819335F.F773CE42@wipsys.soft.net> <3819937E.9F1D4610@goon.stg.brown.edu> <381ACFF8.3C574509@wipsys.soft.net> Message-ID: <001901bf234b$8c7bb4a0$76fbb1cd@tomshp> Get rid of the "exp:" in the element definitions. They are not part of the element names, they are part of the namespace, which is different. Replace with the following in the DTD: I tested this in IE5 and it worked fine (see below for the correct declaration of the namespace). Also, get rid of the xmlns:exp attribute in the DTD. The namespace declaration is not an ordinary attribute even though it looks like one. Declaring it in the DTD will not cause the experience element to use the exp: namespace. You must include it in the actual element like so: It doesn't matter what the value of the namespace is ("ccc"). Currently there is no mechanism to do anything with the value (except for the xsl: namespace in xslt stylesheets). Thomas Passin From: Anand Raman To: Richard_Goerwitz@Brown.EDU ; XML-DEV Thanx Richard I ran the file thru the parser and everything worked out just fine .. But still i have the same error message cropping up .. Are there any known bugs with regards to namespaces in IE5. Below is the exact copy of the error message .. Can any one make sense out of it The XML page cannot be displayed Cannot view XML input using style sheet. Please correct the error and then click the Refresh button, or try again later. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Reference to undeclared namespace prefix: 'exp'. Line 56, Position 1 ^ Thanx Bye Anand Raman "Richard L. Goerwitz" wrote: Anand Raman wrote: > > HI guys > > I am getting a Reference to undeclared namespace "exp:" error for the > following code snippet when i try to view the document in IE 5. If you want independent confirmation of the files' validity, please feel free to run your files through out validator - http://mama.stg.brown.edu/service/xmlvalid/ -- Richard Goerwitz PGP key fingerprint: C1 3E F4 23 7C 33 51 8D 3B 88 53 57 56 0D 38 A0 For more info (mail, phone, fax no.): finger richard@goon.stg.brown.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.ic.ac.uk/pipermail/xml-dev/attachments/19991031/7bfd9e68/attachment.htm From john.tigue at tigue.com Sun Oct 31 06:19:02 1999 From: john.tigue at tigue.com (John Tigue) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Parameter entities for DTD modularity (was: Re: Multiple docs in 'wrapper') Message-ID: <004701bf236f$ebb73e20$788410d2@mmm.tigue.com> Mark Birbeck wrote: > > Q2-I'd like to use some common fragments in several > > different documents, preferably without replicating > > the definition in each DTD. Can I set up a DTD fragment > > and then refer to it from within my document DTD, if so how? > > [Mark Birbeck] > I think XLink may be better. Use an XPath to refer to the > nodes you want to include, and then get you server to > 'include' the data before it writes out the containing > document. Another alternative could be implemented now based solely on XML 1.0. Consider using external parameter entity references. The DTD "fragment" would get included in the main doc's DTD. See the report entitled "W3C XML Specification DTD" for a well documented case study in the use of parameter entities in XML DTDs: http://www.w3.org/XML/1998/06/xmlspec-report.htm -John xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From john.tigue at tigue.com Sun Oct 31 06:18:03 1999 From: john.tigue at tigue.com (John Tigue) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: multipart/related (was: Re: Multiple docs in 'wrapper') Message-ID: <004501bf236f$c7cb3a70$788410d2@mmm.tigue.com> Mark Birbeck wrote: > Anton Schoultz wrote: > > Q1-Does XML support multiple document types in a file? > > iow could I wrap several invoice docs, a couple of > > statement docs, and a report into one file? > > [Mark Birbeck] > Take a look at the fragment interchange spec, at W3C. > It's very simple but quite good. I agree with Mark. Another alternative, would involve "multipart/related" as defined in RFC2112: The MIME Multipart/Related Content-type http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2112.txt multipart/related is used in RFC 2110: MHTML: MIME E-mail Encapsulation of Aggregate Documents http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2110.txt This technology is also used over HTTP. This RFC is more stable than the fragment interchange spec. -John xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From liamquin at interlog.com Sun Oct 31 07:26:50 1999 From: liamquin at interlog.com (Liam R. E. Quin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Parameter entities for DTD modularity (was: Re: Multiple docs in 'wrapper') In-Reply-To: <004701bf236f$ebb73e20$788410d2@mmm.tigue.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Oct 1999, John Tigue wrote: > Another alternative could be implemented now based solely on > XML 1.0. Consider using external parameter entity references. During the XML design phase, I felt that the SYSTEM (and PUBLIC identifiers in the document type declaration should have been dispened with, ]> is more or less the same (in XML, not SGML) as %theDTD; ]> The extra syntax in the 2nd example is outweighed by the fact you'd probably need inclusions anyway, and having just one syntax is simpler. Furthermore, the first example is confusing: "hosiery.dtd" gets included *after* the declaration of myName in both cases, but you'd think this not to be the case in the first example, unless you had read the spec. The main advantage would be that people would be more familiar with how to include DTD fragments in XML! Most people learn the DOCTYPE/STSTEM method, ad fewer learn the external parameter entity reference. It's too late to remove the featur now, but people writing tutorials and books and examples for XML would do well to consider introducing the second before the first, I think. Lee -- Liam Quin, Barefoot Computing, Toronto; The barefoot agitator l i a m q u i n at i n t e r l o g dot c o m Ankh on irc.sorcery.net http://www.interlog.com/~liamquin/ xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From oren at capella.co.il Sun Oct 31 09:33:58 1999 From: oren at capella.co.il (Oren Ben-Kiki) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: "Multiple" Namespaces? (but NOT for HTML) References: Message-ID: <00ba01bf2381$02545da0$4602a8c0@capella.co.il> John Robert Gardner wrote: > > Heinrich at Humboldt U. in Berlin is dilligently searching the world's > various library resources with his Dublin-Core-Based engine for > Tillich and we want his DC system to transparently find > the wealth of Tillich articles we'd have online. Simultaneously, Alicia > is using a TEI-based search over in Ireland, and wants to find > Tillich, with the same transparency, and Lu in > HongKong has GILS, so Tillich is the formula for > the query. With our multiple namespaces/ArchForms/tagbag (see below) or > whatever, everybody is able to use their native search engine which, in > turn, is able to find the gems of wisdom sought without any additional > tweaking on the user--or library administrators'--end. > > > "Multiple Namespaces" was a suggestion I had in offline discussions, > which, of course, "can't" be done, so I'm hoping, at least, that the > reason for it makes better sense now. Question: Is it absolutely necessary that the search engines will see the data as stored in the database, without any processing? If not, then you could keep your data in whatever format is convenient for you. Provide multiple "entry points" to the database which present it in DC, TEI and whichever other DTDs/Schemas are expected by the outside world. Use XSLT to transform from your internal format to the external format. The only problem with this is the efficiency of doing the conversion. If it is very simple, maybe XSLT is an overkill and a simple 'sed' script would be sufficient. Caching could also help. The cost of conversion might be offset by the fact that the internal format is optimized for your particular searches and semantics. Have fun, Oren Ben-Kiki xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Sun Oct 31 16:03:25 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: multipart/related (was: Re: Multiple docs in 'wrapper') Message-ID: John Tigue wrote: > > Mark Birbeck wrote: > > Anton Schoultz wrote: > > > Q1-Does XML support multiple document types in a file? > > > iow could I wrap several invoice docs, a couple of > > > statement docs, and a report into one file? > > > > [Mark Birbeck] > > Take a look at the fragment interchange spec, at W3C. > > It's very simple but quite good. > > [John Tigue] > I agree with Mark. Another alternative, would involve > "multipart/related" as defined in RFC2112: > > [snip] > I think this mixes two different levels of abstraction. I believe the original question concerned the logical - or nodal - representation of a number of XML 'documents' in one document, in a manner that allows them to be broken apart again easily. Fragments is simple to use for this. The MIME mechanism concerns 'real' documents that need to travel together, but it is operating at a different level. Of course the question might have meant that - in which case the answer is just Xip them up! I may as well make an additional point whilst we're here, concerning the phrasing of the original question. You cannot actually 'mix' different 'document types' in one 'file'. An XML document can only have one root node, and so is only of one document type. You could create your own 'invoice container' doc type if you wanted, which would wrap up invoices, and then another container doc type to wrap up both the invoices and statements. All I'm saying is that the frag spec just gives you a useful place to start when developing a generalised solution. > [John Tigue] > This technology is also used over HTTP. This RFC is > more stable than the fragment interchange spec. As I've said, they address different issues. But note also that the frag spec only has about three elements in it! It's about the simplest spec you're ever likely to see, and if you think about it's purpose it's difficult to imagine how it will change. As the authors say, it will be *built on* by other specs relating to the transportation of fragments, and so on, but it's a very simple foundation. Regards, Mark xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From crism at exemplary.net Sun Oct 31 18:37:19 1999 From: crism at exemplary.net (Christopher R. Maden) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace Message-ID: [Thomas B. Passin] >Get rid of the "exp:" in the element definitions. They are not part of >the element names, they are part of the namespace, which is different. >Replace with the following in the DTD: > >Also, get rid of the xmlns:exp attribute in the DTD. The namespace >declaration is not an ordinary attribute even though it looks like one. >Declaring it in the DTD will not cause the experience element to use the >exp: namespace. You must include it in the actual element >like so: Your examples parse, but do not do what the original questioner was asking about (produce a valid document). DTDs were developed before namespaces, and the two don't play particularly well together; to a DTD, a namespace declaration *is* an attribute. Personally, I wouldn't bother trying to make a namespace document valid; it can be done, but it's a bit difficult. Moreover, I think the original poster was using MSIE 5, which adds the odd quirk that all namespace declarations must be declared in the DTD as #FIXED attributes. Anand, can you post the whole (short) document and DTD, along with MSIE's error? -Chris -- Christopher R. Maden, Solutions Architect Exemplary Technologies One Embarcadero Center, Ste. 2405 San Francisco, CA 94111 xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From tpassin at idsonline.com Sun Oct 31 21:55:56 1999 From: tpassin at idsonline.com (Thomas B. Passin) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace References: Message-ID: <005a01bf23eb$106c8f60$4515b0cf@tomshp> From: Christopher R. Maden Subject: Re: Undeclared namespace > [Thomas B. Passin] > >Get rid of the "exp:" in the element definitions. They are not part of > >the element names, they are part of the namespace, which is different. > >Replace with the following in the DTD: > > > >Also, get rid of the xmlns:exp attribute in the DTD. The namespace > >declaration is not an ordinary attribute even though it looks like one. > >Declaring it in the DTD will not cause the experience element to use the > >exp: namespace. You must include it in the actual element > >like so: > > Your examples parse, but do not do what the original questioner was asking > about (produce a valid document). > The original question was, when the subject XML was tried in IE5 and produced an error, "Why is this error appearing and what can be done to solve it " The "Why" is a combination of my response and IE5 quirks. You can't equate what the parser in IE5 does with complete compliance with the standard. > DTDs were developed before namespaces, and the two don't play particularly > well together; to a DTD, a namespace declaration *is* an attribute. > Personally, I wouldn't bother trying to make a namespace document valid; it I'll go along with that. > can be done, but it's a bit difficult. Moreover, I think the original > poster was using MSIE 5, which adds the odd quirk that all namespace > declarations must be declared in the DTD as #FIXED attributes. > My version of IE5 does not need to have the namespace declared as a #FIXED attribute - it doesn't need it to be declared as an attribute at all. It doesn't mind if it is declared, though. > Anand, can you post the whole (short) document and DTD, along with MSIE's error? > > -Chris > > -- > Christopher R. Maden, Solutions Architect > Exemplary Technologies > One Embarcadero Center, Ste. 2405 > San Francisco, CA 94111 > > > > xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk > Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 > To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > unsubscribe xml-dev > To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; > subscribe xml-dev-digest > List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net Sun Oct 31 23:45:57 1999 From: Mark.Birbeck at iedigital.net (Mark Birbeck) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: Undeclared namespace Message-ID: Thomas B. Passin wrote: > My version of IE5 does not need to have the namespace > declared as a #FIXED attribute Please send me a copy of it, or tell me where you downloaded it from. Just joking, but I disagree, Thomas. This was discussed a while back in relation to XHTML, when I seriously fell out of love with Microsoft. If you convert HTML to nice neat XHTML and then try to use a reference to the DTDs supplied by W3C you get errors. The W3C DTDs do not define the namespace attribute as fixed, and MS in their wisdom have said you must. No-one has explained why, and there is little justification for it, so the only solution is to remove the DTD reference - and of course you no longer technically have valid XHTML!!!!!! Damn. I was doing so well. My therapist is going to be very disappointed. Mark xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk) From khammn at yahoo.com Sun Oct 31 23:55:07 1999 From: khammn at yahoo.com (Kham M Nguyen) Date: Mon Jun 7 17:16:23 2004 Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <19991101000358.14972.rocketmail@web1503.mail.yahoo.com> unsubscribe ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com xml-dev: A list for W3C XML Developers. To post, mailto:xml-dev@ic.ac.uk Archived as: http://www.lists.ic.ac.uk/hypermail/xml-dev/ and on CD-ROM/ISBN 981-02-3594-1 To unsubscribe, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; unsubscribe xml-dev To subscribe to the digests, mailto:majordomo@ic.ac.uk the following message; subscribe xml-dev-digest List coordinator, Henry Rzepa (mailto:rzepa@ic.ac.uk)