Alternatives to the W3C

Len Bullard cbullard at
Wed Jan 19 21:30:46 GMT 2000

Dave Winer wrote:
> OK, here's the deal. I'm a web developer who uses desktop computers to
> create for the web. That's all I care about as far as software is concerned.

Always good to specify a target market.

> I spend half my day using apps other than a web browser. My interest is in
> making those apps work as seamlessly with the web as possible. In practice
> that means reducing the steps to get my job done. That's why editing in the
> web browser is so satisfying. See a mistake on a web page, click Edit This
> Page, make the correction, click on Submit. It can't get any simpler than
> that. 

WYSIWYG is simpler than that.

> This algorithm repeats in every context. It's just like Undo was in
> the early days of graphic apps. The next step is to wire in Notepad,
> Simpletext and Emacs, but the next step after that is to bring the web
> browser into the text editing tools to erase the last seam. 

Why can't you make that step now?  X3D will depend on that because 
editing text (say <p> or even <form>) is one thing but try that 
with a 3D real time animation and see if you don't find yourself 
quickly using a fully rendered world and setting viewpoints that 
way, or do you really like to edit an indexed face set by hand?

> Microsoft was
> barking up the right tree, not too many people get this yet. Even on
> Scripting News where I've been writing about it for two years, people still
> think HTML rendering is a thing separate from using a computer. To ignore
> the web browser is to ignore where most of the creativity and intellect are
> going these days. 

Equating an HTML web browser with the web, then equating that with where 
most of the creativity and intellect are at seem to be pretty big
It isn't true.  Simply and directly:  building a set of forms with HTML
to do what 
can be done easily and quickly with MSAccess without HTML is makes the 
app inefficient and hamstrings the customer unnecessarily.   In many 
cases, it is better to embed the browser object for some form
some display operations, and use other objects elsewhere.  Build a 
iframe page that is as efficient as an Access embedded form and do 
recordset navigation with it without using the objects provided for 
that.  Now, keep that app running for a few generations of dllHell. 

> That's the other reason I do the web. Without a web
> browser there are no web sites. Sorry for rambling, hope this makes sense to
> someone out there. Dave

It makes sense.  We aren't quibbling that a web browser of some kind is 
needed, but is it TheWebBrowser (ie, the XHTML centric one), or just a 
content handler that knows HTTP and has an API for scripting?


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